Anonymous wrote:
1. I agree entirely.

2. The Ivy League troll is still active and their stories are false: it's always a disappointed parent with a child at an Ivy who is either miserable and depressed, or about to drop out. Please report them to Jeff.

3. The "hothoused child" who has been built from scratch by Tiger Parents is a myth that needs to die. It is not possible to do that without the child's buy-in. Any child would rebel! The children who are intelligent and functional enough to go to an Ivy, and are prepared by their parents to that end, usually do very well there! BECAUSE they're prepared. My husband tends to be an Asian Tiger Parent, and we know many Asian Tiger Parents. The children are all well-adjusted and ready for any college.

4. The only person who ever told me that the Ivy League wasn't worth it was a middle-aged Indian-American first gen who felt discriminated against at Harvard during her student days there - she said she was made to feel less than the wealthy white Americans who referenced a world she was not part of. I listened politely, but as a multi-racial person who has lived in several countries, in sometimes rather snobby and xenophobic ones, I thought that this should not stop non-whites from applying... quite the contrary!

This is absolutely false. When a parent withholds love from a child early on and only grants it when the child is achieving, the child will do anything for the love. Period. To assume they would rebel is naive.

By the time they are an adult, they will feel resentment.

Stupid thread.

Anonymous wrote:You left out the very important precursor: "You don't want to hear this, and probably cannot process it at this stage, but it is far better for her to develop a strong social sense of self, have fun and friendships, and feel in control of her own life than is is to go to any particular college." Those are they very things she's developing now by not focusing all her energy on getting into Harvard to please somebody else.

I don't think the poster was saying UMD would make the child less depressed than Harvard per se. It's the path to Harvard and the expectation to get into Harvard at the expense of self.So saying the depressed Harvard student would be depressed (or as depressed) at UMD isn't fair because the future college student is developing her sense of self and attending to her current and future mental health by not putting all effort and hope for her future on Harvard.

Agency is a big deal for teens. Have you looked into the work of Madeline Levine? https://madelinelevine.com/books/the-price-of-privilege/

I was just going to reference this book. She came an spoke in McLean years ago and it was so impactful on how we decided to parent around academics and acheivement.

1. I agree entirely.

2. The Ivy League troll is still active and their stories are false: it's always a disappointed parent with a child at an Ivy who is either miserable and depressed, or about to drop out. Please report them to Jeff.

3. The "hothoused child" who has been built from scratch by Tiger Parents is a myth that needs to die. It is not possible to do that without the child's buy-in. Any child would rebel! The children who are intelligent and functional enough to go to an Ivy, and are prepared by their parents to that end, usually do very well there! BECAUSE they're prepared. My husband tends to be an Asian Tiger Parent, and we know many Asian Tiger Parents. The children are all well-adjusted and ready for any college.

4. The only person who ever told me that the Ivy League wasn't worth it was a middle-aged Indian-American first gen who felt discriminated against at Harvard during her student days there - she said she was made to feel less than the wealthy white Americans who referenced a world she was not part of. I listened politely, but as a multi-racial person who has lived in several countries, in sometimes rather snobby and xenophobic ones, I thought that this should not stop non-whites from applying... quite the contrary!

I think it’s about the size and culture of the school. It’s Alonso about being prepared and finding a good fit with academic peers. I chose a small private school over a large public one. When I struggled freshman year, people noticed and intervened. I was around academic peers so I was challenged, but not overwhelmed and intimidated.

It is unlikely that a child who gets into a very competitive and rigorous school is going to completely burn out or flounder. All of the work they did to gain entry should have prepared them - unless it was actually the parent propping them up and doing some of the work. If a child ends up isolated and burned out, it is likely a mental health issue. I would argue that small, selective schools that naturally attract high achieving students are better prepared to monitor and intervene when students are in crisis or heading there.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think if you attend an elite school but aren’t really qualified to be there (maybe admitted due to diversity, geography, sports) it can really backfire.

The really interesting question, though (and the one that launched this thread) is whether it’s worthwhile to pressure and prep and groom a 97th percentile kid who would rather hang out with her friends, so that in her application she appears to be a 99th percentile kid and gets admitted. Is that kid “qualified to be there” or no? Will the pressure-cooker approach backfire?

These schools are so hard to get in though I feel like it’s an unlikely problem. Kids who are naturally motivated and can totally handle it get rejected 90 pct of the time so it’s hard to see how a slacker being prodded by parents makes the cut. The issue today is kids who are extremely qualified and capable being iced out of top schools and landing in somewhat less rigorous situations

Then it seems like OP is clearly wrong: the mom on the other thread should let her kid relax and be happy.

So my family has both types of kids. One who went to a HYP and one who went to the state flagship. The one who went to HYP did actually have a mental breakdown during college. But it was very self imposed, because student was super type-A high achiever. Student was used to being top of the class and one of the more intense students in school. In the environment at the HYP intensity was ramped up in ways no one could have predicted. Some of this was personality, some was environment.

State flagship kid was in general more laid back, and had a very happy time in college. But this was also due to personality AND environment.

So it's not one or the other. The intense kids will be most likely be intense no matter where they end up. Some of this is self selecting.

They both ended up happy and functional adults with careers.

Anonymous wrote:Ives are actually easier to graduate. It’s the large flagship state schools that are cutthroat.

I think it’s all major dependent …like premed is pressure cooker no matter what, but there are easy majors at every school too.

Ives are actually easier to graduate. It’s the large flagship state schools that are cutthroat.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think if you attend an elite school but aren’t really qualified to be there (maybe admitted due to diversity, geography, sports) it can really backfire.

The really interesting question, though (and the one that launched this thread) is whether it’s worthwhile to pressure and prep and groom a 97th percentile kid who would rather hang out with her friends, so that in her application she appears to be a 99th percentile kid and gets admitted. Is that kid “qualified to be there” or no? Will the pressure-cooker approach backfire?

These schools are so hard to get in though I feel like it’s an unlikely problem. Kids who are naturally motivated and can totally handle it get rejected 90 pct of the time so it’s hard to see how a slacker being prodded by parents makes the cut. The issue today is kids who are extremely qualified and capable being iced out of top schools and landing in somewhat less rigorous situations

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IDK.. I have a friend who went to Harvard and hated every minute of it. They hated the people, and I think the weather made them unhappy, too. They were also originally from CA.

They transferred to Cal and was much happier.

Obviously, Cal is pretty prestigious, too, but I do think certain personalities wouldn't like certain types of schools.

Sorry, no one ever transfers from an ivy to UC - unless it's for FA reasons. Even that is sketchy bc ivies are cheaper than a UC for lower and middle income families.

Ivies giving significant FA is a relatively new thing.

Anonymous wrote:I think if you attend an elite school but aren’t really qualified to be there (maybe admitted due to diversity, geography, sports) it can really backfire.

The really interesting question, though (and the one that launched this thread) is whether it’s worthwhile to pressure and prep and groom a 97th percentile kid who would rather hang out with her friends, so that in her application she appears to be a 99th percentile kid and gets admitted. Is that kid “qualified to be there” or no? Will the pressure-cooker approach backfire?

Anonymous wrote:IDK.. I have a friend who went to Harvard and hated every minute of it. They hated the people, and I think the weather made them unhappy, too. They were also originally from CA.

They transferred to Cal and was much happier.

Obviously, Cal is pretty prestigious, too, but I do think certain personalities wouldn't like certain types of schools.

Cal is more of a pressure cooker and the weather isn’t great either…bay area is pretty gray

Anonymous wrote:IDK.. I have a friend who went to Harvard and hated every minute of it. They hated the people, and I think the weather made them unhappy, too. They were also originally from CA.

They transferred to Cal and was much happier.

Obviously, Cal is pretty prestigious, too, but I do think certain personalities wouldn't like certain types of schools.

Sorry, no one ever transfers from an ivy to UC - unless it's for FA reasons. Even that is sketchy bc ivies are cheaper than a UC for lower and middle income families.

I think if you attend an elite school but aren’t really qualified to be there (maybe admitted due to diversity, geography, sports) it can really backfire.