Anonymous
08/17/2023 08:06
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:50% is an F. An F is an F. Is an F.
you want to demand some kind of Super F?
No it isn’t. A 50% inflates the students GPA. If a student doesn’t show up to class and does absolutely nothing the entire year that student deserves a zero.
Agreed. As it is, the student could rip the test in half in front of the teacher and throw it in the trash and would still get a 50.
That would be a disciplinary matter, and should be addressed as such. Having a minimum score of 50 is just math, no different than how each section of the SAT has a minimum score of 200. Not every scale has to go to zero to be useful.
Anonymous
08/16/2023 18:26
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:50% is an F. An F is an F. Is an F.
you want to demand some kind of Super F?
No it isn’t. A 50% inflates the students GPA. If a student doesn’t show up to class and does absolutely nothing the entire year that student deserves a zero.
Agreed. As it is, the student could rip the test in half in front of the teacher and throw it in the trash and would still get a 50.
Anonymous
08/16/2023 15:29
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/69e8a356-393a-11ee-be2e-0cc7309dc5b8?shareToken=3a5551270297afd4971127896429e48f
Colleges in the UK are experiencing record drop-out rates ending up in students saddled with debt and no degree due to lax grading policies.
We have the same thing here in districts that adhere to open enrollment policies and 50% minimum grades.
Open enrollment is purportedly designed to prevent teacher bias from shutting out students from courses, but in fact ensures that students who aren't ready for the course will sign up for it anyway, resulting in pressure on teachers to lower standards and/or inflate grades while the student learns little or nothing. If you're worried about teacher bias , give all students automatically graded competency exams that they have to score specific grades on to enroll in specific classes.
It doesn't help disadvantaged students in the long run to just give them a pass. Everyone has to show competency at some point down the line. It's also deeply prejudicial to cast a shadow on the achievement of bright, hardworking students from disadvantaged backgrounds who absolutely belong in those courses and legitimately earned their grade to lump them in with privileged but not too bright nor studious kids who also milk these policies.
50% minima also outrageously inflate averages and mask lack of mastery.
These policies are bad for the country on so many levels.
Not to bring people off their talking points, but what exactly is "open enrollment?" I'm assuming it refers to practices that allows students to enroll in advanced courses in MS/HS without meeting the prerequisites for them, or perhaps by not even having formal prerequisites?
To what degree is this being practiced? (From personal experience up to MS in VA I have to say I haven't seen it: access to advanced Math and English, for instance, is strictly gatekept, much to the detriment of many DCUM posters who believe their child was misplaced. Is this something that starts in HS? Which courses are open enrollment in that they don't require prerequisites? Do they allows kid who haven't taken Algebra I to take Calculus? Or can someone take French AP without having taken French I through IV?)
Please explain what the actual problem is for those not familiar with it.
My experience is FCPS middle school math. Anyone who passes math 7 seems to skip prealgebra and enroll in algebra, whether they passed with an A and a 570 or a C and a 401. I have classes full of 8th grade algebra students who can’t solve a 2 step equation every year.
Meanwhile admin says, “Isn’t open enrollment great? It allows kids to challenge themselves!”
Anonymous
08/16/2023 15:10
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:This isn't just about kids getting 0% or 50%.
It's also kids on the high end cramming for a unit test and getting 90% and then forgetting the next day, not learning. Disappearing final exams.
It's colleges who don't care about educating, and just want tuition/grant funding to pay administrators.
This too.
Anonymous
08/16/2023 15:09
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:50% is an F. An F is an F. Is an F.
you want to demand some kind of Super F?
No it isn’t. A 50% inflates the students GPA. If a student doesn’t show up to class and does absolutely nothing the entire year that student deserves a zero.
Anonymous
08/16/2023 15:06
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:OP may not have been clear but they have a valid point. Minimum grade of 50% along with the push for equitable grading has resulted in grade inflation in almost all public schools. That combined with open enrollment in AP classes tends to have those classes move slower, hence the constant nagging from parents to start school in mid-August or earlier so their little darling can do well on the AP exam.
Education needs to be returned to a meritocracy in the US, as it is in the UK. Have you kid take a semester or year abroad at a quality UK university and they will see how easy they have it in the US.
This.
Anonymous
08/15/2023 20:06
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Open enrollment means that to the extent there is a course sequence, barefly passing the previous course entitles you to enroll in any level of the next course that is available even though you have functionally zero chance of succeeding in it. For instance, you passed English 10 with a D and you are therefore entitled to enroll in AP Lang in 11th. Or you passed Algebra 2 with a D and enroll in Precalc Honors.
In practice, though, not many kids who got Ds in Algebra 2 want to take Honors precalc. It’s much more common to see an ambitious kid with a 4.0 bristle at the idea that the school might intervene to prevent him from taking 8 APs simultaneously as a junior.
Yes, but that one kid and a couple of others will hog up 25% of your time and energy in extra help, parent contact, remediation, and retakes to no avail. And the ambitious kids' with the 8 APs are constantly whining about the workload, as are their parents who are shocked, shocked! that they have to stay up until 2 AM every night to get their work done.
That's actually not the issue IME. Math is actually the one subject where most kids seem to be self-selecting into the right class, or at least only choose the wrong class once. The bigger issue where we are is English and History. The less smart, studious kids still feel the need to take honors english and history and what this has basically done is made it such that there is no such thing as honors in those subjects.
Anonymous
08/15/2023 19:04
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Open enrollment means that to the extent there is a course sequence, barefly passing the previous course entitles you to enroll in any level of the next course that is available even though you have functionally zero chance of succeeding in it. For instance, you passed English 10 with a D and you are therefore entitled to enroll in AP Lang in 11th. Or you passed Algebra 2 with a D and enroll in Precalc Honors.
In practice, though, not many kids who got Ds in Algebra 2 want to take Honors precalc. It’s much more common to see an ambitious kid with a 4.0 bristle at the idea that the school might intervene to prevent him from taking 8 APs simultaneously as a junior.
Yes, but that one kid and a couple of others will hog up 25% of your time and energy in extra help, parent contact, remediation, and retakes to no avail. And the ambitious kids' with the 8 APs are constantly whining about the workload, as are their parents who are shocked, shocked! that they have to stay up until 2 AM every night to get their work done.
Anonymous
08/14/2023 19:33
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:Open enrollment means that to the extent there is a course sequence, barefly passing the previous course entitles you to enroll in any level of the next course that is available even though you have functionally zero chance of succeeding in it. For instance, you passed English 10 with a D and you are therefore entitled to enroll in AP Lang in 11th. Or you passed Algebra 2 with a D and enroll in Precalc Honors.
In practice, though, not many kids who got Ds in Algebra 2 want to take Honors precalc. It’s much more common to see an ambitious kid with a 4.0 bristle at the idea that the school might intervene to prevent him from taking 8 APs simultaneously as a junior.
Anonymous
08/14/2023 19:23
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Open enrollment means that to the extent there is a course sequence, barefly passing the previous course entitles you to enroll in any level of the next course that is available even though you have functionally zero chance of succeeding in it. For instance, you passed English 10 with a D and you are therefore entitled to enroll in AP Lang in 11th. Or you passed Algebra 2 with a D and enroll in Precalc Honors.
Anonymous
08/14/2023 15:04
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/69e8a356-393a-11ee-be2e-0cc7309dc5b8?shareToken=3a5551270297afd4971127896429e48f
Colleges in the UK are experiencing record drop-out rates ending up in students saddled with debt and no degree due to lax grading policies.
We have the same thing here in districts that adhere to open enrollment policies and 50% minimum grades.
Open enrollment is purportedly designed to prevent teacher bias from shutting out students from courses, but in fact ensures that students who aren't ready for the course will sign up for it anyway, resulting in pressure on teachers to lower standards and/or inflate grades while the student learns little or nothing. If you're worried about teacher bias , give all students automatically graded competency exams that they have to score specific grades on to enroll in specific classes.
It doesn't help disadvantaged students in the long run to just give them a pass. Everyone has to show competency at some point down the line. It's also deeply prejudicial to cast a shadow on the achievement of bright, hardworking students from disadvantaged backgrounds who absolutely belong in those courses and legitimately earned their grade to lump them in with privileged but not too bright nor studious kids who also milk these policies.
50% minima also outrageously inflate averages and mask lack of mastery.
These policies are bad for the country on so many levels.
Not to bring people off their talking points, but what exactly is "open enrollment?" I'm assuming it refers to practices that allows students to enroll in advanced courses in MS/HS without meeting the prerequisites for them, or perhaps by not even having formal prerequisites?
To what degree is this being practiced? (From personal experience up to MS in VA I have to say I haven't seen it: access to advanced Math and English, for instance, is strictly gatekept, much to the detriment of many DCUM posters who believe their child was misplaced. Is this something that starts in HS? Which courses are open enrollment in that they don't require prerequisites? Do they allows kid who haven't taken Algebra I to take Calculus? Or can someone take French AP without having taken French I through IV?)
Please explain what the actual problem is for those not familiar with it.
Anonymous
08/14/2023 13:09
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:You idiots need to do the math. The reason for 50% is so -- maybe if they DO work really, really hard they have a (mathematical) prayer of bringing it up to a D
No, this isn't about math. It is all about equity based grading or standards based grading, or whatever buzz word you would like to apply. Now you have a system where a lot of graded assignments don't matter. Kids can only improve. Get that one grade that is good, preferably in the later part of the year and nothing else matters. But the kid who has been doing all A or A+ work all year, misses an assignment then boom, the grade drops to an A- or B+. All of a sudden, everybody has a near equal grade. Its happening in FCPS and other places like Baltimore, who were quicker to adopt it, so they have already closed the achievement gap. Now no student is able to pass grade level tests in reading or math. Its the future of public education.
Parents need to pay attention to what is happening in the schools!
Anonymous
08/14/2023 12:43
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:You idiots need to do the math. The reason for 50% is so -- maybe if they DO work really, really hard they have a (mathematical) prayer of bringing it up to a D
If you do nothing, you should get nothing. Teachers are expected to bend over backwards. If a student does nothing and we are going to give them a zero, we have to make multiple attempts to contact their parents about each zero assignment. Multiple that by 20+ students and we have no time for anything else like planning, grading, meetings, etc.
Anonymous
08/14/2023 12:37
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
Anonymous wrote:You idiots need to do the math. The reason for 50% is so -- maybe if they DO work really, really hard they have a (mathematical) prayer of bringing it up to a D
Someone needs to work on their math but it's not us...
Anonymous
08/14/2023 12:31
Subject: This is why open enrollment and 50% minimum grades need to stop
You idiots need to do the math. The reason for 50% is so -- maybe if they DO work really, really hard they have a (mathematical) prayer of bringing it up to a D