Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 8th grader is in honors Algebra and has a C-. She got pass advanced on the SOL.

The teacher gives very short tests, and tests are almost the entire grade. SO all the classwork, homework, quizzes makes very little difference. If a test has five questions, and you miss one, that's an 80%. There is no handwritten calculations turned in like in the olden times, so the kids don't get partial credit for getting some of the steps correct. Its just a right or wrong multiple choice. Frankly, obviously, I don't think its great for the kids.

This is how it is for my DD with the D. Homework and classwork counts for almost nothing. Tests are online and graded entirely answer only so any little mistake results in full loss of credit.

When my current 11th grader took Algebra in middle school, tests were all on paper and work had to be shown. Work was graded and feedback was given. Partial credit was also given. Now it’s all full credit or zero and computer graded. Is it like this at every school now?

in china, either you know it or you don't. no partial credit. the main difference, china teachers grade everything--no computer score give your baby grade.

No one cares about what happens in third world countries.

+1 Especially Communist ones.

Anonymous wrote:I answered this question on a different discussion. But to restate I said there, if you’re a 7th grader taking algebra the only option for you in FCPS would be taking algebra honers. Now, algebra as an honers class vs algebra are very different. Algebra honers is MUCH harder than regular algebra. The SOL Alg hnrs kids are taking is the regular algebra sol, not the honers one, so the SOL is much easier than what the kids have been doing all year. Plus, your DC will have a desmos graphing calculator the whole time. In most SOLs there are calculator/no calculator sections, but in the Algebra SOL you get not just a calculator but a graphing one the entire test, so your child could quite literally plug everything in the calculator. DDs teacher said it’s the easiest SOL if you’re taking Algebra Honers.

Hope you are stronger in math than you are in English.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 8th grader is in honors Algebra and has a C-. She got pass advanced on the SOL.

The teacher gives very short tests, and tests are almost the entire grade. SO all the classwork, homework, quizzes makes very little difference. If a test has five questions, and you miss one, that's an 80%. There is no handwritten calculations turned in like in the olden times, so the kids don't get partial credit for getting some of the steps correct. Its just a right or wrong multiple choice. Frankly, obviously, I don't think its great for the kids.

This sounds awesome imo. Showing your work and getting partial credit is obnoxious for advanced students. If you know the answer you should get points. If you don't know the answer you shouldn't get points. Makes perfect sense to me.

Also, those who take algebra in 7th or 6th grade are on an advanced track so should be expected to score higher on an SOL.

Weird, because the math competition teachers my child has had forces the kids to show their work and write an explination for why they solved it the way that they did. The TJ math/science prompt requires the kids to show their work and write an explination for why they solved the problem the way that they did. The international math competitions and high school math competitions require that kids write out their answers and provide explinations.

Your kid, and you, are wrong. Math is not just about getting the correct answer, it is about understanding and demonstrating that you know how to get the correct answer. If your child wants to do well in math, they need to get used to showing their work. It is common practice in the discipline.

I understand that it is common practice but disagree that it is neccessary. Showing work allows the teacher to help when they make a mistake. If they get the right answer without mistakes then its a waste of time.

Most people need that scaffolding but there are plenty of kids who dont. And smart kids who get the answer easily but have no interest in math competitions or math for fun, they just want to prove they know the material and get their A, dont benefit from showing work.

Then you don’t understand. Higher level math absolutely requires showing your work because it shows your thought process. Math quickly moves beyond learning the algorithm to get the correct answer into problems with multiple approaches, some more elegant than others.

Showing your work in Algebra and Geometry and the like prepares students for higher level math when they 100% shows their work. I promise you, the HS students on the International Math Olympiad team have been showing their work for a long, long time.

Anonymous wrote:My 7th grader took the Algebra 1 SOL last and got 600 (last year, kid is in 8th grade this year). I found out last night that they didn't solve 1 problem on the test and just used Desmos to find the answers for all the questions. I don't know whether to pat him on the back or be genuinely freaked out about this. He's gone on to Geo HN this year and again got 600 on the SOL but said Desmos doesn't help much with Geo. I think those who get 600 on the SOLs are able to use Desmos very efficiently.

If you look at the practice sets, sure, you can use Desmos on a lot of them. But you have to understand what the problem means and how to set it up to know what to enter into the calculator. That’s the task.

My 7th grader took the Algebra 1 SOL last and got 600 (last year, kid is in 8th grade this year). I found out last night that they didn't solve 1 problem on the test and just used Desmos to find the answers for all the questions. I don't know whether to pat him on the back or be genuinely freaked out about this. He's gone on to Geo HN this year and again got 600 on the SOL but said Desmos doesn't help much with Geo. I think those who get 600 on the SOLs are able to use Desmos very efficiently.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 8th grader is in honors Algebra and has a C-. She got pass advanced on the SOL.

The teacher gives very short tests, and tests are almost the entire grade. SO all the classwork, homework, quizzes makes very little difference. If a test has five questions, and you miss one, that's an 80%. There is no handwritten calculations turned in like in the olden times, so the kids don't get partial credit for getting some of the steps correct. Its just a right or wrong multiple choice. Frankly, obviously, I don't think its great for the kids.

This sounds awesome imo. Showing your work and getting partial credit is obnoxious for advanced students. If you know the answer you should get points. If you don't know the answer you shouldn't get points. Makes perfect sense to me.

Also, those who take algebra in 7th or 6th grade are on an advanced track so should be expected to score higher on an SOL.

Weird, because the math competition teachers my child has had forces the kids to show their work and write an explination for why they solved it the way that they did. The TJ math/science prompt requires the kids to show their work and write an explination for why they solved the problem the way that they did. The international math competitions and high school math competitions require that kids write out their answers and provide explinations.

Your kid, and you, are wrong. Math is not just about getting the correct answer, it is about understanding and demonstrating that you know how to get the correct answer. If your child wants to do well in math, they need to get used to showing their work. It is common practice in the discipline.

I understand that it is common practice but disagree that it is neccessary. Showing work allows the teacher to help when they make a mistake. If they get the right answer without mistakes then its a waste of time.

Most people need that scaffolding but there are plenty of kids who dont. And smart kids who get the answer easily but have no interest in math competitions or math for fun, they just want to prove they know the material and get their A, dont benefit from showing work.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 8th grader is in honors Algebra and has a C-. She got pass advanced on the SOL.

The teacher gives very short tests, and tests are almost the entire grade. SO all the classwork, homework, quizzes makes very little difference. If a test has five questions, and you miss one, that's an 80%. There is no handwritten calculations turned in like in the olden times, so the kids don't get partial credit for getting some of the steps correct. Its just a right or wrong multiple choice. Frankly, obviously, I don't think its great for the kids.

This sounds awesome imo. Showing your work and getting partial credit is obnoxious for advanced students. If you know the answer you should get points. If you don't know the answer you shouldn't get points. Makes perfect sense to me.

Also, those who take algebra in 7th or 6th grade are on an advanced track so should be expected to score higher on an SOL.

Weird, because the math competition teachers my child has had forces the kids to show their work and write an explination for why they solved it the way that they did. The TJ math/science prompt requires the kids to show their work and write an explination for why they solved the problem the way that they did. The international math competitions and high school math competitions require that kids write out their answers and provide explinations.

Your kid, and you, are wrong. Math is not just about getting the correct answer, it is about understanding and demonstrating that you know how to get the correct answer. If your child wants to do well in math, they need to get used to showing their work. It is common practice in the discipline.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 8th grader is in honors Algebra and has a C-. She got pass advanced on the SOL.

The teacher gives very short tests, and tests are almost the entire grade. SO all the classwork, homework, quizzes makes very little difference. If a test has five questions, and you miss one, that's an 80%. There is no handwritten calculations turned in like in the olden times, so the kids don't get partial credit for getting some of the steps correct. Its just a right or wrong multiple choice. Frankly, obviously, I don't think its great for the kids.

This is how it is for my DD with the D. Homework and classwork counts for almost nothing. Tests are online and graded entirely answer only so any little mistake results in full loss of credit.

When my current 11th grader took Algebra in middle school, tests were all on paper and work had to be shown. Work was graded and feedback was given. Partial credit was also given. Now it’s all full credit or zero and computer graded. Is it like this at every school now?

in china, either you know it or you don't. no partial credit. the main difference, china teachers grade everything--no computer score give your baby grade.

No one cares about what happens in third world countries.

Yet here you are because your kid cannot pass Algebra 1.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Per my ds, more 7th graders than 8th graders seem to get 600s. In his algebra class there were 2 600s, both 7th graders. In his friend’s class there were 3 600s, also all 7th graders.

Presumably that’s because if you’re in algebra in 7th you’ve been shown to have an aptitude for math. If you’re in algebra in 8th you’re just average .

This is a bunch of hogwash. If you are in Algebra in 7th then you have been already taught things a year ago and have had some exposure to more concepts because you were one year accelerated and many have also been supplemented by RSM, AOPS, Kumon, and Mathnasium. While kids taking Algebra in 8th have not been exposed to as many concepts and are working to double up on many concepts as a catchup. But, your over generalization about math aptitude is completely unfounded.

Exactly. A whole bunch of parents accelerate their kids regardless just because they want to nudge them into certain careers/schools. It's hardly a revelation. The entire school system here is all about "parent olympics" and who is pushing their kids from earlier age to do more things. There would not be tutoring centers of every kind in literally every other strip mall in NOVA otherwise, and this doesn't even cover private tutoring which is rampant in Fairfax country schools. People who move from other school systems or metro areas and aren't familiar with this are struggling because they don't know how to play the game or do not have resources to play it.

Of course, schools themselves do absolutely nothing to help kids, because everything is parent driven. But then it reflects poorly on schools when many kids get C-D averages, so SOL is supposed to showcase "proficiency" across the board to make up for the failure of this "tiger parent driven" school system to actually teach kids whose parents cannot teach them ahead, don't have resources for tutoring or time to be their kid's personal assistant

Anonymous wrote:7th grade Alg 1 Honors are very strong students. Then you have the Desmos graphing calculator which will give you all the answers you need without having to the know the math. There will be a decent amount of pass advanced and 600s.

My school literally have D and F algebra students who can pass because teachers are incentivized to teach Desmos calculator tricks.

It's crazy what you can do in Desmos. You don't need to understand Algebra at all. It would have been considered cheating when I was a student,

SOL scores don't go anywhere, so, the only thing that matters for the transcript is the actual grade your kid gets, that would follow your kid into HS since Algebra I is considered a HS course. There is obviously very different purpose for these SOL tests that have not much t do with individual child and transcripts they will get at the end.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Per my ds, more 7th graders than 8th graders seem to get 600s. In his algebra class there were 2 600s, both 7th graders. In his friend’s class there were 3 600s, also all 7th graders.

Presumably that’s because if you’re in algebra in 7th you’ve been shown to have an aptitude for math. If you’re in algebra in 8th you’re just average .

This is a bunch of hogwash. If you are in Algebra in 7th then you have been already taught things a year ago and have had some exposure to more concepts because you were one year accelerated and many have also been supplemented by RSM, AOPS, Kumon, and Mathnasium. While kids taking Algebra in 8th have not been exposed to as many concepts and are working to double up on many concepts as a catchup. But, your over generalization about math aptitude is completely unfounded.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 8th grader is in honors Algebra and has a C-. She got pass advanced on the SOL.

The teacher gives very short tests, and tests are almost the entire grade. SO all the classwork, homework, quizzes makes very little difference. If a test has five questions, and you miss one, that's an 80%. There is no handwritten calculations turned in like in the olden times, so the kids don't get partial credit for getting some of the steps correct. Its just a right or wrong multiple choice. Frankly, obviously, I don't think its great for the kids.

This is how it is for my DD with the D. Homework and classwork counts for almost nothing. Tests are online and graded entirely answer only so any little mistake results in full loss of credit.

When my current 11th grader took Algebra in middle school, tests were all on paper and work had to be shown. Work was graded and feedback was given. Partial credit was also given. Now it’s all full credit or zero and computer graded. Is it like this at every school now?

in china, either you know it or you don't. no partial credit. the main difference, china teachers grade everything--no computer score give your baby grade.

What does this mean?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 8th grader is in honors Algebra and has a C-. She got pass advanced on the SOL.

The teacher gives very short tests, and tests are almost the entire grade. SO all the classwork, homework, quizzes makes very little difference. If a test has five questions, and you miss one, that's an 80%. There is no handwritten calculations turned in like in the olden times, so the kids don't get partial credit for getting some of the steps correct. Its just a right or wrong multiple choice. Frankly, obviously, I don't think its great for the kids.

This is how it is for my DD with the D. Homework and classwork counts for almost nothing. Tests are online and graded entirely answer only so any little mistake results in full loss of credit.

When my current 11th grader took Algebra in middle school, tests were all on paper and work had to be shown. Work was graded and feedback was given. Partial credit was also given. Now it’s all full credit or zero and computer graded. Is it like this at every school now?

Really? My DDs math teacher is really good, so I guess it depends on that. She has an A atm, but her teacher has given a lot of extra credit on tests and the final exam. Tests are on paper, and there is partial credit and bonuses on the test and outside the test (making a math vid related to taylor swift or something) Work is graded + feedback is given too, so it’s definitely not like your experience at every school… it really depends on the teachers way of teaching. I think it may be the difference of aap vs non? My child goes to a non. Then again, I could be incorrect.

Ugh, that's horrifying. That's why kids try to jump up to honors algebra 2 ("But I had a 99.5 in algebra 1!") despite getting Bs and below on the actual, critical material. We do a LOT of remediating of kids who think they know algebra when they get to algebra 2, because their grades were supported with so much fluff.

Anonymous wrote:My 8th grader is in honors Algebra and has a C-. She got pass advanced on the SOL.

The teacher gives very short tests, and tests are almost the entire grade. SO all the classwork, homework, quizzes makes very little difference. If a test has five questions, and you miss one, that's an 80%. There is no handwritten calculations turned in like in the olden times, so the kids don't get partial credit for getting some of the steps correct. Its just a right or wrong multiple choice. Frankly, obviously, I don't think its great for the kids.

This sounds awesome imo. Showing your work and getting partial credit is obnoxious for advanced students. If you know the answer you should get points. If you don't know the answer you shouldn't get points. Makes perfect sense to me.

Also, those who take algebra in 7th or 6th grade are on an advanced track so should be expected to score higher on an SOL.