Anonymous
02/23/2024 15:36
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
- 420 4th St SE - This one surprised me. Recently renovated, 3br, in zone for Brent, priced at $1.25. I was surprised this sat for 2 weeks and will be curious where it closes (https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/420-4th-St-SE-20003/home/9896121). Opens were busy but not crazy busy
That's not a great block. I know beggars can't be choosers, but I can see there being some hesitation.
It’s also new construction, which I personally would not want.
why is that not a great block? dog park, kids playground, corner store, police station?
.... Non-stop vehicle traffic heading south toward Navy Yard and the Freeway entrance, and very small front yards so little buffer. Also not a pretty block compared to so many others on the Hill. A total mishmash of styles and level of upkeep.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 15:34
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:You have different kinds of buyers on the Hill. All of them appreciate certain things about the neighborhood (the housing stock, and in many cases the fact that it's family friendly)
You have some buyers who appreciate how dense, urban, and connected the Hill is. They like access to public transportation, proximity to bars and restaurants, and easy commutes downtown. People in this category will view houses close to H street similar to those near Lincoln Park or Eastern Market. The thing about Hill East that will bother them is distance from other things, not higher crime. They are simply not as bothered by higher crime, and might even buy north of H Street if the price is right because for them, the urbanness of the Hill is the draw.
There's a different group who specifically come the CH because it is *less* urban than other parts of DC or even certain suburbs. They like the row houses and the walkability, but they aren't looking to be close to the hot new bars and are wary of commercial corridors generally. For people like this, anything within a block of H is a no, a lot of Eastern Market/Barracks Row is a no, anything north of H obviously a no, and Hill East probably also a no unless they get something IB for Maury (and the buyers in this category will be most freaked out by the proposed Maury-Miner cluster so that might still be a no for them at this point).
I think you're mostly right about this, but I'm not sure the first group of buyers isn't bothered by higher crime at all. Instead, I think they compare crime around H Street or Hill East to other areas in DC that are close to bars, restaurants, and transportation, like Petworth or Columbia Heights.
When I rented in Capitol Hill (alas, I'm still priced out as a buyer), I was in that second group. The thing about the area you describe, though, is that it's still not exactly far from H Street or Eastern Market. I lived about a 15 minute walk from each, which was plenty close when I wanted to go to a bar or the market, but not so close that I had to deal with H Street noise or the fun that's parking near Eastern Market on a weekend. It's ideally situated IMO (unless you want to be 10 minutes form a Metro station). That's why it's expensive, and why H Street, Hill East, and North of H don't really compare.
For me, there's a meaningful difference between the Capitol Hill Historic District and everything else that's technically "Capitol Hill."
Anonymous
02/23/2024 15:29
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
- 420 4th St SE - This one surprised me. Recently renovated, 3br, in zone for Brent, priced at $1.25. I was surprised this sat for 2 weeks and will be curious where it closes (https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/420-4th-St-SE-20003/home/9896121). Opens were busy but not crazy busy
That's not a great block. I know beggars can't be choosers, but I can see there being some hesitation.
It’s also new construction, which I personally would not want.
why is that not a great block? dog park, kids playground, corner store, police station?
Anonymous
02/23/2024 15:25
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:We bought peak of last year's market in the "close in" heart of the Hill. Took three offers waiving all/most contingencies, 100k+ escalations, and we landed in a fixer-upper at the top of our budget.
This year's market for the close in Hill seems to be the same. Two interesting datapoints:
- 16 8th Street NE - intentionally underpriced estate sale that needs SIGNIFICANT work. Open houses were flooded. Contingent 5 days after listing and sold for $180k over (https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/16-8th-St-NE-20002/home/9901644)
- 124 6th St NE - Similar play here (same listing agent, I heard). Estate sale with significant work ahead, sold for $150k over ask, contingent 5 days after list (https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/124-6th-St-NE-20002/home/9897148)
- 420 4th St SE - This one surprised me. Recently renovated, 3br, in zone for Brent, priced at $1.25. I was surprised this sat for 2 weeks and will be curious where it closes (https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/420-4th-St-SE-20003/home/9896121). Opens were busy but not crazy busy
How do those first two need “significant” work?
My reaction too. Unless there are structural or mechanical issues that are not obvious from the photos, both are nicer than our perfectly nice Hill house. Some people might want to live only in houses with brand-new, top-of-the line kitchens and baths, but there's a market for houses with 7 or 17 or even 27 year old kitchens.
PP here who posted the links originally. Both houses photographed well thanks to very fresh paint jobs (both houses smelled like paint on walk through). Evidence of water damage, cracks around windows (potential structural issues?). Kitchens were extremely dated and painters had just painted over old (>40yo) cabinets. Floors needed to be refinished in both throughout. Bathrooms had cracked tiles and evidence of water damage in some spaces. Garage in the 8th street house looked structurally unsound & like it would need to be demo'd. That's in addition to typical wear and tear on windows, walls, and exteriors. I was not buying, so didn't do inspection, but realtor at both opens said that systems were older and would need work.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 14:32
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:We bought peak of last year's market in the "close in" heart of the Hill. Took three offers waiving all/most contingencies, 100k+ escalations, and we landed in a fixer-upper at the top of our budget.
This year's market for the close in Hill seems to be the same. Two interesting datapoints:
- 16 8th Street NE - intentionally underpriced estate sale that needs SIGNIFICANT work. Open houses were flooded. Contingent 5 days after listing and sold for $180k over (https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/16-8th-St-NE-20002/home/9901644)
- 124 6th St NE - Similar play here (same listing agent, I heard). Estate sale with significant work ahead, sold for $150k over ask, contingent 5 days after list (https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/124-6th-St-NE-20002/home/9897148)
- 420 4th St SE - This one surprised me. Recently renovated, 3br, in zone for Brent, priced at $1.25. I was surprised this sat for 2 weeks and will be curious where it closes (https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/420-4th-St-SE-20003/home/9896121). Opens were busy but not crazy busy
How do those first two need “significant” work?
My reaction too. Unless there are structural or mechanical issues that are not obvious from the photos, both are nicer than our perfectly nice Hill house. Some people might want to live only in houses with brand-new, top-of-the line kitchens and baths, but there's a market for houses with 7 or 17 or even 27 year old kitchens.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 14:16
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
You have different kinds of buyers on the Hill. All of them appreciate certain things about the neighborhood (the housing stock, and in many cases the fact that it's family friendly)
You have some buyers who appreciate how dense, urban, and connected the Hill is. They like access to public transportation, proximity to bars and restaurants, and easy commutes downtown. People in this category will view houses close to H street similar to those near Lincoln Park or Eastern Market. The thing about Hill East that will bother them is distance from other things, not higher crime. They are simply not as bothered by higher crime, and might even buy north of H Street if the price is right because for them, the urbanness of the Hill is the draw.
There's a different group who specifically come the CH because it is *less* urban than other parts of DC or even certain suburbs. They like the row houses and the walkability, but they aren't looking to be close to the hot new bars and are wary of commercial corridors generally. For people like this, anything within a block of H is a no, a lot of Eastern Market/Barracks Row is a no, anything north of H obviously a no, and Hill East probably also a no unless they get something IB for Maury (and the buyers in this category will be most freaked out by the proposed Maury-Miner cluster so that might still be a no for them at this point).
You have some buyers who appreciate how dense, urban, and connected the Hill is. They like access to public transportation, proximity to bars and restaurants, and easy commutes downtown. People in this category will view houses close to H street similar to those near Lincoln Park or Eastern Market. The thing about Hill East that will bother them is distance from other things, not higher crime. They are simply not as bothered by higher crime, and might even buy north of H Street if the price is right because for them, the urbanness of the Hill is the draw.
There's a different group who specifically come the CH because it is *less* urban than other parts of DC or even certain suburbs. They like the row houses and the walkability, but they aren't looking to be close to the hot new bars and are wary of commercial corridors generally. For people like this, anything within a block of H is a no, a lot of Eastern Market/Barracks Row is a no, anything north of H obviously a no, and Hill East probably also a no unless they get something IB for Maury (and the buyers in this category will be most freaked out by the proposed Maury-Miner cluster so that might still be a no for them at this point).
Anonymous
02/23/2024 14:07
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:For this discussion it makes a huge difference. As multiple posts have said, there is a clear value difference between a house at 6th and F NE and one at 2nd and D SE. So when links are posted for "20003 home report" or "Capitol Hill home report" it's hard to draw easy conclusions for the multiple micro-neighborhoods within Capitol Hill.
I'm not really sure about that. I think that the broader Capitol Hill housing values (for houses zoned for decent elementary schools) are likely to be fairly lockstep with premiums for stable features that don't fluctuate with the housing market, such as proximity to metro and off-street parking. If a house on 6&F NE is sitting on the market with price cuts, that definitely has bearing on a house at 2nd & D SE. There's some premium attached to being that close to the Capitol but it's not "huge."
+1. Many people buy on the Hill for the walkability, and in that sense, 6th and F NE and 2nd and D SE are very comparable. If your kid is planning to go to Stuart Hobson, 6th and F is an even better location.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 13:11
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:For this discussion it makes a huge difference. As multiple posts have said, there is a clear value difference between a house at 6th and F NE and one at 2nd and D SE. So when links are posted for "20003 home report" or "Capitol Hill home report" it's hard to draw easy conclusions for the multiple micro-neighborhoods within Capitol Hill.
I'm not really sure about that. I think that the broader Capitol Hill housing values (for houses zoned for decent elementary schools) are likely to be fairly lockstep with premiums for stable features that don't fluctuate with the housing market, such as proximity to metro and off-street parking. If a house on 6&F NE is sitting on the market with price cuts, that definitely has bearing on a house at 2nd & D SE. There's some premium attached to being that close to the Capitol but it's not "huge."
PP knows that the best way to keep housing prices up is to restrict supply. The housing stock across most of the neighborhood is pretty similar, so it's very important to PP that anyplace outside of a narrowly defined boundary be seen as less than.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 13:06
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:For this discussion it makes a huge difference. As multiple posts have said, there is a clear value difference between a house at 6th and F NE and one at 2nd and D SE. So when links are posted for "20003 home report" or "Capitol Hill home report" it's hard to draw easy conclusions for the multiple micro-neighborhoods within Capitol Hill.
The people who think there's a difference are petrified white mediocrities who are scared to go north of East Capitol.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 13:04
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:For this discussion it makes a huge difference. As multiple posts have said, there is a clear value difference between a house at 6th and F NE and one at 2nd and D SE. So when links are posted for "20003 home report" or "Capitol Hill home report" it's hard to draw easy conclusions for the multiple micro-neighborhoods within Capitol Hill.
I'm not really sure about that. I think that the broader Capitol Hill housing values (for houses zoned for decent elementary schools) are likely to be fairly lockstep with premiums for stable features that don't fluctuate with the housing market, such as proximity to metro and off-street parking. If a house on 6&F NE is sitting on the market with price cuts, that definitely has bearing on a house at 2nd & D SE. There's some premium attached to being that close to the Capitol but it's not "huge."
Anonymous
02/23/2024 13:01
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
For this discussion it makes a huge difference. As multiple posts have said, there is a clear value difference between a house at 6th and F NE and one at 2nd and D SE. So when links are posted for "20003 home report" or "Capitol Hill home report" it's hard to draw easy conclusions for the multiple micro-neighborhoods within Capitol Hill.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 12:47
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I feel like certain parts of the Hill are doing better than the others. I'm seeing a lot of listings in the blocks just south of H Street that have been sitting since the fall, a number of them with significant price cuts. Some need work, some don't:
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/622-G-St-NE-20002/home/9898467
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/511-F-St-NE-20002/home/9896874
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/619-F-St-NE-20002/home/9898822
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/924-Maryland-Ave-NE-20002/home/9904092
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/608-9th-St-NE-20002/home/9902653
That might be because H street is not the Hill. Happy to talk about the merits and challenges of real estate on H, but comparing homes on 8th and E. Capitol with homes at 6th and G might as well be looking at Mars.
Exactly.
Most of those places are, by definition, the Hill.
Yes, in a most pedantic reading, they are. But come on.
NP and I also consider those listings Capitol Hill. Not sure why that's pedantic? Live in Hill East but also lived prior on Capitol Hill.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 12:29
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I feel like certain parts of the Hill are doing better than the others. I'm seeing a lot of listings in the blocks just south of H Street that have been sitting since the fall, a number of them with significant price cuts. Some need work, some don't:
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/622-G-St-NE-20002/home/9898467
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/511-F-St-NE-20002/home/9896874
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/619-F-St-NE-20002/home/9898822
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/924-Maryland-Ave-NE-20002/home/9904092
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/608-9th-St-NE-20002/home/9902653
That might be because H street is not the Hill. Happy to talk about the merits and challenges of real estate on H, but comparing homes on 8th and E. Capitol with homes at 6th and G might as well be looking at Mars.
Exactly.
Most of those places are, by definition, the Hill.
Yes, in a most pedantic reading, they are. But come on.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 11:12
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I feel like certain parts of the Hill are doing better than the others. I'm seeing a lot of listings in the blocks just south of H Street that have been sitting since the fall, a number of them with significant price cuts. Some need work, some don't:
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/622-G-St-NE-20002/home/9898467
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/511-F-St-NE-20002/home/9896874
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/619-F-St-NE-20002/home/9898822
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/924-Maryland-Ave-NE-20002/home/9904092
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/608-9th-St-NE-20002/home/9902653
That might be because H street is not the Hill. Happy to talk about the merits and challenges of real estate on H, but comparing homes on 8th and E. Capitol with homes at 6th and G might as well be looking at Mars.
Exactly.
Most of those places are, by definition, the Hill.
Anonymous
02/23/2024 10:43
Subject: Capitol Hill State of the Market?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I feel like certain parts of the Hill are doing better than the others. I'm seeing a lot of listings in the blocks just south of H Street that have been sitting since the fall, a number of them with significant price cuts. Some need work, some don't:
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/622-G-St-NE-20002/home/9898467
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/511-F-St-NE-20002/home/9896874
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/619-F-St-NE-20002/home/9898822
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/924-Maryland-Ave-NE-20002/home/9904092
https://www.redfin.com/DC/Washington/608-9th-St-NE-20002/home/9902653
That might be because H street is not the Hill. Happy to talk about the merits and challenges of real estate on H, but comparing homes on 8th and E. Capitol with homes at 6th and G might as well be looking at Mars.
Exactly.