Anonymous wrote:OP here. Because he doesn’t have friends who are uber academic, he doesn’t get how much dedication it takes. He has the intellectual ability. He got overconfident after first year with all As. Then he signed up for tough courses second year but studied with his good ball friends. This semester GPA now 3.3. Not one A in a science course. No Cs though.

What college has bunches of kids who are not academic? Why are they there? Look my spouse is a doctor and is a first gen from a blue collar family. Lots of doctors come from a blue collar background. In fact now that i think about it the best friend is also blue collar originsand went to Harvard Law.
This was all from a top 10 private. Blue collar is not the problem, it is your kid’s lack of motivation to investigate what it takes, and also the peers at the college sound unmotivated academically. Some wealthy kids are that way, though in my experience unmotivated in college is very rare or was at my school and is rare at my kids(ivy, uva).

Anonymous wrote:He could be a paramedic / nursing assistant / nurse
there's plenty of jobs in the medical universe with the chance of progression and they don't all start with DOCTOR.

I have been in hospital enough times to recognize the talented people versus the untalented ones. Sometimes its the nurse practitioners who are the ones spotting the details and saving the lives.

Physician Assistant (PA) or pharmacy are other possibilities.

If your son really wants med school, he might need to transfer somewhere else where he can get personal attention from instructors but that still has a good track record with placing kids for medical school.
I would also reflect on whether his SATs suggest he is likely to do well on MCATs. Is he aware that to be competitive he should be working/volunteering/researching in related areas as an undergrad? Hundreds of hours will be needed for his resume.

Many kids leave the pre-med track due to grades. It's kind of typical. There are many other health-related professions as noted above.

It might be more useful if the two of you looked for books, resources, and especially YouTube videos about further education, careers, etc. Young people especially relate to videos with advice and testimonials from people like them.

I think his friends are not the issue at all. If the friends are also going to college, they are not holding him back. Many people master material by teaching it to others. Also many top students study alone or won't study with people who can't move at their pace. Unless they are good friends. Are you suggesting that your son try to opportunistically befriend people to get help? Because that's high effort, insincere, and has an unpredictable outcome.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He could be a paramedic / nursing assistant / nurse
there's plenty of jobs in the medical universe with the chance of progression and they don't all start with DOCTOR.

I have been in hospital enough times to recognize the talented people versus the untalented ones. Sometimes its the nurse practitioners who are the ones spotting the details and saving the lives.

Sure, sometimes. That is not the norm. NP and PA training only covers basics and not the rare diseases or abnormal/unusual human reactions to illness. Docs have 3-5 YEARS more training than midlevels. That is why they work under the supervision of an MD. On their own they do not have the scope of training to diagnose anything atypical.

I don’t disagree. But OP should ask her son why he wants to be a doctor. Does he want to cure rare diseases? Does he want to make a lot of money? Does he want to “help people”? Etc…

Anonymous wrote:Why does he gravitate toward kids who are less academic?

They are usually fun

Anonymous wrote:He could be a paramedic / nursing assistant / nurse
there's plenty of jobs in the medical universe with the chance of progression and they don't all start with DOCTOR.

I have been in hospital enough times to recognize the talented people versus the untalented ones. Sometimes its the nurse practitioners who are the ones spotting the details and saving the lives.

Sure, sometimes. That is not the norm. NP and PA training only covers basics and not the rare diseases or abnormal/unusual human reactions to illness. Docs have 3-5 YEARS more training than midlevels. That is why they work under the supervision of an MD. On their own they do not have the scope of training to diagnose anything atypical.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Because he doesn’t have friends who are uber academic, he doesn’t get how much dedication it takes. He has the intellectual ability. He got overconfident after first year with all As. Then he signed up for tough courses second year but studied with his good ball friends. This semester GPA now 3.3. Not one A in a science course. No Cs though.

Back up. What happened in high school?

And why are his "goo[f] ball" and these extra hard classes that the strongest students aren't even taking?

And if he is intentionally challenging himself with harder classes then necessary, then he is too intellectually curious for medical school.

Let him choose a path that motivates him and that rewards his interest and effort.

Every doctor I know is intellectually curious. The med students who make it to med school are. I went to an ivy undergrad and those of us who got in, which was most, took the hard classes AND got mostly As. Premeds who aim for easy classes are not going to make it, usually.

By the way OP I agree school environment matters. Premeds are surrounded by gunners who study hours and hours a day to beat the means on orgo and physics, plus they volunteer EMT, and they do basic science research with professors. There are very few slackers at to schools and those drop out of premed goals pretty quickly. If yours really wants med, they need to dig in , turn the grades around, and then will have to do a science masters to prove they can get As

Anonymous wrote:He could be a paramedic / nursing assistant / nurse
there's plenty of jobs in the medical universe with the chance of progression and they don't all start with DOCTOR.

I have been in hospital enough times to recognize the talented people versus the untalented ones. Sometimes its the nurse practitioners who are the ones spotting the details and saving the lives.

This.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We went through a similar experience with our daughter. We had hoped college would be a chance to break away from an unambitious friend group, but the friends ended up following her to the college town (they weren’t enrolled in school), and working at the Starbucks.

DD ended up failing out of college. After about 18 months of aimlessness, she’s now enrolled in an associate’s program at community college.

That is a parenting fail on your part.

Perhaps. Or she’ll be fully employed doing something she enjoys in 18 months. Maybe not her original choice, but it’s OK.

Why does he gravitate toward kids who are less academic?

He could be a paramedic / nursing assistant / nurse
there's plenty of jobs in the medical universe with the chance of progression and they don't all start with DOCTOR.

I have been in hospital enough times to recognize the talented people versus the untalented ones. Sometimes its the nurse practitioners who are the ones spotting the details and saving the lives.

Give up on med school and find an alternative.

Too late.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We went through a similar experience with our daughter. We had hoped college would be a chance to break away from an unambitious friend group, but the friends ended up following her to the college town (they weren’t enrolled in school), and working at the Starbucks.

DD ended up failing out of college. After about 18 months of aimlessness, she’s now enrolled in an associate’s program at community college.

This is my worst nightmare. These kinds of people are not good for society. Dragging others down with them. Disgusting.

This is more about the child’s mindset than it is about the friends themselves. A low self-regard and lack of self-esteem are what propels someone to only associate with low class, low ambition people despite having higher level intellectual skills. For this type of person, associating with disciplined, goal-oriented peers is intimidating. Did the parent have a role in it? Yes they could have intervened in middle school and high school bc the behavior and psyche were probably already evident back then. it’s a failure in parenting.

Lots of B's pretty much takes you out of DO and MD schools.

Maybe the islands?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused- why are there blue collar students at college?

Their backgrounds. No kids whose family members are white collar professionals

What a crock.

DP.
This is a polite way to refer to those people. They are almost always a bad influence and engage in activities and behaviors that are risky because they have little to lose.

OP here. I’m not going to be there for my kid when he’s older. I can’t explain that to him. He’s going to have to grow up quickly.