Mathnasium doesn't work as well at the high school level. Center dependent they do not have as many "instructors" who specialize in the upper math classes. If you do not find a private tutor, you can inquire with Mathnasium as they also do one on one tutoring that is different than their standard plan that you are currently in.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both kids are failing math- 9th grader, algebra 1 and 10th grader, algebra 2. I sent them to mathnasium a couple of months and it’s not helping.

Mathnasium has a system of sort, steps, which may have helped if we started in 7th grade but it’s not helping now with quizzes and tests. They have both kids in a foundation level (meets 2x a week per our contract) that seems far behind and impossible to catch up to the level of their current class level. Should I just drop it? So expensive but a private tutor would be more. We need a tutor, I feel 3x week.
Recommendation how to move forward. The kids just don’t get the concepts, they have short term memory too- coupled with a shitty teen attitude, I’m at a loss.

Oh no, oh no! You have started shockingly late. If they are struggling in Algebra 1 and 2, there is no way that your kids were ever great at Math in ES or MS - so you are waking up only now?

Mathnasium cannot help you immediately with the Algebra 1 and Algebra 2 content because your kids are so far behind with Math and pre-algebra. It will take them the time it will take to bring them up to speed. I shudder to think what your kid will do junior year. It is rough.

If your kids work very hard every single day, and you also work very hard with them every single day, and maybe private tutor works very hard with them a few day, there is a chance that your kids can catch up in a few months.

Because you mentioned the cost - my low cost but very effective suggestion to you is to buy this course by James Seller
- https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/mastering-the-fundamentals-of-mathematics.html

Do at least two lessons per day. Do the course work too. Then progress to Algebra 1 and Algebra 2. These courses may be available in your local library too for free. In any case, every year there is an annual end of year sale and you can get these courses for cheap. I bought all the courses for my kids and I learned the material too. Do not skip chapters even if they seem very basic.

These courses are for people who are bad in Math and do not have a grasp of concepts.

Kids are supposed to be taking algebra 1 in ninth grade, geometry as a sophomore, and algebra 2 junior year. Lots of kids in the DMV are on the advanced math track and take algebra in middle school but OP’s kids are not that far behind.

If they are failing then they are FAR BEHIND. Their basic math concepts are not clear for them. They have significant gaps (maybe due to COVID) but Math builds upon previous foundational knowledge. It is not a question of what Math Track they are on. We know that schools will promote kids even if they have not learned anything. OP's children are functionally Math illiterate.

Calm down a little. Why are you so determined to be mean? It is sort of pathological.

OP try a private tutor online. Mathnasium has a system and it probably won’t give your kids the individualized help they need at this age. Better for your kids.

YOUNG kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both kids are failing math- 9th grader, algebra 1 and 10th grader, algebra 2. I sent them to mathnasium a couple of months and it’s not helping.

Mathnasium has a system of sort, steps, which may have helped if we started in 7th grade but it’s not helping now with quizzes and tests. They have both kids in a foundation level (meets 2x a week per our contract) that seems far behind and impossible to catch up to the level of their current class level. Should I just drop it? So expensive but a private tutor would be more. We need a tutor, I feel 3x week.
Recommendation how to move forward. The kids just don’t get the concepts, they have short term memory too- coupled with a shitty teen attitude, I’m at a loss.

Oh no, oh no! You have started shockingly late. If they are struggling in Algebra 1 and 2, there is no way that your kids were ever great at Math in ES or MS - so you are waking up only now?

Mathnasium cannot help you immediately with the Algebra 1 and Algebra 2 content because your kids are so far behind with Math and pre-algebra. It will take them the time it will take to bring them up to speed. I shudder to think what your kid will do junior year. It is rough.

If your kids work very hard every single day, and you also work very hard with them every single day, and maybe private tutor works very hard with them a few day, there is a chance that your kids can catch up in a few months.

Because you mentioned the cost - my low cost but very effective suggestion to you is to buy this course by James Seller
- https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/mastering-the-fundamentals-of-mathematics.html

Do at least two lessons per day. Do the course work too. Then progress to Algebra 1 and Algebra 2. These courses may be available in your local library too for free. In any case, every year there is an annual end of year sale and you can get these courses for cheap. I bought all the courses for my kids and I learned the material too. Do not skip chapters even if they seem very basic.

These courses are for people who are bad in Math and do not have a grasp of concepts.

Kids are supposed to be taking algebra 1 in ninth grade, geometry as a sophomore, and algebra 2 junior year. Lots of kids in the DMV are on the advanced math track and take algebra in middle school but OP’s kids are not that far behind.

If they are failing then they are FAR BEHIND. Their basic math concepts are not clear for them. They have significant gaps (maybe due to COVID) but Math builds upon previous foundational knowledge. It is not a question of what Math Track they are on. We know that schools will promote kids even if they have not learned anything. OP's children are functionally Math illiterate.

Calm down a little. Why are you so determined to be mean? It is sort of pathological.

OP try a private tutor online. Mathnasium has a system and it probably won’t give your kids the individualized help they need at this age. Better for your kids.

Why not just do Mumon ?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Russian School of Math might be better. I used it for my son when he was in 7th grade and it helped.

We've used that. It's really good, but again...it's a program and takes time. It's also really hard in my experience (so can make things worse). These kids need a tutor that can look at the actual coursework and build up individualized plans to get them to competency there.

No way. Russian School of Math is tailored to kids who need to be challenged above what they’re learning in school, not kids who are failing.

OP-would suggest you try a tutor and see if that helps. Yes it would be $$ but if Mathnasium isn’t helping your kids, not clear why you’re continuing. It’s not a cheap program either. My kids were in Mathnasium in elementary school so I can’t speak to whether it’s good for high schoolers.

Math just is not for some kids.

OP: is there a vocational-technology school your kids could attend instead?

We did Mathnasium for 3rd grade because I homeschooled for Covid. Wasn’t great, lots of work sheets and not much actual support. If my now 6th grader was struggling in math now I’d get a one on one tutor at home.
I didn’t go to school here but my 6th grader is doing grade level math ( not advanced) not sure what that means she’ll do as a Freshman in HS but maybe if they’re doing advanced math they shouldn’t be?

Not worth it for our DS, it was actually quite demoralizing for him. Worked much better when he had a 1:1 tutor. Good luck

Sounds like motivation is the key issue, not intelligence. If quizzes and tests are based on the textbook questions, what about assigning them extra problems to do and rewards for doing them right. All mathnasium is doing is giving them worksheet after worksheet of practice problems. You can recreate that for free but give them something to work toward like $$$.

Anonymous wrote:Both kids are failing math- 9th grader, algebra 1 and 10th grader, algebra 2. I sent them to mathnasium a couple of months and it’s not helping.

Mathnasium has a system of sort, steps, which may have helped if we started in 7th grade but it’s not helping now with quizzes and tests. They have both kids in a foundation level (meets 2x a week per our contract) that seems far behind and impossible to catch up to the level of their current class level. Should I just drop it? So expensive but a private tutor would be more. We need a tutor, I feel 3x week.
Recommendation how to move forward. The kids just don’t get the concepts, they have short term memory too- coupled with a shitty teen attitude, I’m at a loss.

I tried Mathnasuim with my kid. No luck. My kid was fussing from day one but my initial thought was may be due DS never went to study out side school.
Watching for moth Mathnasuim was not for my kid. Now doing private tuition just before test or quizzes 30 minute or an hour. Targeted help was my kid needed.

We hired a private tutor for our 10th grader and while it was expensive ($85/hour) my kid was caught up and getting As and Bs within 4-6 weeks because the tutor could focus on precisely what foundational math my kid was missing, correct that and then get him caught up. In the end I feel like we saved money by doing 2 intense months of weekly tutoring and ending up with a kid who now likes math and feels comfortable with the concepts. We can always go back if he needs more help.

We've tried out Mathnasium and we felt that having to drive to the center was a lot more costly than we expected. We've had a variety of tutors from their center, while some were good others were just decent. Our kids did improve but the cost and time we spent driving to and back from the center wasn't really worth it. We've found better alternatives online and one that the kids have really enjoyed are Beestar. It has given them a lot of great ways to become better at specific math skills.

Anonymous wrote:Both kids are failing math- 9th grader, algebra 1 and 10th grader, algebra 2. I sent them to mathnasium a couple of months and it’s not helping.

Mathnasium has a system of sort, steps, which may have helped if we started in 7th grade but it’s not helping now with quizzes and tests. They have both kids in a foundation level (meets 2x a week per our contract) that seems far behind and impossible to catch up to the level of their current class level. Should I just drop it? So expensive but a private tutor would be more. We need a tutor, I feel 3x week.
Recommendation how to move forward. The kids just don’t get the concepts, they have short term memory too- coupled with a shitty teen attitude, I’m at a loss.

I'm not a fan of Mathnasium although I only used it at the elementary level. They aren't proactively working with the kids so if your kid doesn't ask for help they won't get the attention they need.

First, I'd talk with your school. My daughter failed the 8th grade SOL b/c of COVID issues and in 9th was in the basic level math and it was team taught. They also had Saturday school (if needed), peer tutoring, etc. And every teacher has the equivalent of office hours.

I would also get a private tutor. FCPS has a list or start asking around. We pay ours $100 an hour on an as needed basis.

Anonymous wrote:+1 to private tutoring to efficiently fill in the concepts they don't understand. I wonder if they were passed along in their pre-algebra classes without having mastered the content.

PP not from DMV again. I think passing along is common. From my observation, kids not in the advanced track (which I fell out of when I moved to MCPS in 7th grade due to curriculum misalignment) just learn things by rote and don't develop intuition or remember how concepts relate. Even though I ended up returning to all As on the regular track in HS in another state, I never really internalized the material. For those who are good in math or find it easy, imagine a different class that you disliked or felt meh about and from which you remember nothing. That's me.

This had impacts on my SATs and college scholarship potential. I had to self-remediate in my mid-20s to address my aversion to quant analysis to become a better employee and get grad school scholarships. Quant skills are correlated with income. In my mid-20s, I was actually successful in self-educating to a much higher percentile on the GMAT than the SAT.

My conclusions were that my immaturity, class speed moving way too fast, lack of additional drilling, and getting the less able math teachers (fast track got the best) all contributed to my issues. So that's why I'm paying a small fortune to send my kids to Mathnasium. Innumeracy/weak quant skills are critical limiters of success in some white-collar jobs. My older son is doing better than I did, on a faster track, with a worse pandemic-related background. So I conclude that Mathnasium helps over a long period of time.

In OP's case, with two children flunking, I think that school employee feedback should be an important input source. Expect more from your school and tutoring suppliers, while not expecting them to be accountable for your children's motivation and behavioral issues. Parents who advocate for their children usually do get more help unless they are rude/line crossing/blaming. So be polite as possible but firm in requesting more context/insight/support.

Anonymous wrote:Russian School of Math might be better. I used it for my son when he was in 7th grade and it helped.

We've used that. It's really good, but again...it's a program and takes time. It's also really hard in my experience (so can make things worse). These kids need a tutor that can look at the actual coursework and build up individualized plans to get them to competency there.