Anonymous wrote:I'm not diminishing the Vandy football player behavior which resulted in criminal trials. But I think you're kidding yourself if you think that doesn't happen or can't happen at any other school. Every school has athletes who believe they're above the law, rich kids who've never been punished for anything in their lives who they they can do whatever. Pretty sure one of our supreme court justices fell in that category and went to Yale. Pretty sure there was a swimmer at Stanford in recent years doing the same things. This stuff is everywhere and I don't think Vandy v. Georgetown matters for that reason, unless you're thinking Gtown is close to home, she'll just escape home. And if you're thinking that, I'd caution against it because she needs to deal with this stuff in life, whether it's her T14 law school or biglaw or wherever else.

To be clear, we're not trying to shelter her. She's an adult and has attended a huge school and been in a sorority for a year. I think we all recognize that sexual assault happens on all campuses, no matter how elite and is often swept under the rug. (I attended a lower-tier Ivy, and a male student alleged to have committed date rape was quietly asked to leave. He transferred to Yale. The consequence of his behavior, a higher ranked school. At least he isn't on the Supreme Court, yet).

What I was trying to assess and other posters have addressed is the campus culture toward women generally, not sexual assault. To be as high caliber as it is, I do worry that Vandy campus culture toward women seems paradoxically regressive in certain ways (not just because of the men but the women as well) -- maybe it's a southern thing (and I grew up in the South before any southerners here get y'alls backs up), maybe it's that 40% of students participate in Greek life, maybe it's being in the SEC.

If it were a big state school in the South, I wouldn't have asked. My D has struggled with an eating disorder, and it would be nice if she could be in an environment where she can just work hard and enjoy herself without undue pressure toward constantly having to look or dress a certain way to fit in. I recognize that might be unrealistic. Thanks.

I have already posted multiple times in this thread. I apologize if it is too much.

Unless weather is a major concern, I suggest rethinking your & your daughter's stance regarding Northwestern University. I cannot recommend one over the other two options for your daughter, but I think that your perception of Northwestern as a pressure cooker school are not well founded in the case of your daughter's academic interests.

Nevertheless, each school has positives and negatives. As a sophomore at Dartmouth College recently told me, that student has learned to stay out of basements and attics.

I randomly know of 3 kids who got into Vandy for next fall as sophomore transfers. I didn’t realize transferring after only one year was popular and that Vandy took so many transfers. Average students in high school and looking to go to a higher ranked college than where they were accepted out of high school.

Vanderbilt. Not even a question.

Get out of the DC who do you know mentality and forge your own path. In doing so, you might figure out you’re not the person you thought you were.
first-hand experience here.

Anonymous wrote:Some really great options for your daughter, OP. It really should be a matter of where she feels like she will fit best. I will share this: my niece transferred from Vanderbilt because of some of the concerns in your post. She's a bubbly, bright blonde from a wealthy family and the emphasis on appearance and Greek life was even too much for her. She also thought she was interested in Big Law and went a T3 law school. Like Vanderbilt, she also decided Big Law was not for her and after a couple of years made a switch. Perhaps Vanderbilt has changed a lot in the past 8 years but based on current students that I know there, it hasn't change that much. I guess my point is that you really can't be 100% sure about what will be best and so much can change over time. Your daughter should pick wherever she thinks she will be happiest. Good luck with her decision.

This is very helpful. Thank you.

Some really great options for your daughter, OP. It really should be a matter of where she feels like she will fit best. I will share this: my niece transferred from Vanderbilt because of some of the concerns in your post. She's a bubbly, bright blonde from a wealthy family and the emphasis on appearance and Greek life was even too much for her. She also thought she was interested in Big Law and went a T3 law school. Like Vanderbilt, she also decided Big Law was not for her and after a couple of years made a switch. Perhaps Vanderbilt has changed a lot in the past 8 years but based on current students that I know there, it hasn't change that much. I guess my point is that you really can't be 100% sure about what will be best and so much can change over time. Your daughter should pick wherever she thinks she will be happiest. Good luck with her decision.

I'm not diminishing the Vandy football player behavior which resulted in criminal trials. But I think you're kidding yourself if you think that doesn't happen or can't happen at any other school. Every school has athletes who believe they're above the law, rich kids who've never been punished for anything in their lives who they they can do whatever. Pretty sure one of our supreme court justices fell in that category and went to Yale. Pretty sure there was a swimmer at Stanford in recent years doing the same things. This stuff is everywhere and I don't think Vandy v. Georgetown matters for that reason, unless you're thinking Gtown is close to home, she'll just escape home. And if you're thinking that, I'd caution against it because she needs to deal with this stuff in life, whether it's her T14 law school or biglaw or wherever else.

Anonymous wrote: Point is that school cultures are important. Often helpful to research a school's newspaper prior to matriculating.

I agree 100%.

Problems involving the victimization of women occur even at some small schools. Another website posted a link to a recent (within a year or two) Williams College 'residents only dorm restriction" due to multiple & repeated reports of covertly putting substances into women's drinks. Amherst College has had some well publicized racial incidents. Suicides at this school, other bad actions at that school.

Point is that school cultures are important. Often helpful to research a school's newspaper prior to matriculating.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thank you. That's very helpful information.

I do think some of the pressure-cooker reputation for Northwestern is from STEM / Econ and the quarter system as well as pretty well known grade deflation (at least in those areas).

Did you or one of your children attend Northwestern?

I'm a BigLaw refugee and have cautioned her. I've got a couple years to convince her.

Yes. More than one extended family member. Undergraduate and graduate MBA/Law).

All loved the school, but all are well disciplined (hard workers) & bright.

However, I do not want to influence you/your daughter's decision. Everyone that we know who has attended Vanderbilt or Northwestern had positive experiences. Georgetown too, but a bit more mixed due to housing issues and social issues. Academics at all 3 are outstanding. In my view, Nashville and Evanston/Chicago are wonderful, but Washington DC is better for government internships as they are available year round.

Appearance is important at Vanderbilt. It's the South and this is quite common. Better weather & lots of opportunities for exercise & outdoor activities.

To a certain extent, fit is important, but all are National Universities and all offer a wide variety of social & academic options. Since COA is not a factor, it comes down to personal preference.

If I knew your daughter's current school, I might be able to draw more meaningful distinctions or make a recommendation.

Thank you for such great insight! It's greatly appreciated, as are the others posts people have made.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What does “appearance is important” mean any Vandy?

See point #8 in OP's thread opening post.

Whether it's accurate or not (and is an issue at many schools), some posts and articles suggest that there is a lot of pressure for women always to achieve some ideal related to their appearance - dressing up for class, high prevalence of eating disorders. etc.

The following is a link to an article from a few years ago in the Vanderbilt newspaper that raises these concerns.

https://vanderbilthustler.com/2019/01/13/our-campus-culture-pressures-women-into-unhealthy-relationships-with-food-and-their-bodies/#:~:text=Vanderbilt%20has%20long%20been%20known,deemed%20“hot”%20become%20members.

"The Vanderbilt Hustler"--poor choice of a name for the Vandy school newspaper.

The article, however, is well done & raises legitimate concerns.

Within the last couple of years, Vanderbilt had an issue with sexual assault & cover-ups. I think that it involved athletes on the football team and Vanderbilt co-eds. Was written about extensively on some websites. "Vanderbilt Rape case" wikipedia. The four Vanderbilt football players convicted received sentences in the range of 15 to 17 years. The incident occurred in 2013. Truly disgusting & shocking.

Made news as the criminal trials were in 2017 7 2018 and appeals may have been filed since then.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What does “appearance is important” mean any Vandy?

See point #8 in OP's thread opening post.

Whether it's accurate or not (and is an issue at many schools), some posts and articles suggest that there is a lot of pressure for women always to achieve some ideal related to their appearance - dressing up for class, high prevalence of eating disorders. etc.

The following is a link to an article from a few years ago in the Vanderbilt newspaper that raises these concerns.

https://vanderbilthustler.com/2019/01/13/our-campus-culture-pressures-women-into-unhealthy-relationships-with-food-and-their-bodies/#:~:text=Vanderbilt%20has%20long%20been%20known,deemed%20“hot”%20become%20members.

"The Vanderbilt Hustler"--poor choice of a name for the Vandy school newspaper.

The article, however, is well done & raises legitimate concerns.

Within the last couple of years, Vanderbilt had an issue with sexual assault & cover-ups. I think that it involved athletes on the football team and Vanderbilt co-eds. Was written about extensively on some websites. "Vanderbilt Rape case" wikipedia. The four Vanderbilt football players convicted received sentences in the range of 15 to 17 years. The incident occurred in 2013. Truly disgusting & shocking.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What does “appearance is important” mean any Vandy?

See point #8 in OP's thread opening post.

Whether it's accurate or not (and is an issue at many schools), some posts and articles suggest that there is a lot of pressure for women always to achieve some ideal related to their appearance - dressing up for class, high prevalence of eating disorders. etc.

The following is a link to an article from a few years ago in the Vanderbilt newspaper that raises these concerns.

https://vanderbilthustler.com/2019/01/13/our-campus-culture-pressures-women-into-unhealthy-relationships-with-food-and-their-bodies/#:~:text=Vanderbilt%20has%20long%20been%20known,deemed%20“hot”%20become%20members.

Anonymous wrote:What does “appearance is important” mean any Vandy?

See point #8 in OP's thread opening post.

Anonymous wrote:What does “appearance is important” mean any Vandy?

OP raised this concern/issue in her thread opening post.