Anonymous wrote:Anyone who wants to submit a score is still welcome too. The panic over test optional is very telling, as is the mindset that private universities could somehow be forced to consider standardized testing in their admissions criteria

What exactly does it "tell?"

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are really concerned about at most 5% of US schools. Why would the public and colleges in general care about low admit schools? Also, the current system works for highly selective schools.

I'm not OP, but I don't think your 5% is true at all. Many schools that were once "safeties" are now getting difficult to get into. Schools like UMD, JMU, U South Carolina, Auburn are all schools I've seen posted about here, or experienced with my own kids'/their friends.

Anyone who wants to submit a score is still welcome too. The panic over test optional is very telling, as is the mindset that private universities could somehow be forced to consider standardized testing in their admissions criteria

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are really concerned about at most 5% of US schools. Why would the public and colleges in general care about low admit schools? Also, the current system works for highly selective schools.

THIS! Most people aren’t applying to the ivies and top schools that are really competitive. The practices shouldn’t be built to make a few feel better.

Most people are applying to a handful of normal schools. The systole works for the vast majority. You just can’t see it with blinders on.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our private school limits apps to 12. Was 7 just a few years ago, then 9. Went up to 12 during Covid.

Some parents don't like it, because some parents dont like anything. But my son was talking to a regional AO, wondering if he gets dinged because he can't apply ED for financial reasons, and wondering how can he let schools know he's serious. And the AO said, "your school limits apps so we already know an application from Your High School is a serious application - don't worry"

The school limits it because their staff is lazy which is bizarre when they have separate college counselors. There should be no limit.

You don't really believe that's the reason.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. Tax merit aid*
2. Require an insane amount of disclosures from colleges regarding their financial aid packages. Ideally, before applying, every family should be able to know how much exactly it would cost them.

These two in combination will eliminate a huge deal of guessing regarding finances and reduce the number of apps that the kids are currently throwing in because if the uncertainty around the cost.

*On the merit aid part - this will eliminate the stupid games where the sticker price is $80K all in, but 98% of students receive merit aid.

Merit aid is taxed if it goes beyond the COA. This happens if a student receives multiple merit scholarships and zero need based FA.

Yes, and the portion that covers room and board is taxed too, but if the college sets the sticker price at $80K and gives almost everyone $30K "scholarships", there are no negative consequences.

Eliminate the Common App. Make every student apply to each school individually. Set minimum academic standards like they do in Canada. And make test scores mandatory again. Problem solved,

But it will never happen. School rankings and perceptions of prestige are largely dependent upon a sense of exclusivity. The more that apply, the more that get rejected, the happier the university. It's why every mediocre high school student in the country gets mail from Chicago, Northeastern, Tulane and all the other schools looking to game the system to lower their admission rates. A 3 percent rate is inevitable, probably next year. Even Vanderbilt's regular decision rate is now 4.2 percent. Can only image what it is at Stanford and Harvard. The system has run amuck. As the admission rates get ever lower, the logical thing to do is to apply to ever more schools. Colleges love it but it sucks for everyone else. You can't rationally apply in this environment. Which is why everyone is going ED now but the same dynamic will follow that strategy as well. The system is broken. It's chaos for families, but meanwhile the colleges are very pleased with themselves.

Anonymous wrote:1. Tax merit aid*
2. Require an insane amount of disclosures from colleges regarding their financial aid packages. Ideally, before applying, every family should be able to know how much exactly it would cost them.

These two in combination will eliminate a huge deal of guessing regarding finances and reduce the number of apps that the kids are currently throwing in because if the uncertainty around the cost.

*On the merit aid part - this will eliminate the stupid games where the sticker price is $80K all in, but 98% of students receive merit aid.

Merit aid is taxed if it goes beyond the COA. This happens if a student receives multiple merit scholarships and zero need based FA.

OP, you are really concerned about at most 5% of US schools. Why would the public and colleges in general care about low admit schools? Also, the current system works for highly selective schools.

Anonymous wrote:1. Tax merit aid*
2. Require an insane amount of disclosures from colleges regarding their financial aid packages. Ideally, before applying, every family should be able to know how much exactly it would cost them.

These two in combination will eliminate a huge deal of guessing regarding finances and reduce the number of apps that the kids are currently throwing in because if the uncertainty around the cost.

*On the merit aid part - this will eliminate the stupid games where the sticker price is $80K all in, but 98% of students receive merit aid.

This is stupid and unlikely to even TOUCH the issue mentioned in the OP.

Anonymous wrote:Eliminate the Common App and this problem will be solved

I agree but never going to happen because schools and the vast majority of students/families like it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One idea:

I think we need to place a soft limit on apps. Here's how.

All schools have to be on the common app.

Students can apply to 9 schools free of charge

Pro 1: while not an ED situation, schools know this applicant is serious enough about their school to put it on this pretty tidy list. Safeties go back to being safeties.

Pro 2: Schools may not want to encourage 100k+ apps.. Will start to cost them too much to process. Marketing may become more targeted.

After the 9 school limit, students can apply to additional schools but the common app will have a box that auto-fills how many schools each applicant has applied to. This gets filled in for every applicant applying to more than 9 schools, and says exactly how many apps this kid is applying to this cycle. Would update all schools as you apply (ie so that app you send in in November will have how many apps would apply to then, but that box updates throughout the cycle).

Pro: This gives schools key data that's lacking now. For some kids who clearly need a lot of FA, schools may think this applicant is responsibly chasing merit. Other schools may get used to saying in presentations, "we think 12 schools is reasonable". And "Of course, we take a second look at those applicants who have done their research and have us on their short list". Most schools won't take the kids applying bazooka-style, improves yield.

Also, every app after the 9 is $50 and that goes into a fund for community colleges. I think this could be something like 20-50mm a year min.

Wont work because schools like getting 100K applications. It makes them appear to be highly ranked and desirable. They are still getting an excellent group of freshman so they don't care if they need to reject 95%. Can't control what private schools do really

This is a big part of the problem. The priority shouldn't be the "highly ranked and desirable" level of the school . . . Jesus.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In a country where we can't limit the number of automatic rifles a person owns, it seems highly unlikely that we're going to impose limits on the number of college applications students can submit.

I don't really understand this. There are all kinds of rules btw college board, fed rules with colleges (npc, etc), financing and loans. This group just thinks we can't have NEW rules. Sure we could. We likely will.

The fed rules you mentioned are in place because of federal aid. What you are proposing doesn’t directly involve federal funds or Title IV or Title IX.

You are proposing that the federal government limit competition or influence the higher education market. How do you legally think this will happen?

Eliminate the Common App and this problem will be solved

1. Tax merit aid*
2. Require an insane amount of disclosures from colleges regarding their financial aid packages. Ideally, before applying, every family should be able to know how much exactly it would cost them.

These two in combination will eliminate a huge deal of guessing regarding finances and reduce the number of apps that the kids are currently throwing in because if the uncertainty around the cost.

*On the merit aid part - this will eliminate the stupid games where the sticker price is $80K all in, but 98% of students receive merit aid.