Anonymous wrote:Listen to DD process the experience and resist the temptation to express your thoughts and advice.

If she asks what to do, I would recommend she say "Thank you for apologizing. I appreciate it." And then carry on as polite acquaintances for a while rather than resuming a friendship-- see how it goes for a bit.

+1

Great advice.

I wouldn’t write this girl off entirely. Sure, she was awful last year at age 12. But apologizing showed maturity or at least a little self-awareness. It’s possible she’s come a long way in the past year. So I’d accept the apology as genuine.

That said, it’s always good to take things slowly. Be open and friendly, but don’t initiate anything. If the girl continues to reach out, keep an open mind. (And let’s all remember we’re talking about the behavior of a 12/13 year old kid. Such a growth period!)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s crazy to me how so many of you are modeling to your kids that one can never make a mistake, make amends, and be forgiven.

It is perfectly reasonable for the bullied girl to not be friends with this girl anymore (and it is healthy for kids to learn that when you destroy trust in a relationship you can’t get it back), but to forever brand a middle school girl who has seen the error of her ways and is trying to do the right thing with the scarlet “MG” is not right.

My DC can get along with anyone no matter how awful they’ve been, but it’s important to emphasize particularly with girls and even grown women that remembering someone’s cruel behavior can be wise- boundaries and being realistic are positive things. I’m not advocating for Op’s DD to do anything but keep distance. You’re dramatic, so you’ve got some stuff to work out.

+1.

For a significant number of women, the quality of their close friendships contributes immensely to their happiness. Learning how to evaluate these friendships is very important.

I would never be close friends with a woman who was cruel to me in the past. Why would I guide my DD to do this?

The former friend might have learned her lesson and changed, and that's great. However, both should move on to new friendships. What's done is done.

+1 Trustworthy girls deserve friends who they can trust.

This is why often the bully and followers turn on the girl who sticks up for the bullied, then the bullied girl joins the other side. It's a test to see who possesses the required lack of moral compass to join the mean girls.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:at the urging of a more “popular” girl they were getting close with whom DD wasn’t interested in befriending.

This part confuses me. Where was the chicken and the egg in this?

Same. It looks like there was another girl the group wanted to hang out with and the op daughter didn’t want her in the group. The group chose the “popular” girl.

Maybe the group was going in a different direction?

You can always say "Thank you for your apology." It acknowledges it without you having to accept it or say "oh you don't have to apologize" or apologizing back, etc.

Meh, fine to accept the apology but no requirement to be friends again. I’d say to be civil as you never know how life will twist and turn. You may run into this person in a professional setting etc. and, regardless, it WAS positive that there was an apology.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think many of you have the wrong (in my opinion!) idea of what's going on with tween development. It's an awkward time in every developmental way. Most of these tweens will become lovely teens, and nearly all will become lovely adults.

That’s nice for them. I think most of us ran into people like this in school and we don’t really care how these people turned out later. But we remember them clearly and vowed to never name our kids that same name due to the negative association.

News flash: somewhere in your life, you too have hurt someone else. That’s just reality. None of us is perfect.

Proceed with caution.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think we should be teaching girls forgiveness.
Because despite what people claim it sets them up for continued abuse.


Considering this girl is still hanging out with bullies it doesn't seem like her apology is sincere.

I don't think you need to do or say anything about it specifically beyond asking how she feels about the apology

Sorry, the bolded is just stupid. Forgiveness doesn’t mean forgetting. You can forgive someone and just move on, not go back to the way things were.

If you teach your girls that forgiveness is bad, just bear in mind that this means they will also be learning that *they’re* not worthy of forgiveness either. Better hope your daughters never screw up!

But That's exactly how it translates in real life.
And you are in no place to lecture anyone given you can't explain a point without abusive language.
That you are so invested in insisting that a bully is entitled to forgiveness makes me think you or your daughter are bullies.
Contrary to your believe intentionally hurting someone is not a required milestone.

And yet you didn’t respond to my point about what your attitude is actually teaching your own daughter. I think this is the sort of rigidity that can drive kids to self harm, as much as I’m sure you don’t want to hear that. Because once again, you are literally teaching your child that there is never a way to make up for or move on from a mistake, and your child will undoubtedly make a mistake someday (because she is human, and we all do). And if she is smart she’ll know she can’t talk to you about it.

Anonymous wrote:I think many of you have the wrong (in my opinion!) idea of what's going on with tween development. It's an awkward time in every developmental way. Most of these tweens will become lovely teens, and nearly all will become lovely adults.

That’s nice for them. I think most of us ran into people like this in school and we don’t really care how these people turned out later. But we remember them clearly and vowed to never name our kids that same name due to the negative association.

Anonymous wrote:I think many of you have the wrong (in my opinion!) idea of what's going on with tween development. It's an awkward time in every developmental way. Most of these tweens will become lovely teens, and nearly all will become lovely adults.

Agree!

My DD and I were both burned in 6/7 grade. I remember that hurt remarkably well. I have so much empathy for the ones who also were hurt, but these are kids who are going to make mistakes. That's expected.

If you teach your daughters to take a scorched earth policy on anyone who ever wrongs them, you're setting her up for a tough life!

It makes sense to be cautious after someone wrongs you, but people do change, especially in those tween/teen years.

Anonymous wrote:It’s crazy to me how so many of you are modeling to your kids that one can never make a mistake, make amends, and be forgiven.

It is perfectly reasonable for the bullied girl to not be friends with this girl anymore (and it is healthy for kids to learn that when you destroy trust in a relationship you can’t get it back), but to forever brand a middle school girl who has seen the error of her ways and is trying to do the right thing with the scarlet “MG” is not right.

+1

OP's DD certainly has no obligation to be friends with anyone but the idea that the old friend is genuinely sorry is not out of the realm of possibility. OP's DD seems to be rather strict in who she rejects. This situation arose out of her choice originally that she didn't want to be friends with the "popular" girl, and the other girls choosing sides and taking it too far. If the popular girl and the apologizing old friend are people she doesn't want to associate with, so be it but it shouldn't be cast as an act of moral superiority. Teenage girls make lots of mistakes, and many evolve to be better than those mistakes.

How nice for the bully to not have consequences for their behavior. The target deserves friends that are trustworthy and reliable. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. The bully can be forgiven but is certainly not owed friendship.

I think many of you have the wrong (in my opinion!) idea of what's going on with tween development. It's an awkward time in every developmental way. Most of these tweens will become lovely teens, and nearly all will become lovely adults.

Anonymous wrote:This kind of stuff is not simply “a mistake.” It’s consciously mean, plain and simple. A tween knows when they are being mean. DD can thank for the apology in order to let it go from her own psyche but not rekindle or trust this girl again. Hopefully DD has enough new friends that she doesn’t need a one more who is, at best, of questionable trustworthiness.

Mean girl will hopefully learn that her actions have consequences and a too little too late apology can’t always undo the “mistake.”

Exactly - Even a child is known by his doings, whether his work be pure, and whether it be right

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think we should be teaching girls forgiveness.
Because despite what people claim it sets them up for continued abuse.


Considering this girl is still hanging out with bullies it doesn't seem like her apology is sincere.

I don't think you need to do or say anything about it specifically beyond asking how she feels about the apology

Sorry, the bolded is just stupid. Forgiveness doesn’t mean forgetting. You can forgive someone and just move on, not go back to the way things were.

If you teach your girls that forgiveness is bad, just bear in mind that this means they will also be learning that *they’re* not worthy of forgiveness either. Better hope your daughters never screw up!

But That's exactly how it translates in real life.
And you are in no place to lecture anyone given you can't explain a point without abusive language.
That you are so invested in insisting that a bully is entitled to forgiveness makes me think you or your daughter are bullies.
Contrary to your believe intentionally hurting someone is not a required milestone.