Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 14:07     Subject: Re:Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:The podcast is not about early childhood ed. It's about how 3-cuing/whole language instruction makes it harder for many first, second, third graders to learn to read.
My kid's Title 1 school with all the woes mentioned in an earlier post does focus on Wilson/fundations. Unfortunately, most of the class is still struggling in fourth grade to comprehend very basic information.

For those of you worried about the phonics curriculum not inculcating a love of reading -- I hear you. Fundations is not at all interesting. That said, I can recommend Flyleaf Publishing's decodable picture books, they are better written and still help early readers who aren't remembering that 'ee' and 'ea' sound like a long e, and that 'ai' sounds like a long a and that a final e makes the vowel say its name...



thanks for this viewpoint, which suggests that in fact DC could be doing more in PK to support literacy. OP raises a good question.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 14:06     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .


No one is saying they're wrong because they listened to one podcast, they're saying one podcast does not make you an expert.


And yet...OP's concern is well-founded.


Their concern and the entire thread is silly. The navel gazing on pedagogy should preserved for EdD candidates and others who spend their time outside classrooms. Parents who want to wax philosophic about this stuff in the context of DCPS are ignorant of the realities of public education, especially in DC. DC schools are filled with food insecure kids from unstable homes with parents and guardians that haven't been reading to them in utero. Educators in DC are triaging a ton of systemic and societal problems. These get worse as time goes on. If the wanna be public policy experts on this thread knew a darn thing beyond their under 5 year olds they'd realize how silly then entire discussion is. Instead, you all vomit the daily drivel of "deep thinkers" with 3 year olds who think they have a clue.


This is a wild take. So we shouldn’t demonstrate any interest in educational methods? (My kids are average and I’m pretty hands off. But the Lucy Calkins stuff seems like a big fail, no?)


Nope. You miss the point. The point is that you are all expending an awful lot of energy worrying about pedagogy for 3 year olds, all of whom have parents who read to them and resources to backstop. You are all doing so in a school system with significant challenges that you all appear too self centered to understand. You are like most parents of ECE kids; you think what is happening in school right now matters and that the fact that you listened to a podcast about ECE makes you qualified to have a clue about the challenges that your kids will face when they get beyond 2nd or 3rd grade.


I see. You are a typical DCPS supporter (likely WTU member) who demands that parents with resources STFU and not expect anything at all from DCPS. This is a viewpoint that pervades DCPS at all levels - just check out the thread on how Jackson-Reed communicates about AP classes. In DCPS parents are not allowed to ask that their children receive challenging and appropriate academics.

OP - take this viewpoint very seriously because it only gets more concerning as kids get into middle and high school. If you want to be in a school district that prioritizes academics, you need to move.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 14:06     Subject: Re:Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
The podcast is not about early childhood ed. It's about how 3-cuing/whole language instruction makes it harder for many first, second, third graders to learn to read.
My kid's Title 1 school with all the woes mentioned in an earlier post does focus on Wilson/fundations. Unfortunately, most of the class is still struggling in fourth grade to comprehend very basic information.

For those of you worried about the phonics curriculum not inculcating a love of reading -- I hear you. Fundations is not at all interesting. That said, I can recommend Flyleaf Publishing's decodable picture books, they are better written and still help early readers who aren't remembering that 'ee' and 'ea' sound like a long e, and that 'ai' sounds like a long a and that a final e makes the vowel say its name...

Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 13:56     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .


No one is saying they're wrong because they listened to one podcast, they're saying one podcast does not make you an expert.


And yet...OP's concern is well-founded.


Their concern and the entire thread is silly. The navel gazing on pedagogy should preserved for EdD candidates and others who spend their time outside classrooms. Parents who want to wax philosophic about this stuff in the context of DCPS are ignorant of the realities of public education, especially in DC. DC schools are filled with food insecure kids from unstable homes with parents and guardians that haven't been reading to them in utero. Educators in DC are triaging a ton of systemic and societal problems. These get worse as time goes on. If the wanna be public policy experts on this thread knew a darn thing beyond their under 5 year olds they'd realize how silly then entire discussion is. Instead, you all vomit the daily drivel of "deep thinkers" with 3 year olds who think they have a clue.


This is a wild take. So we shouldn’t demonstrate any interest in educational methods? (My kids are average and I’m pretty hands off. But the Lucy Calkins stuff seems like a big fail, no?)


Nope. You miss the point. The point is that you are all expending an awful lot of energy worrying about pedagogy for 3 year olds, all of whom have parents who read to them and resources to backstop. You are all doing so in a school system with significant challenges that you all appear too self centered to understand. You are like most parents of ECE kids; you think what is happening in school right now matters and that the fact that you listened to a podcast about ECE makes you qualified to have a clue about the challenges that your kids will face when they get beyond 2nd or 3rd grade.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 13:52     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .


No one is saying they're wrong because they listened to one podcast, they're saying one podcast does not make you an expert.


And yet...OP's concern is well-founded.


Their concern and the entire thread is silly. The navel gazing on pedagogy should preserved for EdD candidates and others who spend their time outside classrooms. Parents who want to wax philosophic about this stuff in the context of DCPS are ignorant of the realities of public education, especially in DC. DC schools are filled with food insecure kids from unstable homes with parents and guardians that haven't been reading to them in utero. Educators in DC are triaging a ton of systemic and societal problems. These get worse as time goes on. If the wanna be public policy experts on this thread knew a darn thing beyond their under 5 year olds they'd realize how silly then entire discussion is. Instead, you all vomit the daily drivel of "deep thinkers" with 3 year olds who think they have a clue.


Do you not realize that there actually are public policy experts here? Also, the kids who benefit the most from phonics are the kids you're describing. It didn't really matter what my charter was doing because I taught my kids to read.


Do you not realize my point was that the public policy, overintellectualized nonsense you are all spouting is at bottom what I am taking issue with? From my post you managed to take away someone was questioning your graduate thesis on 3rd grade education? Maybe you learned to read in a bad pedagogy, because you seem not to have basic reading comprehension skills.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 13:50     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Our charter is almost 100% phonics - and we hate it. There is no balanced literacy - it's all drill, baby, drill.


This is the way


...to make children hate reading...to bore children out of their skulls...to degrade the value of literature and great books...


Heavens to Betsy! My 3 and 4 year old doesn't like the way reading is taught and clearly this will have a lifelong impact on...NOTHING. Sometimes in life kids have to learn stuff. And sometimes in life it isn't as fun as eating Chocolate and playing. That's life. Parents like you amuse the heck out of me.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 13:41     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:I have been very happy with our PK3 charter, but concerned about the reading pedagogy. It seems like they are using approaches similar to the “three-cueing” system that teaches kids to rely on context clues, memorization, and skipping unfamiliar words all together to use more familiar words to make a guess. Cognitive scientists and applied linguistics researchers have proven this to be a horrible method to teach children to read and it actually does more harm than good. Found this article in a quick google search for reference: https://www.apmreports.org/amp/episode/2019/08/22/whats-wrong-how-schools-teach-reading

Contrary to popular belief, learning letters isn’t even the best place to start. Foundational skills in pre-k should focus on things like sound recognition and making sounds with your mouth. I would be surprised if I encountered a school that was onto this though. For some reason these things don’t seem to successfully bridge academia to the classroom. Would definitely like to know though if anyone has encountered anything like this in ECE.

I was reading on another thread that DCPS has an academic and rigorous approach to teaching kids to read in K, which is good to hear. This year we applied mainly to ward 3 DCPS schools for PK4 and we have a number of low waitlist numbers. Can anyone tell me about how these schools teach kids to read? Is the phonics instruction strong?



Honestly OP, you should homeschool your kids. You're educated enough to do it, and isn't making sure you child has the right education worth more to you than any job you might have? Don't let your kids receive the wrong education.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 13:38     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .


No one is saying they're wrong because they listened to one podcast, they're saying one podcast does not make you an expert.


And yet...OP's concern is well-founded.


Their concern and the entire thread is silly. The navel gazing on pedagogy should preserved for EdD candidates and others who spend their time outside classrooms. Parents who want to wax philosophic about this stuff in the context of DCPS are ignorant of the realities of public education, especially in DC. DC schools are filled with food insecure kids from unstable homes with parents and guardians that haven't been reading to them in utero. Educators in DC are triaging a ton of systemic and societal problems. These get worse as time goes on. If the wanna be public policy experts on this thread knew a darn thing beyond their under 5 year olds they'd realize how silly then entire discussion is. Instead, you all vomit the daily drivel of "deep thinkers" with 3 year olds who think they have a clue.


Do you not realize that there actually are public policy experts here? Also, the kids who benefit the most from phonics are the kids you're describing. It didn't really matter what my charter was doing because I taught my kids to read.


Gag, typical DC self promoting BS.


Gag, typical chip-on-her-shoulder anti-intellectual
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 13:32     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .


No one is saying they're wrong because they listened to one podcast, they're saying one podcast does not make you an expert.


And yet...OP's concern is well-founded.


Their concern and the entire thread is silly. The navel gazing on pedagogy should preserved for EdD candidates and others who spend their time outside classrooms. Parents who want to wax philosophic about this stuff in the context of DCPS are ignorant of the realities of public education, especially in DC. DC schools are filled with food insecure kids from unstable homes with parents and guardians that haven't been reading to them in utero. Educators in DC are triaging a ton of systemic and societal problems. These get worse as time goes on. If the wanna be public policy experts on this thread knew a darn thing beyond their under 5 year olds they'd realize how silly then entire discussion is. Instead, you all vomit the daily drivel of "deep thinkers" with 3 year olds who think they have a clue.


Do you not realize that there actually are public policy experts here? Also, the kids who benefit the most from phonics are the kids you're describing. It didn't really matter what my charter was doing because I taught my kids to read.


Gag, typical DC self promoting BS.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 13:22     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .



As a teacher the problem is when the parent won’t listen to reason. They insist on a certain program no matter what even if we are using Wilson they insist we use Sonday. That’s the issue - at least at my school.

Are there certified teachers regarding delivery of the Wilson Program? We found that the school stated they were using Wilson but no one was actutally certified in the program. Someone from the school attended a DCPS training and was supposed to train the rest of the teachers (but they left)


Yes. We have 5 people certified in Wilson and still get arguments from parents.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 12:29     Subject: Re:Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
I've been really impressed with Lafayette's literacy instruction (or at least, the instruction provided by my child's K teacher). They really focus on the sounds that letters make. I believe they use something called the Fundations literacy program.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 12:21     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .



As a teacher the problem is when the parent won’t listen to reason. They insist on a certain program no matter what even if we are using Wilson they insist we use Sonday. That’s the issue - at least at my school.

Are there certified teachers regarding delivery of the Wilson Program? We found that the school stated they were using Wilson but no one was actutally certified in the program. Someone from the school attended a DCPS training and was supposed to train the rest of the teachers (but they left)
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 12:20     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Our charter is almost 100% phonics - and we hate it. There is no balanced literacy - it's all drill, baby, drill.


This is the way


...to make children hate reading...to bore children out of their skulls...to degrade the value of literature and great books...


A child who struggles to read cannot enjoy reading!

And of course, these things are not mutually exclusive. Phonics instruction does not take up all day. You can have a phonics lesson and still do things that inculcate a love of reading.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 12:19     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .


No one is saying they're wrong because they listened to one podcast, they're saying one podcast does not make you an expert.


And yet...OP's concern is well-founded.


Their concern and the entire thread is silly. The navel gazing on pedagogy should preserved for EdD candidates and others who spend their time outside classrooms. Parents who want to wax philosophic about this stuff in the context of DCPS are ignorant of the realities of public education, especially in DC. DC schools are filled with food insecure kids from unstable homes with parents and guardians that haven't been reading to them in utero. Educators in DC are triaging a ton of systemic and societal problems. These get worse as time goes on. If the wanna be public policy experts on this thread knew a darn thing beyond their under 5 year olds they'd realize how silly then entire discussion is. Instead, you all vomit the daily drivel of "deep thinkers" with 3 year olds who think they have a clue.


This is a wild take. So we shouldn’t demonstrate any interest in educational methods? (My kids are average and I’m pretty hands off. But the Lucy Calkins stuff seems like a big fail, no?)
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2023 12:18     Subject: Reading Pedagogy at DCPS Elementary?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:DCPS only uses science of reading-aligned curricula.

To all the parents saying the OP is wrong simply because they listened to a podcast, you are actually the ones who are wrong .


No one is saying they're wrong because they listened to one podcast, they're saying one podcast does not make you an expert.


And yet...OP's concern is well-founded.


Their concern and the entire thread is silly. The navel gazing on pedagogy should preserved for EdD candidates and others who spend their time outside classrooms. Parents who want to wax philosophic about this stuff in the context of DCPS are ignorant of the realities of public education, especially in DC. DC schools are filled with food insecure kids from unstable homes with parents and guardians that haven't been reading to them in utero. Educators in DC are triaging a ton of systemic and societal problems. These get worse as time goes on. If the wanna be public policy experts on this thread knew a darn thing beyond their under 5 year olds they'd realize how silly then entire discussion is. Instead, you all vomit the daily drivel of "deep thinkers" with 3 year olds who think they have a clue.


Do you not realize that there actually are public policy experts here? Also, the kids who benefit the most from phonics are the kids you're describing. It didn't really matter what my charter was doing because I taught my kids to read.