Anonymous
03/23/2023 16:05
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
I don't think any middle schoolers are actually named Chad not sure you really know what you're talking about
Anonymous
03/23/2023 15:54
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote: School board has been clear that there's no land to build another comprehensive high school.
That's what eminent domain is for. Just take over some lobbyists' office spaces, even if lobbying is protected by the first amendment.
Taking over an office building isn't going to give you near enough space for a 4th comprehensive high school. that's the whole problem. You need space for all the fields and pools or whatever, or the kids at that school are just going to have to share the facilities at some preexisting high schools that already has too many kids fighting for use of the facilities. That's why the discussion of doing the 4th comprehensive 10 (or whatever) years ago was key and the county just couldn't find a way to make it happen. If they couldn't do it then, they won't do it now, or 5 years from now, or 10 -- because there is just not the land to do it. I think washington country club should donate their golf course -- that might be enough space (though it's basically right in between WL and Yorktown so...). Or maybe we could turn a park into a high school.
Meanwhile, if you don't do something drastic like that, it's flex scheduling or virtual schools on the table and I don't think anyone really wants that. Or just keep crowding kids into WL? County just keeps sitting on its hands thinking bonus density being used by developers is a good idea and teachers keep quitting so ... not really sure what's going to happen here.
Let this go. It's not happening and there is a compelling case for why it's not necessary and worth the enormous expense. Siphon off kids who will self-select into high-quality specialty programs...STEM, performing arts, other. There will be plenty of fields left for the kids who prioritize this kind of experience.
WHAT high quality specialty programs are you talking about, besides Arlington Tech? Nothing like this currently exists. How long do you think it would take the county to budget and create something like that when currently NOTHING LIKE THAT is on their TO DO list or even running wild in their imaginations?
DP. And they still need space for these programs.
Even if they just make Arlington Tech into a high quality math/science/engineering/CS program, they would clearly get lots of students to do it. People fall all over themselves to get into HB. Why would this be any different if marketed well. I'm telling you they've already started doing this. They have middle school kids thinking Arlington Tech is the dream. Over subscribed and lottery in place. A new building and expanded student body with more class offerings as a result means they will have plenty of takers and Chad and Ethan can be assured of their access to the lacrosse fields.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 15:28
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I thought a bunch of people actually did leave the public schools, which were becoming more and more overcrowded? But that now some kids were starting to return?
If you add even more kids without fixing the underlying overcrowding problems, where does that leave us?
(What is the solution to the high school overcrowding problem if you think it's fine to add more kids? School board has been clear that there's no land to build another comprehensive high school. School board has previously floated having virtual classes and having a two-schedule system where some kids come into school in the mornings and others come in in the afternoons. Does anyone actually WANT that? It's such a rich county and we're threatening our educational system with this ridiculousness wut?)
Missing middle isn't adding kids over night. So let's all take a deep breath.
Do you get this upset when new condo buildings are being built? Because those add MUCH more density, much faster than anything missing middle will add.
Last, absolutely bring your concerns to the county board, and ask them to work with APS to alleviate high school crowding. Complaining here does nothing.
I actually got more upset over condos being built and went to complain to the county board about it about 7 years ago -- that they weren't adequately accounting for kids being added to the schools. I don't really know how I feel about missing middle tbh - desegregating the county would be good honestly. But the schools are a problem and the county board is just ignoring the high school issue.
Yes, indeed it would. But more housing won't do that. On the other hand, schools could do more to de-segregate if they really wanted to and if the County and APS worked together and committed to developing the efficient and sufficient transportation system a ranked-choice school system requires. But they don't want to.
Doesn't missing middle actually address this a little? Maybe not right now when the units are brand new as rentals, but won't they maybe be rented at less in 10 years and encourage non-high income people to move in? That's what the pro-missing middle people say, anyway. Otherwise isn't Arlington just always going to be an area where pockets of land way over there are for low income people and it's usually not right next to the $2M houses?
Anonymous
03/23/2023 14:54
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote: School board has been clear that there's no land to build another comprehensive high school.
That's what eminent domain is for. Just take over some lobbyists' office spaces, even if lobbying is protected by the first amendment.
Taking over an office building isn't going to give you near enough space for a 4th comprehensive high school. that's the whole problem. You need space for all the fields and pools or whatever, or the kids at that school are just going to have to share the facilities at some preexisting high schools that already has too many kids fighting for use of the facilities. That's why the discussion of doing the 4th comprehensive 10 (or whatever) years ago was key and the county just couldn't find a way to make it happen. If they couldn't do it then, they won't do it now, or 5 years from now, or 10 -- because there is just not the land to do it. I think washington country club should donate their golf course -- that might be enough space (though it's basically right in between WL and Yorktown so...). Or maybe we could turn a park into a high school.
Meanwhile, if you don't do something drastic like that, it's flex scheduling or virtual schools on the table and I don't think anyone really wants that. Or just keep crowding kids into WL? County just keeps sitting on its hands thinking bonus density being used by developers is a good idea and teachers keep quitting so ... not really sure what's going to happen here.
Let this go. It's not happening and there is a compelling case for why it's not necessary and worth the enormous expense. Siphon off kids who will self-select into high-quality specialty programs...STEM, performing arts, other. There will be plenty of fields left for the kids who prioritize this kind of experience.
WHAT high quality specialty programs are you talking about, besides Arlington Tech? Nothing like this currently exists. How long do you think it would take the county to budget and create something like that when currently NOTHING LIKE THAT is on their TO DO list or even running wild in their imaginations?
DP. And they still need space for these programs.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 14:53
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote: School board has been clear that there's no land to build another comprehensive high school.
That's what eminent domain is for. Just take over some lobbyists' office spaces, even if lobbying is protected by the first amendment.
Taking over an office building isn't going to give you near enough space for a 4th comprehensive high school. that's the whole problem. You need space for all the fields and pools or whatever, or the kids at that school are just going to have to share the facilities at some preexisting high schools that already has too many kids fighting for use of the facilities. That's why the discussion of doing the 4th comprehensive 10 (or whatever) years ago was key and the county just couldn't find a way to make it happen. If they couldn't do it then, they won't do it now, or 5 years from now, or 10 -- because there is just not the land to do it. I think washington country club should donate their golf course -- that might be enough space (though it's basically right in between WL and Yorktown so...). Or maybe we could turn a park into a high school.
Meanwhile, if you don't do something drastic like that, it's flex scheduling or virtual schools on the table and I don't think anyone really wants that. Or just keep crowding kids into WL? County just keeps sitting on its hands thinking bonus density being used by developers is a good idea and teachers keep quitting so ... not really sure what's going to happen here.
Wrong. County CHOSE not to make it happen.
Lots of space to work with, reconfigure, re-structure at the Kenmore site. (Don't care the neighborhood doesn't want it....not the same as "can't" do it)
County just "sold" the VHC site on Carlin Springs back to the hospital. Lots of space to do stuff there, so let's sell it so we can keep saying we don't have any more land.
If Arlington wants to become a high-population, high-density mini-Manhattan, then it needs to accept looking more like Manhattan. REBUILD existing schools UP and accept that they're going to be huge even at the elementary level.
INVEST in the public transit needed to get students to the County recreation facilities for extracurriculars.
Accept that the Career Center site isn't going to have everything Yorktown, WL and Wakefield have - but they sure could have planned and redeveloped that site more thoughtfully for the long term.
HIRE people who are competent at long-term planning!
Anonymous
03/23/2023 14:46
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Missing middle doesn’t add that many new houses to Arlington AT ALL. I need to go back and find the numbers in the information but it’s tiny. Really not worth all this hubbub and hand wringing.
Not in the short term. But if such multiplex developments start gaining popularity, the momentum will eventually increase and it will add a lot more housing units. the goal of the whole MM is to increase the density of
Arlington, after all. It's the long-term that Arlington needs to be thinking of and they need to be doing it NOW because it takes TEN YEARS to plan and construct a new school.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 14:41
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I thought a bunch of people actually did leave the public schools, which were becoming more and more overcrowded? But that now some kids were starting to return?
If you add even more kids without fixing the underlying overcrowding problems, where does that leave us?
(What is the solution to the high school overcrowding problem if you think it's fine to add more kids? School board has been clear that there's no land to build another comprehensive high school. School board has previously floated having virtual classes and having a two-schedule system where some kids come into school in the mornings and others come in in the afternoons. Does anyone actually WANT that? It's such a rich county and we're threatening our educational system with this ridiculousness wut?)
Missing middle isn't adding kids over night. So let's all take a deep breath.
Do you get this upset when new condo buildings are being built? Because those add MUCH more density, much faster than anything missing middle will add.
Last, absolutely bring your concerns to the county board, and ask them to work with APS to alleviate high school crowding. Complaining here does nothing.
I actually got more upset over condos being built and went to complain to the county board about it about 7 years ago -- that they weren't adequately accounting for kids being added to the schools. I don't really know how I feel about missing middle tbh - desegregating the county would be good honestly. But the schools are a problem and the county board is just ignoring the high school issue.
Yes, indeed it would. But more housing won't do that. On the other hand, schools could do more to de-segregate if they really wanted to and if the County and APS worked together and committed to developing the efficient and sufficient transportation system a ranked-choice school system requires. But they don't want to.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 14:37
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:My kids are older and almost out of APS. But I would not chose to stay in Arlington now if my kids were young. MM is just one of many problems here. I am feeling grouchy today, but that's the truth.
Arlington has no space to build a 4th HS and no money to do additions. Plus the planning process here takes decades. Not going to happen in the 8 years before your kid gets there.
Ditto.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 14:02
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Missing middle doesn’t add that many new houses to Arlington AT ALL. I need to go back and find the numbers in the information but it’s tiny. Really not worth all this hubbub and hand wringing.
It's because the cap they put on it sunsets after 5 years. Housing stock turns over on a 30-yr cycle, approx. If they get rid of the cap, in 30 years, you could have twice as many kids in the system. Or more!
I also care because there's not room for 10-15 extra cars on my street.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 13:34
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My kids are older and almost out of APS. But I would not chose to stay in Arlington now if my kids were young. MM is just one of many problems here. I am feeling grouchy today, but that's the truth.
Arlington has no space to build a 4th HS and no money to do additions. Plus the planning process here takes decades. Not going to happen in the 8 years before your kid gets there.
So which district would you move into? I will find you an FCPS parent whose unhappy and will tell you about it.
Private
I will never not laugh at those of you who think “I’m going private” is 100% up to you and not subject to the whims of an arbitrary admissions department.
But good luck!
I get what you're saying but the point (for most PPs mentioning private, I think) is that public is never going to meet the needs of all kids so you're always going to find fault with APS. That's just the reality of the situation, regardless of whether you can afford or get into the private school of your choice. We all try to make the best of it for our families.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 13:28
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote: School board has been clear that there's no land to build another comprehensive high school.
That's what eminent domain is for. Just take over some lobbyists' office spaces, even if lobbying is protected by the first amendment.
Taking over an office building isn't going to give you near enough space for a 4th comprehensive high school. that's the whole problem. You need space for all the fields and pools or whatever, or the kids at that school are just going to have to share the facilities at some preexisting high schools that already has too many kids fighting for use of the facilities. That's why the discussion of doing the 4th comprehensive 10 (or whatever) years ago was key and the county just couldn't find a way to make it happen. If they couldn't do it then, they won't do it now, or 5 years from now, or 10 -- because there is just not the land to do it. I think washington country club should donate their golf course -- that might be enough space (though it's basically right in between WL and Yorktown so...). Or maybe we could turn a park into a high school.
Meanwhile, if you don't do something drastic like that, it's flex scheduling or virtual schools on the table and I don't think anyone really wants that. Or just keep crowding kids into WL? County just keeps sitting on its hands thinking bonus density being used by developers is a good idea and teachers keep quitting so ... not really sure what's going to happen here.
Let this go. It's not happening and there is a compelling case for why it's not necessary and worth the enormous expense. Siphon off kids who will self-select into high-quality specialty programs...STEM, performing arts, other. There will be plenty of fields left for the kids who prioritize this kind of experience.
WHAT high quality specialty programs are you talking about, besides Arlington Tech? Nothing like this currently exists. How long do you think it would take the county to budget and create something like that when currently NOTHING LIKE THAT is on their TO DO list or even running wild in their imaginations?
Anonymous
03/23/2023 13:20
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote: School board has been clear that there's no land to build another comprehensive high school.
That's what eminent domain is for. Just take over some lobbyists' office spaces, even if lobbying is protected by the first amendment.
Taking over an office building isn't going to give you near enough space for a 4th comprehensive high school. that's the whole problem. You need space for all the fields and pools or whatever, or the kids at that school are just going to have to share the facilities at some preexisting high schools that already has too many kids fighting for use of the facilities. That's why the discussion of doing the 4th comprehensive 10 (or whatever) years ago was key and the county just couldn't find a way to make it happen. If they couldn't do it then, they won't do it now, or 5 years from now, or 10 -- because there is just not the land to do it. I think washington country club should donate their golf course -- that might be enough space (though it's basically right in between WL and Yorktown so...). Or maybe we could turn a park into a high school.
Meanwhile, if you don't do something drastic like that, it's flex scheduling or virtual schools on the table and I don't think anyone really wants that. Or just keep crowding kids into WL? County just keeps sitting on its hands thinking bonus density being used by developers is a good idea and teachers keep quitting so ... not really sure what's going to happen here.
Let this go. It's not happening and there is a compelling case for why it's not necessary and worth the enormous expense. Siphon off kids who will self-select into high-quality specialty programs...STEM, performing arts, other. There will be plenty of fields left for the kids who prioritize this kind of experience.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 13:13
Subject: Re:APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:As gently as possible, let me say that those of you worried about MMH and the schools are clueless. Arlington is already on a trajectory for overcrowding under current zoning laws. High rise buildings and especially affordable housing have a much greater impact than any of these MM housing units. Your schools probably haven’t been impacted by these things, so you don’t know this. Welcome to what everyone else is already dealing with.
Why don’t you think that people who live in new MM construction won’t have kids? Where is that idea coming from?
They will but it’s nowhere near the amount of kids coming under current zoning in high rises and Affordable Housing developments. It’s a drop in the bucket. If you don’t know that, you don’t understand our future enrollment issues.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 13:08
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote: School board has been clear that there's no land to build another comprehensive high school.
That's what eminent domain is for. Just take over some lobbyists' office spaces, even if lobbying is protected by the first amendment.
Taking over an office building isn't going to give you near enough space for a 4th comprehensive high school. that's the whole problem. You need space for all the fields and pools or whatever, or the kids at that school are just going to have to share the facilities at some preexisting high schools that already has too many kids fighting for use of the facilities. That's why the discussion of doing the 4th comprehensive 10 (or whatever) years ago was key and the county just couldn't find a way to make it happen. If they couldn't do it then, they won't do it now, or 5 years from now, or 10 -- because there is just not the land to do it. I think washington country club should donate their golf course -- that might be enough space (though it's basically right in between WL and Yorktown so...). Or maybe we could turn a park into a high school.
Meanwhile, if you don't do something drastic like that, it's flex scheduling or virtual schools on the table and I don't think anyone really wants that. Or just keep crowding kids into WL? County just keeps sitting on its hands thinking bonus density being used by developers is a good idea and teachers keep quitting so ... not really sure what's going to happen here.
Anonymous
03/23/2023 13:07
Subject: APS How F’ed are the schools with MM
Missing middle doesn’t add that many new houses to Arlington AT ALL. I need to go back and find the numbers in the information but it’s tiny. Really not worth all this hubbub and hand wringing.