Where do you think you get more international experience, exposure and opportunities? DC or Vermont?

Anonymous wrote:I have a child at School Without Walls and can't get them to consider GWU because its way too familiar. Too bad, since GWU is such a great IR school. But for some local kids (especially those who already have connections to the field through family, neighbors, etc) it is a hard sell.

My kid went to public school in Bethesda and loves, and attends, GWU. He also visited Georgetown but didn't like the campus as much. The heart wants what the heart wants, PP

I have a child at School Without Walls and can't get them to consider GWU because its way too familiar. Too bad, since GWU is such a great IR school. But for some local kids (especially those who already have connections to the field through family, neighbors, etc) it is a hard sell.

more security clearances per undergrad at GWU than any other college. which is something.

I dont get the argument about the campus. It's like warning people NYU is in NYC. yes, that's true. Nobody is looking seriously at these schools if they're not already okay with the school's campus.

It's in the top 10 for International Affairs, with Columbia, Georgetown SFS, American, etc.

My kid is there right now and loves it. He also appreciated the urban campus. He preferred it over the W&M dual degree programme with St Andrews, which has an option for International Affairs, but it's a much smaller program with fewer course options.

He might go to grad school abroad - he's not limiting himself to American grad school international affairs programs.

My son has been admitted to W&M JDP IR program and GWU IR program. GWU cost comes $10K/year less than W&M. He is interested in research and academics. Can anyone suggest the pros and cons of each of these programs?

Anonymous wrote:My kid had the same choices and opted for VT - National Security and Foreign Affairs major with a Russian minor. Fabulous opportunities there through the Hume Center for National Security, IR organizations, study abroad, intelligence community seminars, etc. There is also a more traditional IR degree offered, but my DC opted for this because of interest in the IC. Highly recommend.

+100
I concur! We have been so impressed with VT and the NSFA major. So glad my DC chose this school over several others that he was accepted to, including GW, W&M, and CMU.

GW has one thing. Deep relationships and reputation in places like the Agency, State, DOD, etc. plus think thanks etc. Coupled with internships, have to weigh costs. Also, good degree for law school if you choose that path.

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If cost is not a concern, do GWU. Better location for internships and networking opportunities with the faculty.

GW grad, don’t agree. Not better enough to justify extra cost relative to VT or WM.

Then you didn't hustle enough.

We have plenty of year-round GW interns where I work. We only see W&M interns in the summer and then they're competing with everyone else.

I got plenty of internships when I was at GW, idiot. And then when I graduated, my coworkers attended non-DC schools like VT and UVA, showing that it absolutely was not necessary to pay GW prices to have a year-round internship in order to get an IR job.

Better to save $ undergrad in a good undergrad public- WM UVA program —and then go to SAIS, Walsh, Harvard, etc for grad degree. Save the $ undergrad

Toying with that because Georgetown is so expensive- but in this field it is #1. Better than ivies for IR.

Yeah you’ll really see that investment paying off when your Georgetown IR grad lands that first job making $45k lmao.

+1. DP. You LMAO, but you make an important point. We encouraged our very serious about IR kid to go to WM because she (well we, but her 529) can pay for that plus most or all of a Masters from Georgetown, GW, etc.— as in no loans. Since many IR jobs that give you amazing experience (federal government, nonprofit, Fulbright and other fellowships, NGOs, even Peace Corp type things) are low/ lower paid, a kid without loans has a lot more options in choosing their first job. Even if you defer loans, the interest keeps accruing. And as much as I’d love to see public sector student loan forgiveness, it’s not a given. It’s a huge plus to be able to take the job that gives you amazing experience without the pressure of loans.

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If cost is not a concern, do GWU. Better location for internships and networking opportunities with the faculty.

GW grad, don’t agree. Not better enough to justify extra cost relative to VT or WM.

Then you didn't hustle enough.

We have plenty of year-round GW interns where I work. We only see W&M interns in the summer and then they're competing with everyone else.

I got plenty of internships when I was at GW, idiot. And then when I graduated, my coworkers attended non-DC schools like VT and UVA, showing that it absolutely was not necessary to pay GW prices to have a year-round internship in order to get an IR job.

Better to save $ undergrad in a good undergrad public- WM UVA program —and then go to SAIS, Walsh, Harvard, etc for grad degree. Save the $ undergrad

Toying with that because Georgetown is so expensive- but in this field it is #1. Better than ivies for IR.

Yeah you’ll really see that investment paying off when your Georgetown IR grad lands that first job making $45k lmao.

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If cost is not a concern, do GWU. Better location for internships and networking opportunities with the faculty.

GW grad, don’t agree. Not better enough to justify extra cost relative to VT or WM.

Then you didn't hustle enough.

We have plenty of year-round GW interns where I work. We only see W&M interns in the summer and then they're competing with everyone else.

I got plenty of internships when I was at GW, idiot. And then when I graduated, my coworkers attended non-DC schools like VT and UVA, showing that it absolutely was not necessary to pay GW prices to have a year-round internship in order to get an IR job.

Better to save $ undergrad in a good undergrad public- WM UVA program —and then go to SAIS, Walsh, Harvard, etc for grad degree. Save the $ undergrad

Toying with that because Georgetown is so expensive- but in this field it is #1. Better than ivies for IR.

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Anonymous wrote:

If cost is not a concern, do GWU. Better location for internships and networking opportunities with the faculty.

GW grad, don’t agree. Not better enough to justify extra cost relative to VT or WM.

Then you didn't hustle enough.

We have plenty of year-round GW interns where I work. We only see W&M interns in the summer and then they're competing with everyone else.

I got plenty of internships when I was at GW, idiot. And then when I graduated, my coworkers attended non-DC schools like VT and UVA, showing that it absolutely was not necessary to pay GW prices to have a year-round internship in order to get an IR job.

Better to save $ undergrad in a good undergrad public- WM UVA program —and then go to SAIS, Walsh, Harvard, etc for grad degree. Save the $ undergrad

Anonymous wrote:GW has no campus. It's kind of depressing. I was driving my younger son home from high school and to avoid traffic cut through GW and said 'this is the campus'.

It is an urban campus. That isn't everyone's jam.

Anonymous wrote:It isn't about the education it is about the experiences. Go to GWU, and you can do internships year round. Network with people in your field. Go to WM and you can network in colonial Williamsburg.

Never underestimate the value of knowing how to churn butter.

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Anonymous wrote:What do all of these IR grads do? Are there even enough jobs for them? It’s such a popular major these days.

No

There aren’t

who says?

There are only a finite number of think tanks and political / gov jobs that are “good” ir jobs

Academia is cutthroat - and the private sector doesn’t really hire ir grads out of ug unless they go to a top school or grad school in something more practical

So yes there is a massive oversupply of kids who are gonna be frustrated

This is why a kid who is serious about IR will double major. I have a different IR/ Russian major than PP. they are getting a lot of interest and cool opportunities— because of the Russian. Very hard to find US citizens who can get a security clearance and are fluent in Chinese, Russian, Garsi, Arabic, etc. because native speakers often still have relative in their parents home country. I recently talked to a parent who is a native Russian speaker whose fluent speaker daughter was denied da clearance— grandparents in Russia.

Another route is to do hardcore data science or econ with IR. You can be very employable in IR— plus something else that’s in demand.

Pp you are replying to here

Yeah agreed with everything you said

however the % of kids who are serious about ir vs the total # of ir majoring kids these days is not large

Way too many unserious kids declaring/majoring in it