Anonymous wrote:4 kids applied from DD's school (including her) last cycle. 1 waitlisted, 2 rejected (including my DD), and 1 got in. The one who got in had a mixture of As and Bs at the time of application, same course rigor and math level as DD, who had all A+s. DD got a perfect score on the PSAT 9, the kid who got in was 90th percentile. DD has phenomenal leadership and volunteering ECs she discussed in her PoG essays. Everyone said she should have gotten in.

My DD had no prep. The kid who got in had prep.

Prep absolutely matters.

Anonymous wrote:4 kids applied from DD's school (including her) last cycle. 1 waitlisted, 2 rejected (including my DD), and 1 got in. The one who got in had a mixture of As and Bs at the time of application, same course rigor and math level as DD, who had all A+s. DD got a perfect score on the PSAT 9, the kid who got in was 90th percentile. DD has phenomenal leadership and volunteering ECs she discussed in her PoG essays. Everyone said she should have gotten in.

My DD had no prep. The kid who got in had prep.

Prep absolutely matters.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

This appears not to be an issue since the entering classes are economically more diverse than any before the change.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

That's exactly why selecting the top 1.5% from each school helps level the playing field!

But it's not the top 1.5%, it's an almost random selection.

Nope it's the top 1.5% based on clear and objective metrics. The problem is some people don't like this because it's hard to manipulate unlike the old system, they don't have a clear advantage.

Again, you seem to not comprehend the word "objective." Go back to your 4th grade homework and let the grown ups handle this discussion.

It's the top 1.5% based mostly on essays. Essay grading is by definition not objective.

No it's the top 1.5% based on objective metrics like grades and test scores. These aren't as easy to manipulate so people like yourselves try to pretend it's something else in order to push for a return to the older system which was easy to game.

This isn’t accurate. A quick visit to the official fcps website will immediately communicate otherwise.

So …. I’ve read the FCPS website and gone through the admissions process and my kid is at TJ under the new system.

Kids take the test. The top 1.5% who apply automatically get in if they take the test. This is actually grade based. Then some other kids get in if the essays are exceptional.

It feels random. I’ve had parents go - wait- how did your kid get in? And I literally tell them I don’t know.

But I do know my kids grades were all 100% and test wise- 99th. Just a lot of kids mask well to hide their intelligence in middle school to fit in. So it feels random. But it’s not. My kid just doesn’t make being smart their identity. It’s sort of how some people advertise their political affiliation and some don’t. You would never know.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

That's exactly why selecting the top 1.5% from each school helps level the playing field!

But it's not the top 1.5%, it's an almost random selection.

Nope it's the top 1.5% based on clear and objective metrics. The problem is some people don't like this because it's hard to manipulate unlike the old system, they don't have a clear advantage.

Again, you seem to not comprehend the word "objective." Go back to your 4th grade homework and let the grown ups handle this discussion.

It's the top 1.5% based mostly on essays. Essay grading is by definition not objective.

Essay grading may not be as objective as something like the PSAT but it's not random.

IME, most of students who were admitted, at my DC's middle school and his friend's middle school, were mostly the students that you would expect, plus a couple more which were a bit of a surprise. IOW, the new admissions process seems to work just fine.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

That's exactly why selecting the top 1.5% from each school helps level the playing field!

But it's not the top 1.5%, it's an almost random selection.

Nope it's the top 1.5% based on clear and objective metrics. The problem is some people don't like this because it's hard to manipulate unlike the old system, they don't have a clear advantage.

Again, you seem to not comprehend the word "objective." Go back to your 4th grade homework and let the grown ups handle this discussion.

It's the top 1.5% based mostly on essays. Essay grading is by definition not objective.

No it's the top 1.5% based on objective metrics like grades and test scores. These aren't as easy to manipulate so people like yourselves try to pretend it's something else in order to push for a return to the older system which was easy to game.

This isn’t accurate. A quick visit to the official fcps website will immediately communicate otherwise.

So …. I’ve read the FCPS website and gone through the admissions process and my kid is at TJ under the new system.

Kids take the test. The top 1.5% who apply automatically get in if they take the test. This is actually grade based. Then some other kids get in if the essays are exceptional.

It feels random. I’ve had parents go - wait- how did your kid get in? And I literally tell them I don’t know.

But I do know my kids grades were all 100% and test wise- 99th. Just a lot of kids mask well to hide their intelligence in middle school to fit in. So it feels random. But it’s not. My kid just doesn’t make being smart their identity. It’s sort of how some people advertise their political affiliation and some don’t. You would never know.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

That's exactly why selecting the top 1.5% from each school helps level the playing field!

But it's not the top 1.5%, it's an almost random selection.

Nope it's the top 1.5% based on clear and objective metrics. The problem is some people don't like this because it's hard to manipulate unlike the old system, they don't have a clear advantage.

Again, you seem to not comprehend the word "objective." Go back to your 4th grade homework and let the grown ups handle this discussion.

It's the top 1.5% based mostly on essays. Essay grading is by definition not objective.

No it's the top 1.5% based on objective metrics like grades and test scores. These aren't as easy to manipulate so people like yourselves try to pretend it's something else in order to push for a return to the older system which was easy to game.

This isn’t accurate. A quick visit to the official fcps website will immediately communicate otherwise.

So …. I’ve read the FCPS website and gone through the admissions process and my kid is at TJ under the new system.

Kids take the test. The top 1.5% who apply automatically get in if they take the test. This is actually grade based. Then some other kids get in if the essays are exceptional.

It feels random. I’ve had parents go - wait- how did your kid get in? And I literally tell them I don’t know.

But I do know my kids grades were all 100% and test wise- 99th. Just a lot of kids mask well to hide their intelligence in middle school to fit in. So it feels random. But it’s not. My kid just doesn’t make being smart their identity. It’s sort of how some people advertise their political affiliation and some don’t. You would never know.

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

That's exactly why selecting the top 1.5% from each school helps level the playing field!

But it's not the top 1.5%, it's an almost random selection.

Nope it's the top 1.5% based on clear and objective metrics. The problem is some people don't like this because it's hard to manipulate unlike the old system, they don't have a clear advantage.

Again, you seem to not comprehend the word "objective." Go back to your 4th grade homework and let the grown ups handle this discussion.

It's the top 1.5% based mostly on essays. Essay grading is by definition not objective.

No it's the top 1.5% based on objective metrics like grades and test scores. These aren't as easy to manipulate so people like yourselves try to pretend it's something else in order to push for a return to the older system which was easy to game.

This isn’t accurate. A quick visit to the official fcps website will immediately communicate otherwise.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

That's exactly why selecting the top 1.5% from each school helps level the playing field!

But it's not the top 1.5%, it's an almost random selection.

Nope it's the top 1.5% based on clear and objective metrics. The problem is some people don't like this because it's hard to manipulate unlike the old system, they don't have a clear advantage.

Again, you seem to not comprehend the word "objective." Go back to your 4th grade homework and let the grown ups handle this discussion.

It's the top 1.5% based mostly on essays. Essay grading is by definition not objective.

Essay grading may not be as objective as something like the PSAT but it's not random.

IME, most of students who were admitted, at my DC's middle school and his friend's middle school, were mostly the students that you would expect, plus a couple more which were a bit of a surprise. IOW, the new admissions process seems to work just fine.

The reason so many of the kids were good students is because there is self selection in the applicant pool.
There didn't used to be so many admits that got everyone scratching their heads and there didn't used to be so many kids who were likely admits not getting in.
At our middle school, they give a prize for the best students in various subjects. The winner of best algebra student and best geometry student didn't get in and they almost always get in.
The new process adds a lot of randomness.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

That's exactly why selecting the top 1.5% from each school helps level the playing field!

But it's not the top 1.5%, it's an almost random selection.

Nope it's the top 1.5% based on clear and objective metrics. The problem is some people don't like this because it's hard to manipulate unlike the old system, they don't have a clear advantage.

Again, you seem to not comprehend the word "objective." Go back to your 4th grade homework and let the grown ups handle this discussion.

It's the top 1.5% based mostly on essays. Essay grading is by definition not objective.

Essay grading may not be as objective as something like the PSAT but it's not random.

IME, most of students who were admitted, at my DC's middle school and his friend's middle school, were mostly the students that you would expect, plus a couple more which were a bit of a surprise. IOW, the new admissions process seems to work just fine.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Simple and honest question: Why do so many of you think that GPA and essays are *less* vulnerable to prep and effects of affluence than test scores? Affluent kids with motivated parents likely have been in enrichment classes for quite awhile and are likely ahead. If the kid struggles at all, the affluent parents are likely to get a tutor and shore up any deficiencies the kid might have. If all else fails, the affluent parents are much more likely to badger the teacher and administration until their kid's grade turns into an A. It honestly doesn't seem hard for any parent with the money and motivation to make sure any average kid could get straight As in middle school.

Likewise, it's pretty easy to talk about love for STEM and such when the kid has been attending enrichment and camps for many years. Again, it would also be easy to get prep and tutoring to write a highly polished essay.

With tests like PSAT, while prep helps to some degree, there is a pretty strong limit. Kids who are naturally 99th percentile will likely earn very high scores with no or minimal prep. Kids who are pretty average but privileged will see score increases, but they're still unlikely to earn super high scores. It seems easier for affluent parents to ensure that their kids have straight As and can write strong essays than it would be to ensure that their kid would earn a very high PSAT score.

So what am I missing, here?

That's exactly why selecting the top 1.5% from each school helps level the playing field!

But it's not the top 1.5%, it's an almost random selection.

Nope it's the top 1.5% based on clear and objective metrics. The problem is some people don't like this because it's hard to manipulate unlike the old system, they don't have a clear advantage.

Again, you seem to not comprehend the word "objective." Go back to your 4th grade homework and let the grown ups handle this discussion.

It's the top 1.5% based mostly on essays. Essay grading is by definition not objective.