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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP: before you just shotgun lottery applications, please at least try to learn a little about the pedagogy of the options. This actually matters. For example, you can get to ATS and get homework when you don’t believe in it for your kid (has happened). Or in immersion you may have to supplement over the summer if Spanish isn’t spoken at home (has happened). There are people who pray to God and sacrifice limbs to get into schools and then leave after a few years because they shockingly learned there was a pedagogy that didn’t fit their kid.

I understand how Montessori and Claremont/Key are different, but what about ATS and Campbell?

Like, ATS gives homework… That’s the difference? Learning that they still rely on Dreambox/Lexia is kind of shocking.

They also have to tuck in their shirts, or at least used to. There's really no reason for ATS to exist in it's current form, they've hinted at changing it to something like IB or eliminating it entirely. So far no one has been brave enough to follow through.

They stopped tucking in shirts a while ago. Sounds like there’s really not much of a difference at all.

My current seventh grader had to tuck in his shirt as of fifth grade. They also had homework which other AP elementary schools don’t do as a regular practice(or at least they are not supposed to) there is a weekly assembly and every class does some sort of performance at some point.

Well, they don’t tuck in shirts now. Yes, they have a sliver of homework. Could be more IMO, but better than nothing.

Do we really think a weekly assembly sets it apart that much?

Much bigger question: do ATS graduates out-perform their non-ATS peers in middle and high school?

ATS SN, ESL and low-income outperform those categories at all neighborhood schools. There's a person who makes the above point all the time and they are not an ATS family. It also doubles literacy times in the early years which you can't know unless you had a kid at both neighborhood school and ATS for K and 1.

OP: It's an actual crap shoot. Your chances of getting into ATS are between 0-4% b/c there's sib preference. Some years, sibs fill all classes. The year my kid got in, there were 14 non sib seats. If imersion is your thing, ppl love key.

They outperform other students *while in elementary*. But there’s no evidence showing that they outperform their peers when they are in middle school.

As a matter of fact, I know many former ATS students who are pretty mediocre when they’re in MS.

So you hate HB and ATS equally? Nice. I'm sorry you didn't win any lotterys. Try AT or is your kid not able to cut it?

You know as well as I do that there's no data to support your assertion that ATS kids don't do better in high-school than other kids.

You need to go back and read what I wrote again. I never said that ATS graduates “dont do better” (lol) in high school than other kids.

I AM saying there’s no evidence supporting they outperform their peers when they are in MS or HS. (And, anecdotally, I know a few who are struggling with poor math grades in MS. But that’s a very small sample size and probably speaks more to their parenting than elementary prep.)

APS should track academic performance of option school graduates throughout MS and HS, and scrap them if the students aren’t outperforming their peers.

And HB just needs to go. Or turn it into an alternative school — a place for disruptive students to go when they demonstrate they can’t behave in a typical classroom. Now THAT would benefit everyone.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP: before you just shotgun lottery applications, please at least try to learn a little about the pedagogy of the options. This actually matters. For example, you can get to ATS and get homework when you don’t believe in it for your kid (has happened). Or in immersion you may have to supplement over the summer if Spanish isn’t spoken at home (has happened). There are people who pray to God and sacrifice limbs to get into schools and then leave after a few years because they shockingly learned there was a pedagogy that didn’t fit their kid.

I understand how Montessori and Claremont/Key are different, but what about ATS and Campbell?

Like, ATS gives homework… That’s the difference? Learning that they still rely on Dreambox/Lexia is kind of shocking.

They also have to tuck in their shirts, or at least used to. There's really no reason for ATS to exist in it's current form, they've hinted at changing it to something like IB or eliminating it entirely. So far no one has been brave enough to follow through.

They stopped tucking in shirts a while ago. Sounds like there’s really not much of a difference at all.

My current seventh grader had to tuck in his shirt as of fifth grade. They also had homework which other AP elementary schools don’t do as a regular practice(or at least they are not supposed to) there is a weekly assembly and every class does some sort of performance at some point.

Well, they don’t tuck in shirts now. Yes, they have a sliver of homework. Could be more IMO, but better than nothing.

Do we really think a weekly assembly sets it apart that much?

Much bigger question: do ATS graduates out-perform their non-ATS peers in middle and high school?

ATS SN, ESL and low-income outperform those categories at all neighborhood schools. There's a person who makes the above point all the time and they are not an ATS family. It also doubles literacy times in the early years which you can't know unless you had a kid at both neighborhood school and ATS for K and 1.

OP: It's an actual crap shoot. Your chances of getting into ATS are between 0-4% b/c there's sib preference. Some years, sibs fill all classes. The year my kid got in, there were 14 non sib seats. If imersion is your thing, ppl love key.

They outperform other students *while in elementary*. But there’s no evidence showing that they outperform their peers when they are in middle school.

As a matter of fact, I know many former ATS students who are pretty mediocre when they’re in MS.

So you hate HB and ATS equally? Nice. I'm sorry you didn't win any lotterys. Try AT or is your kid not able to cut it?

You know as well as I do that there's no data to support your assertion that ATS kids don't do better in high-school than other kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No personal experience with ATS, but it’s my understanding that they were teaching reading using Science of Reading backed methods when most of APS was using Lucy Calkins’ flawed methods and had better reading outcomes. I don’t know about now, since all of APS switched methods.

Nope. ATS teacher confirmed they used reading and writing workshop, too. Maybe they still had them do a bit of phonics, but even they gave into the Lucy Calkins crap.

They had to use it b/c Syphanx said they had to but they also had phonics, "old school style" for the same amount of time, so double literacy.

Anonymous wrote:Look, if someone doesn't want to send their kid to any particular school within APS, I am fine with that. They know their kids best. Different kids are different and will perform best in different schools.

The chronic DCUM bashing of this or that option school is silly and not helpful. If one of the option schools does a poor job then over time fewer parents will apply. Why should one care what choices other folks make? It's a free country.

The reality that some option schools are getting more and more competitive for entry over time says those schools are doing a good job on things parents care about.

No, it just means the SA schools are getting worse. Most NA families don’t even apply to ATS.

Look, if someone doesn't want to send their kid to any particular school within APS, I am fine with that. They know their kids best. Different kids are different and will perform best in different schools.

The chronic DCUM bashing of this or that option school is silly and not helpful. If one of the option schools does a poor job then over time fewer parents will apply. Why should one care what choices other folks make? It's a free country.

The reality that some option schools are getting more and more competitive for entry over time says those schools are doing a good job on things parents care about.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP: before you just shotgun lottery applications, please at least try to learn a little about the pedagogy of the options. This actually matters. For example, you can get to ATS and get homework when you don’t believe in it for your kid (has happened). Or in immersion you may have to supplement over the summer if Spanish isn’t spoken at home (has happened). There are people who pray to God and sacrifice limbs to get into schools and then leave after a few years because they shockingly learned there was a pedagogy that didn’t fit their kid.

I understand how Montessori and Claremont/Key are different, but what about ATS and Campbell?

Like, ATS gives homework… That’s the difference? Learning that they still rely on Dreambox/Lexia is kind of shocking.

They also have to tuck in their shirts, or at least used to. There's really no reason for ATS to exist in it's current form, they've hinted at changing it to something like IB or eliminating it entirely. So far no one has been brave enough to follow through.

They stopped tucking in shirts a while ago. Sounds like there’s really not much of a difference at all.

My current seventh grader had to tuck in his shirt as of fifth grade. They also had homework which other AP elementary schools don’t do as a regular practice(or at least they are not supposed to) there is a weekly assembly and every class does some sort of performance at some point.

Well, they don’t tuck in shirts now. Yes, they have a sliver of homework. Could be more IMO, but better than nothing.

Do we really think a weekly assembly sets it apart that much?

Much bigger question: do ATS graduates out-perform their non-ATS peers in middle and high school?

ATS SN, ESL and low-income outperform those categories at all neighborhood schools. There's a person who makes the above point all the time and they are not an ATS family. It also doubles literacy times in the early years which you can't know unless you had a kid at both neighborhood school and ATS for K and 1.

OP: It's an actual crap shoot. Your chances of getting into ATS are between 0-4% b/c there's sib preference. Some years, sibs fill all classes. The year my kid got in, there were 14 non sib seats. If imersion is your thing, ppl love key.

They outperform other students *while in elementary*. But there’s no evidence showing that they outperform their peers when they are in middle school.

As a matter of fact, I know many former ATS students who are pretty mediocre when they’re in MS.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP: before you just shotgun lottery applications, please at least try to learn a little about the pedagogy of the options. This actually matters. For example, you can get to ATS and get homework when you don’t believe in it for your kid (has happened). Or in immersion you may have to supplement over the summer if Spanish isn’t spoken at home (has happened). There are people who pray to God and sacrifice limbs to get into schools and then leave after a few years because they shockingly learned there was a pedagogy that didn’t fit their kid.

I understand how Montessori and Claremont/Key are different, but what about ATS and Campbell?

Like, ATS gives homework… That’s the difference? Learning that they still rely on Dreambox/Lexia is kind of shocking.

They also have to tuck in their shirts, or at least used to. There's really no reason for ATS to exist in it's current form, they've hinted at changing it to something like IB or eliminating it entirely. So far no one has been brave enough to follow through.

They stopped tucking in shirts a while ago. Sounds like there’s really not much of a difference at all.

My current seventh grader had to tuck in his shirt as of fifth grade. They also had homework which other AP elementary schools don’t do as a regular practice(or at least they are not supposed to) there is a weekly assembly and every class does some sort of performance at some point.

Well, they don’t tuck in shirts now. Yes, they have a sliver of homework. Could be more IMO, but better than nothing.

Do we really think a weekly assembly sets it apart that much?

Much bigger question: do ATS graduates out-perform their non-ATS peers in middle and high school?

ATS SN, ESL and low-income outperform those categories at all neighborhood schools. There's a person who makes the above point all the time and they are not an ATS family. It also doubles literacy times in the early years which you can't know unless you had a kid at both neighborhood school and ATS for K and 1.

OP: It's an actual crap shoot. Your chances of getting into ATS are between 0-4% b/c there's sib preference. Some years, sibs fill all classes. The year my kid got in, there were 14 non sib seats. If imersion is your thing, ppl love key.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP: before you just shotgun lottery applications, please at least try to learn a little about the pedagogy of the options. This actually matters. For example, you can get to ATS and get homework when you don’t believe in it for your kid (has happened). Or in immersion you may have to supplement over the summer if Spanish isn’t spoken at home (has happened). There are people who pray to God and sacrifice limbs to get into schools and then leave after a few years because they shockingly learned there was a pedagogy that didn’t fit their kid.

I understand how Montessori and Claremont/Key are different, but what about ATS and Campbell?

Like, ATS gives homework… That’s the difference? Learning that they still rely on Dreambox/Lexia is kind of shocking.

The school system makes them. I tried everything to get my kid excused from them b/c they were so frustrating. Didn't work.

Another parent with a second kid almost done with one of the "undesirable" elementary schools (although the reputation of ours seems to have improved over the last 7-8 years). It really does depend on the school and you need to talk with families who have kids there and preferably those who have had kids go all the way through. We've been extremely happy at our title 1 school that has low test scores. Both kids have thrived. I was told by multiple people that my children would get a subpar education and that I was making horrible choices (this was way pre-covid). My child now in middle school is getting straight As and taking some intensified classes and is very happy. My child with an IEP has been given a lot of suport and attention and has been offered services that I hear about families having to fight for at the more "desirable" schools. Just food for thought.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP: before you just shotgun lottery applications, please at least try to learn a little about the pedagogy of the options. This actually matters. For example, you can get to ATS and get homework when you don’t believe in it for your kid (has happened). Or in immersion you may have to supplement over the summer if Spanish isn’t spoken at home (has happened). There are people who pray to God and sacrifice limbs to get into schools and then leave after a few years because they shockingly learned there was a pedagogy that didn’t fit their kid.

I understand how Montessori and Claremont/Key are different, but what about ATS and Campbell?

Like, ATS gives homework… That’s the difference? Learning that they still rely on Dreambox/Lexia is kind of shocking.

They also have to tuck in their shirts, or at least used to. There's really no reason for ATS to exist in it's current form, they've hinted at changing it to something like IB or eliminating it entirely. So far no one has been brave enough to follow through.

They stopped tucking in shirts a while ago. Sounds like there’s really not much of a difference at all.

My current seventh grader had to tuck in his shirt as of fifth grade. They also had homework which other AP elementary schools don’t do as a regular practice(or at least they are not supposed to) there is a weekly assembly and every class does some sort of performance at some point.

Well, they don’t tuck in shirts now. Yes, they have a sliver of homework. Could be more IMO, but better than nothing.

Do we really think a weekly assembly sets it apart that much?

Much bigger question: do ATS graduates out-perform their non-ATS peers in middle and high school?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP: before you just shotgun lottery applications, please at least try to learn a little about the pedagogy of the options. This actually matters. For example, you can get to ATS and get homework when you don’t believe in it for your kid (has happened). Or in immersion you may have to supplement over the summer if Spanish isn’t spoken at home (has happened). There are people who pray to God and sacrifice limbs to get into schools and then leave after a few years because they shockingly learned there was a pedagogy that didn’t fit their kid.

I understand how Montessori and Claremont/Key are different, but what about ATS and Campbell?

Like, ATS gives homework… That’s the difference? Learning that they still rely on Dreambox/Lexia is kind of shocking.

They also have to tuck in their shirts, or at least used to. There's really no reason for ATS to exist in it's current form, they've hinted at changing it to something like IB or eliminating it entirely. So far no one has been brave enough to follow through.

IB for elementary school???

The IB primary years program is at Randolph. I’m not sure if you can still transfer in for it but when I worked there you could.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP: before you just shotgun lottery applications, please at least try to learn a little about the pedagogy of the options. This actually matters. For example, you can get to ATS and get homework when you don’t believe in it for your kid (has happened). Or in immersion you may have to supplement over the summer if Spanish isn’t spoken at home (has happened). There are people who pray to God and sacrifice limbs to get into schools and then leave after a few years because they shockingly learned there was a pedagogy that didn’t fit their kid.

I understand how Montessori and Claremont/Key are different, but what about ATS and Campbell?

Like, ATS gives homework… That’s the difference? Learning that they still rely on Dreambox/Lexia is kind of shocking.

They also have to tuck in their shirts, or at least used to. There's really no reason for ATS to exist in it's current form, they've hinted at changing it to something like IB or eliminating it entirely. So far no one has been brave enough to follow through.

They stopped tucking in shirts a while ago. Sounds like there’s really not much of a difference at all.

My current seventh grader had to tuck in his shirt as of fifth grade. They also had homework which other AP elementary schools don’t do as a regular practice(or at least they are not supposed to) there is a weekly assembly and every class does some sort of performance at some point.

Anonymous wrote:No personal experience with ATS, but it’s my understanding that they were teaching reading using Science of Reading backed methods when most of APS was using Lucy Calkins’ flawed methods and had better reading outcomes. I don’t know about now, since all of APS switched methods.

Nope. ATS teacher confirmed they used reading and writing workshop, too. Maybe they still had them do a bit of phonics, but even they gave into the Lucy Calkins crap.

No personal experience with ATS, but it’s my understanding that they were teaching reading using Science of Reading backed methods when most of APS was using Lucy Calkins’ flawed methods and had better reading outcomes. I don’t know about now, since all of APS switched methods.

Anonymous wrote:If we had gotten in to ATS, we would not have switched to private. It is elementary school in a more “old school” style and it would have worked well for our kids. I understand it might not have worked as well for some other kids, so go with best fit school for your kids.

If ATS were not getting a bunch of things right, and if it really were just like other APS elementary schools, then there would not be so much demand for ATS and such along waiting list to get in to ATS.

Tell me, specifically, what’s so “old school” about it. They still rely heavily on Dreambox and Lexia. They don’t tuck in shirts.

It USED to be old school, and you can read thousands of posts and comments on here from people who assume it is the same.

It’s the best slice of government cheese, but it’s still… government cheese.