Anonymous
08/23/2023 21:26
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:I’m a home remodeler more than a custom home builder. That said I have done new builds as large as 12,000 square feet.
I wish the OP the best of luck.
On a good day with a good team it’s a tough process.
I would recommend that the OP have dry gunpowder ($$$) and flexibility in his living arrangements.
I could not finish a home in 4 months.
At four months I’d be happy to be framing and working toward having a roof.
The old adage - quality, price, and time - you can have any two is very, very accurate.
My advice - pick the two wisely.
This is an adage? The obvious answer is you pick quality and price.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 20:00
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:Thank you, OP. I find this very interesting and hope you're not driven away by a handful of nasty posters.
There's so little first-hand info on this process. Sharing things that we learned, and very interested in the constructive comments and suggestions, that hopefully help others.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 19:55
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Could you please elaborate more regarding the architect not designing to a particular spending limit and why costs are higher for doing fixtures and fittings through a builder? We're in the design phase with an architect for a major remodel and addition. Thank you.
I think this question is such a key one, and to answer it helps to talk about whether the home build is fixed price, or cost plus. Here's a good summary: https://lamontbros.com/fixed-price-vs-cost-plus-contract-whats-the-difference/
We did Cost-Plus--which is again, the road less traveled for how to build a house. Its more hands-on, because we're approving every single line item in the budget, including the builder's profit. The builder still recommends vendors/subcontractors. And a good builder is going to save you money a) because they're part of the trade and getting discounts that directly pass on to the homeowner and b) they'll help you find reputable providers, though you're free to use your own and the builder will vet them. The builder won't care if you spend $1,500 for a kitchen faucet, or $100 (although the bank is going to care-- a lot--because you've already submitted a budget to them and they are very motivated to not have a half built house because someone ran out of money.
If you do a fixed price, the homeowner wont' really be aware of the prices for any single component. And it seems to me that under this system the the builder is going to really make sure the homeowner doesn't overspend, because that fixed price includes the builder's profit. I could see how with a less than ethical builder, that could even turn into cost-cutting or even quality issues because the less they spend on building the house, the more profit for them. But, fixed price does transfer risk from the homeowner to the builder.
Either way, there will be several long, detail oriented meetings with the builder so they understand your preferences for everything from HVAC to sound systems. **They aren't making all of these decisions blind, if you tell them you want all foam insulation vs cellulose they will take that into account in getting bids. Once you sign the contract with the builder, they'll send you to their various vendors to make your selections (for example, Ferguson showroom for kitchen & bath) or, you can find your own. We mostly went with the builders suggestions because they know who does a good job--but we did find a few of our own as well, and our builder has been happy to work with them, or pointed out potential drawbacks we didn't think of.
As a type A, control freak who manages complex projects for a living (albeit in a totally different industry), with a love of excel sheets and Trello, we went Cost plus and I have vendor receipts for every single faucet, toilet, lighting component, and heat pump that's going into the place.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 18:58
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Interesting thread. I'm skeptical about the OP's plans. Fwiw we worked with the same architect as the OP on a major project. She is wonderful in every way.
But I'm still skeptical of the OP's plan. An architect doesn't design to a particular spending limit. We wound up spending about 3x on our project as much as we intended to at the outset. BTW we used the architect's recommendations to bid our project. Bids were all over the place in terms of costs. And the one we ultimately selected did some great work but also had some epic failures, big upcharges, and horrendous communications headaches along the way. And if you're doing all the fittings and fixtures through the builder, you're going to be paying a lot extra.
Could you please elaborate more regarding the architect not designing to a particular spending limit and why costs are higher for doing fixtures and fittings through a builder? We're in the design phase with an architect for a major remodel and addition. Thank you.
OP spoiler alert--we are pretty substantially along in the process. So some of what PPs are skeptical of has already been accomplished. We engaged the architect first, but shortly thereafter engaged our engineer and the builder. The architect, builder and homeowners are really partners in this process. A budget is a requirement, just like the number of bedrooms, or whether you want a fireplace in the ktichen, or whatever other specs you dream up. Actually, they are all related. I can't imagine starting this project and NOT having a budget, and having your professionals manage the project with an eye on it. But, you do adjust as you go along. There are opportunities to save money and (many) to spend more money along the way, but starting out with a set of plans that fits your budget (or comes in a little under is where it starts. As one example: designing a home with 3 bathrooms vs 5 bathrooms, aside from square footage means buying 5 sets of bathroom fixtures vs 3. So there are budget implications to that. The architect understand this, and they also will help you make different choices if you give them a $2M dollar budget vs $1M. They can also give a reality check. We initially thought we could build our house for about 150K less--the architect and builder were really helpful in keeping us realistic about what we wanted vs what was possible within our budget.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 18:52
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
I’m a home remodeler more than a custom home builder. That said I have done new builds as large as 12,000 square feet.
I wish the OP the best of luck.
On a good day with a good team it’s a tough process.
I would recommend that the OP have dry gunpowder ($$$) and flexibility in his living arrangements.
I could not finish a home in 4 months.
At four months I’d be happy to be framing and working toward having a roof.
The old adage - quality, price, and time - you can have any two is very, very accurate.
My advice - pick the two wisely.
I wish the OP the best of luck.
On a good day with a good team it’s a tough process.
I would recommend that the OP have dry gunpowder ($$$) and flexibility in his living arrangements.
I could not finish a home in 4 months.
At four months I’d be happy to be framing and working toward having a roof.
The old adage - quality, price, and time - you can have any two is very, very accurate.
My advice - pick the two wisely.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 16:28
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Thank you, OP. I find this very interesting and hope you're not driven away by a handful of nasty posters.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 16:28
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:Interesting thread. I'm skeptical about the OP's plans. Fwiw we worked with the same architect as the OP on a major project. She is wonderful in every way.
But I'm still skeptical of the OP's plan. An architect doesn't design to a particular spending limit. We wound up spending about 3x on our project as much as we intended to at the outset. BTW we used the architect's recommendations to bid our project. Bids were all over the place in terms of costs. And the one we ultimately selected did some great work but also had some epic failures, big upcharges, and horrendous communications headaches along the way. And if you're doing all the fittings and fixtures through the builder, you're going to be paying a lot extra.
Could you please elaborate more regarding the architect not designing to a particular spending limit and why costs are higher for doing fixtures and fittings through a builder? We're in the design phase with an architect for a major remodel and addition. Thank you.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 16:14
Subject: Re:Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP here--first clarification. In the realm of custom homes, going with a design-build firm that has builder, architect, permitting,and even the lot purchase in house is the generally the most expensive way to go. Lining up the architect, builder, etc saves money comparatively.
A move in ready home will definitely save on stress, but then of course you're not getting exactly what you want. And as far as total cost, an existing 5500 sq ft, 5 br/4.5 bath, 2 car garage home will run 800k-2M, depending on location. Compared to an existing build, similar specs in Bethesda, we'll be saving money. Compared to an existing build in Fredericksburg, for example, we'll be spending more.
One reason we're building: we have a family member who uses a wheelchair and I was finding it impossible to find universal access. By the time we looked at sinking 75-100K into making a home truly disability friendly, it made sense to build.
Here was how we found the lot: our budget meant that we skipped the close-in mo-co areas, where a sliver of a lot is going for over 300K, and that's if you're lucky. We wanted the following: good school district with diversity (we have young kids), convenient location for hybrid work for commutes into DC 2-3 times/week, if possible, existing sewer/water hookups, and 1/3 to a half acre. We found our lot that met all of these specs by setting up search parameters on Redfin, and purchased it back in 2020. Total cost: 82K
You’re spending 1.4 building a house on a lot that cost 82k? Seems way off.
OP wants to immediately lose 500k in equity on move-in day. DCUM is going to rip you apart OP, you should quit giving updates while you're ahead.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 16:02
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Interesting thread. I'm skeptical about the OP's plans. Fwiw we worked with the same architect as the OP on a major project. She is wonderful in every way.
But I'm still skeptical of the OP's plan. An architect doesn't design to a particular spending limit. We wound up spending about 3x on our project as much as we intended to at the outset. BTW we used the architect's recommendations to bid our project. Bids were all over the place in terms of costs. And the one we ultimately selected did some great work but also had some epic failures, big upcharges, and horrendous communications headaches along the way. And if you're doing all the fittings and fixtures through the builder, you're going to be paying a lot extra.
But I'm still skeptical of the OP's plan. An architect doesn't design to a particular spending limit. We wound up spending about 3x on our project as much as we intended to at the outset. BTW we used the architect's recommendations to bid our project. Bids were all over the place in terms of costs. And the one we ultimately selected did some great work but also had some epic failures, big upcharges, and horrendous communications headaches along the way. And if you're doing all the fittings and fixtures through the builder, you're going to be paying a lot extra.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 15:49
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:These "foundation to keys in four months" stories seem impossible. I've never seen a custom project take less than a year. I mean, acclimating the flooring to the conditioned space ought to take a couple of months, and isn't happening while the drywall is off-gassing the moisture, and that's months after the wall close in is done so the HVAC is turned on.
I live in the Oakland terrace part of Kensington and we absolutely see one million dollar plus new builds going up in a couple months. Also, to answer another pp, many of the tear downs seem to sell for around 400k.
These are not custom new builds with a homeowner involved making all the decisions and closely supervising. The big volume builders do it for sure though. No one around to catch anything or supervise the work.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 14:41
Subject: Re:Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:OP here--first clarification. In the realm of custom homes, going with a design-build firm that has builder, architect, permitting,and even the lot purchase in house is the generally the most expensive way to go. Lining up the architect, builder, etc saves money comparatively.
A move in ready home will definitely save on stress, but then of course you're not getting exactly what you want. And as far as total cost, an existing 5500 sq ft, 5 br/4.5 bath, 2 car garage home will run 800k-2M, depending on location. Compared to an existing build, similar specs in Bethesda, we'll be saving money. Compared to an existing build in Fredericksburg, for example, we'll be spending more.
One reason we're building: we have a family member who uses a wheelchair and I was finding it impossible to find universal access. By the time we looked at sinking 75-100K into making a home truly disability friendly, it made sense to build.
Here was how we found the lot: our budget meant that we skipped the close-in mo-co areas, where a sliver of a lot is going for over 300K, and that's if you're lucky. We wanted the following: good school district with diversity (we have young kids), convenient location for hybrid work for commutes into DC 2-3 times/week, if possible, existing sewer/water hookups, and 1/3 to a half acre. We found our lot that met all of these specs by setting up search parameters on Redfin, and purchased it back in 2020. Total cost: 82K
You’re spending 1.4 building a house on a lot that cost 82k? Seems way off.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 03:04
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:We decided to go take the road less traveled and build. First time we’ve done this and wanted to share in case others find this useful, and get advice from the DC hive too. Maybe others will chime in with their experiences, too.
Some of this will not be chronological, since we bought the lot some time ago. But I’ll try to cover stages from lot selection, site prep, construction and budget along the way.
Might split this into more than one thread, depending on how unwieldy this gets.
Other details: building somewhere in the DMV region, house will be about 5,500 feet including garage, and we have a budget of $1.4 m, all in.
And, we're NOT going with a design-build firm--that means more hands on managing this project, and having to find everyone from the architect, to the engineer, to the builder ourselves. But it should save us money.
Can it be done, on time and within budget? With our sanity intact? Tune in....
Congratulations OP, I hope you enjoy your new home.
A word of warning: this forum is filled with jealousy and pretense and around half of the posts will be mean and irrelevant. But there are still some of us who are interested
Anonymous
08/23/2023 00:34
Subject: Re:Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Total cost: 82K
As someone who went through the new build process in 2020 too, I was interested in this thread until I read that. OP, you're describing a situation/location that is not relevant to probably 95% of people on this forum
I mean, if your world begins and ends in downtown Bethesda, sure. But for the many people that work/live in Howard, Anne Arundel, PG, or further out in Montgomery Counties this is within normal.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 00:27
Subject: Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:These "foundation to keys in four months" stories seem impossible. I've never seen a custom project take less than a year. I mean, acclimating the flooring to the conditioned space ought to take a couple of months, and isn't happening while the drywall is off-gassing the moisture, and that's months after the wall close in is done so the HVAC is turned on.
I live in the Oakland terrace part of Kensington and we absolutely see one million dollar plus new builds going up in a couple months. Also, to answer another pp, many of the tear downs seem to sell for around 400k.
Anonymous
08/23/2023 00:23
Subject: Re:Come along as we build our custom home- lessons learned in real time.
Anonymous wrote:Total cost: 82K
As someone who went through the new build process in 2020 too, I was interested in this thread until I read that. OP, you're describing a situation/location that is not relevant to probably 95% of people on this forum