Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 11:57     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:She’s 12. Teach her to speak up for herself. “Grandma, when you say things like that it sounds like you’re embarrassed by me because of my hair, and how I look.” “Grandma, if you keep saying g things like that, it’ll make me not want to spend time with you.”


There is an unequal power of balance and you saying it like it’s so simple for a 12 year old to say these things is disingenuous.


No it’s not. There are reasons I don’t take shit from people, and one is that I watched my parents stick up for themselves and set boundaries growing up, and the other is that my parents gave me the words to do it myself when I got upset with someone, and then backed me up.


Here's the thing - you think that your approach fits all situations, or for you - "taking no shit" is the best approach. I'd argue that if you stepped back and actually was more mature in the process of these types of engagements, you'd acknowledge that you still have some learning to do as well.

Confrontation and "using your words" as you put it means that you want "x" outcome. In this scenario, you think that by saying something to MIL by a 12 year old is going to somehow change or modify MILs behavior for a more positive experience - for their relationship. Odds are - they won't and will make for a completely experience for OPs kid and also make for a more awkward and even worse relationship between the two. Note that OP says she's been like this and has the same relationship with her own son - for 30+ years.

So really - the right thing to do is for the OP to step in and first ask her 12 year old if she wants the relationship AND if she wants her to intervene. She used her words - she told her mom. OP can now say to MIL with her kids blessing that she wants a good relationship for the two of them and her DD loves spending time with her but OP is not going to continue to subject her kid to all of her negative comments that are hurting her feelings, making her feel insecure and inadequate and demoralizing her. If MIL wants to continue the one-on-ones, she is to discontinue that behavior or she won't see her as often.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 11:48     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:All of those comments seem totally normal. Maybe you are subtly making your DD see everything her grandmother says in a negative light. So what if she brushes her hair and puts it in a pony tale. Good God, the sensitivity is insane.


While I think the grandmother's comments are annoying, I tend to agree that the best thing you can do for your daughter is to help her find ways to deal with the comments. You or your DH shielding her from her grandmother actually denies her an important skill in how to protect her own boundaries, whether it's saying something, going grey rock, or whether she decides to spend less time with GM.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:57     Subject: Re:Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:I feel you, OP. My MIL tries to see the kids once a week though, ugh.

I think 12 is old enough to make decisions about whether to see grandma. If DD is indicating reluctance, then feel free to rejigger the outing to involve less talking (movie, maybe) or come up with an excuse to punt to a later time.

My MIL doesn't think our liberal church is teaching the kids religion well enough, so she proselytizes the whole time she's with them. They LOVE that [sarcasm]. Mind you, we've been members for a decade and she changes churches (and husbands!) like toilet paper rolls, but sure, we're doing Christianity wrong.

She also does this bizarre little girl voice and laugh. She comes over and tells (not funny) jokes and then laughs like a hyena while the kids aren't laughing at all. It's just so weird.

Trust me, kids know when someone is unpleasant. I don't think my MIL is difficult enough to avoid her completely, but are we voluntarily planning all sorts of outings with her like we do with my mom? No.

My husband knows his mom has issues, but he doesn't love talking about it. So I would bring it up only if there's a resolution that needs to be reached. It's not like you guys can rewire MIL's brain to view DD as favorably as male cousin. Just celebrate your daughter and praise her a lot.


OP already said her DD enjoys spending time with her grandmother. This is OP's issue, not her DD's.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:54     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:She’s 12. Teach her to speak up for herself. “Grandma, when you say things like that it sounds like you’re embarrassed by me because of my hair, and how I look.” “Grandma, if you keep saying g things like that, it’ll make me not want to spend time with you.”


There is an unequal power of balance and you saying it like it’s so simple for a 12 year old to say these things is disingenuous.


No it’s not. There are reasons I don’t take shit from people, and one is that I watched my parents stick up for themselves and set boundaries growing up, and the other is that my parents gave me the words to do it myself when I got upset with someone, and then backed me up.

Good for you. I work with children and I don’t know a single 12yo who would have the nerve to tell me this to my face, for many of the reasons mentioned here: they seek my approval. And I know some spunky kids.


NP. Because you’re a good person and they want your approval. My grandmother constantly told me I was fat (I was a competitive swimmer and a size 6; I had broad shoulders and didn’t look like a waif). It got to the point where I was direct and snarky with her, because guess what? I didn’t need or want the approval of a horrible person.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:53     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:I don’t think this is anything to pick at. She sounds mildly cantankerous.


+1 You have to be perfect to be in these DIL's lives. Being a blood relative isn't enough.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:53     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:She’s 12. Teach her to speak up for herself. “Grandma, when you say things like that it sounds like you’re embarrassed by me because of my hair, and how I look.” “Grandma, if you keep saying g things like that, it’ll make me not want to spend time with you.”


There is an unequal power of balance and you saying it like it’s so simple for a 12 year old to say these things is disingenuous.


She can make it more simple. "Ouch Grandma" or "That doesn't make me feel good" or whatever.

Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:50     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Teach her to say "Grandma, that hurts my feelings".

The reaction stuff is silly, but I would also consider having a direct conversation about how your 12 year old has noticed Grandma is always criticizing her looks and that gma needs to knock it off. The shift from little kid correction "oh my you've got food on your face!" to pre-teen critiques is a quick one. And pre-teens are already self-conscious so they don't need the input from Gma on this.

If Grandma doesn't stop, you cut way back on time. Push every month to every 6-8 weeks. You can tell her why.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:45     Subject: Re:Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I mean, you can say exactly what you said here. But I not sure you need to do so. Your DH already knows his mom sucks. He also seems smart enough to know he is never going to change his mom.

Why is your DD spending so much time with grandma? Just cut back. And don’t be the primary contact with MIL. Refer all complaints from her to her son.

We have cut back. DD sees her maybe 12 times a year. I just hate that she makes my DD feel inferior with comments like that.


12 times a year is still too much!

Holy moly! This woman is toxic and she still gets to insult your DD 12 times a year!

Which is why I’m here. She told me this last night. DD is supposed to go with MIL this weekend. I’m thinking of having DH cancel. It’s weird though because for whatever reason, DD still seems to enjoy the relationship in spite of all this.


You're the one who has a problem with your MIL, not your DD. Everyone has both good and bad qualities. Your MIL's good qualities far outweigh her bad ones in your DD's eyes. Too bad you don't like that.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:42     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
All of those comments seem totally normal. Maybe you are subtly making your DD see everything her grandmother says in a negative light. So what if she brushes her hair and puts it in a pony tale. Good God, the sensitivity is insane.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:30     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I feel like she’s always subtly insulting DD12. The past few visits to local MIL and DD has reported back to me—not her father—of things/experiences with her grandmother. Things like:

Grandma is embarrassed by my hair and thinks it’s messy. She always makes me sit down so she can put it in a ponytail. (DD inherited my curly hair and isn’t yet motivated to “tame” it. It’s always clean and brushed, but is wild.)

Grandma lets it be known that she doesn’t like DD’s style. (Clothing choices, shoes, etc. When they go out she’s always trying to get DD to buy new clothes that MIL likes, and is noticeably upset when DD doesn’t want them.)

MIL has been planning and talking about a vacation for YEARS. Every year it’s “I’m finally taking that European river cruise this year!” and every year it never happens. It’s finally booked. She told DD about it and apparently DD wasn’t excited enough so MIL chastised her for not being enthusiastic.

But the most recent has me royally ticked off. DD plays the flute, we’ve sent video of her playing the flute to MIL. Crickets. The other day she told DD just out of the blue on a FaceTime that “cousin” taught herself to play the guitar just by watching YouTube videos, and how she is “just so impressed with that boy.” She’s never praised DD, and not I’m putting things together to realize, MIL really only CRITICIZES.

DH has a tenuous relationship with his mom. She was a mediocre mother at best when he was growing up. He knows DD doesn’t like spending time with her. He knows she isn’t maternal. But this new cousin revelation has me convinced she CAN be but chooses not to be. What’s the best way to bring this up to DH?


You don't. There is nothing he can do. Sometimes you have to deal


Oh no - you have to tell DH. But do not expect DH to do anything about it. Terrible grandparents were also terrible parents - your MIL is not going to change for you, DD, DH or anyone else. In fact, your MIL will only get worse - more surly, persnickety, snarky, mean and rude. Ask me how I know. My MIL thinks she is funny, but she is really just rude and snarky. Nothing funny, cute or "great" (or cue any descriptor worthy of praise here) about her. She is just a mean, bitter old woman who sticks around to inflict her misery on others. Don't let your MIL try to manipulate or insult your DD. People like your and my MIL are only pleasant to people who they deem worthy - and that means that those people have to be their minions, exactly like them, "yes" people - being different from them is a mortal sin, because narcissism.

Like other PP, I don't put up with other people's f*ckery. But you know what? Some people exist only for imposing their f*ckery, and and that point, it is time for you to drop the rope and move on to the beautiful family you created, independent of MIL. In fact, I would not be surprised if your MIL is extremely jealous of both you and your beautiful DD.

Devote your time, energy and love to those who deserve it.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:16     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:I feel like she’s always subtly insulting DD12. The past few visits to local MIL and DD has reported back to me—not her father—of things/experiences with her grandmother. Things like:

Grandma is embarrassed by my hair and thinks it’s messy. She always makes me sit down so she can put it in a ponytail. (DD inherited my curly hair and isn’t yet motivated to “tame” it. It’s always clean and brushed, but is wild.)

Grandma lets it be known that she doesn’t like DD’s style. (Clothing choices, shoes, etc. When they go out she’s always trying to get DD to buy new clothes that MIL likes, and is noticeably upset when DD doesn’t want them.)

MIL has been planning and talking about a vacation for YEARS. Every year it’s “I’m finally taking that European river cruise this year!” and every year it never happens. It’s finally booked. She told DD about it and apparently DD wasn’t excited enough so MIL chastised her for not being enthusiastic.

But the most recent has me royally ticked off. DD plays the flute, we’ve sent video of her playing the flute to MIL. Crickets. The other day she told DD just out of the blue on a FaceTime that “cousin” taught herself to play the guitar just by watching YouTube videos, and how she is “just so impressed with that boy.” She’s never praised DD, and not I’m putting things together to realize, MIL really only CRITICIZES.

DH has a tenuous relationship with his mom. She was a mediocre mother at best when he was growing up. He knows DD doesn’t like spending time with her. He knows she isn’t maternal. But this new cousin revelation has me convinced she CAN be but chooses not to be. What’s the best way to bring this up to DH?


You don't. There is nothing he can do. Sometimes you have to deal
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:14     Subject: Re:Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
I feel you, OP. My MIL tries to see the kids once a week though, ugh.

I think 12 is old enough to make decisions about whether to see grandma. If DD is indicating reluctance, then feel free to rejigger the outing to involve less talking (movie, maybe) or come up with an excuse to punt to a later time.

My MIL doesn't think our liberal church is teaching the kids religion well enough, so she proselytizes the whole time she's with them. They LOVE that [sarcasm]. Mind you, we've been members for a decade and she changes churches (and husbands!) like toilet paper rolls, but sure, we're doing Christianity wrong.

She also does this bizarre little girl voice and laugh. She comes over and tells (not funny) jokes and then laughs like a hyena while the kids aren't laughing at all. It's just so weird.

Trust me, kids know when someone is unpleasant. I don't think my MIL is difficult enough to avoid her completely, but are we voluntarily planning all sorts of outings with her like we do with my mom? No.

My husband knows his mom has issues, but he doesn't love talking about it. So I would bring it up only if there's a resolution that needs to be reached. It's not like you guys can rewire MIL's brain to view DD as favorably as male cousin. Just celebrate your daughter and praise her a lot.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:10     Subject: Re:Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I mean, you can say exactly what you said here. But I not sure you need to do so. Your DH already knows his mom sucks. He also seems smart enough to know he is never going to change his mom.

Why is your DD spending so much time with grandma? Just cut back. And don’t be the primary contact with MIL. Refer all complaints from her to her son.

We have cut back. DD sees her maybe 12 times a year. I just hate that she makes my DD feel inferior with comments like that.


12 times a year is still too much!

Holy moly! This woman is toxic and she still gets to insult your DD 12 times a year!

Which is why I’m here. She told me this last night. DD is supposed to go with MIL this weekend. I’m thinking of having DH cancel. It’s weird though because for whatever reason, DD still seems to enjoy the relationship in spite of all this.


She wants her grandma's approval, but doesn't know that it would never come.


12 is old enough to understand that it's not coming, and decide whether she wants to let comments slide, or figure out (with your and DH's help) some polite-but-firm responses. My paternal grandmother was like this - very European, very proper, very much favored her son/grandsons - and I was probably 9 or 10 when I basically went gray rock with her (not that I knew the term at the time!), understanding that she wasn't going to change. She was the type to make this coffee cake I loved when we visited, then tell me I was going to get fat if I had more than one small sliver.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:08     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:She’s 12. Teach her to speak up for herself. “Grandma, when you say things like that it sounds like you’re embarrassed by me because of my hair, and how I look.” “Grandma, if you keep saying g things like that, it’ll make me not want to spend time with you.”


There is an unequal power of balance and you saying it like it’s so simple for a 12 year old to say these things is disingenuous.


No it’s not. There are reasons I don’t take shit from people, and one is that I watched my parents stick up for themselves and set boundaries growing up, and the other is that my parents gave me the words to do it myself when I got upset with someone, and then backed me up.

Good for you. I work with children and I don’t know a single 12yo who would have the nerve to tell me this to my face, for many of the reasons mentioned here: they seek my approval. And I know some spunky kids.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2023 10:07     Subject: Why does my MIL do this? How to tell DH?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:She’s 12. Teach her to speak up for herself. “Grandma, when you say things like that it sounds like you’re embarrassed by me because of my hair, and how I look.” “Grandma, if you keep saying g things like that, it’ll make me not want to spend time with you.”


There is an unequal power of balance and you saying it like it’s so simple for a 12 year old to say these things is disingenuous.


No it’s not. There are reasons I don’t take shit from people, and one is that I watched my parents stick up for themselves and set boundaries growing up, and the other is that my parents gave me the words to do it myself when I got upset with someone, and then backed me up.


You just be the mother in law OP is writing about.