Anonymous wrote:DS is a superior student/athlete/artist/overall human being to his parents who matriculated HYPSM. 20+ years ago when we were going through it, however, college admissions wasn't a nuclear arms race. I'm fairly certain we would NEVER be accepted if we were applying now. I've been trying to drill this into DS's head since middle school, but he's now a junior and still has delusions of grandeur. I cannot for the life of me get him excited about safety colleges. Advice?

He doesn't need to be excited about them - he just needs to submit the application. You can worry about his excitement level after acceptances are received.

Anonymous wrote: he's now a junior and still has delusions of grandeur. I cannot for the life of me get him excited about safety colleges. Advice?

It's more important that he choose and apply than that he be excited. Is he scuttling the applications, or merely not excited?

Mine is similar. I just keep repeating the reality that it’s a lottery. I think it’s sinking in. He also watched the “sure ivy-bound” kids get rejected last year. He was sure this superstar was going to Harvard at that one to Yale. And then they ended up at Wesleyan and Penn State. That is what was most enlightening for him.

Anonymous wrote:Soon enough you’ll be proven right.

Right. Reality has a sobering effect.

Visit a range of schools. Help him do the math about his (I.e., any applicants’) chances, and see how mature he is .
One way or another, he will get there.

I got into all of them (H, Y, S, and P) and I have no doubt I'd get in today if I were a HS senior. I don't understand why anybody would think otherwise. My grit and drive would have motivated me to do whatever it took to max out my resources and shine. Now, my kid doesn't have that same level of internal motivation and doesn't have the same top GPA and SAT scores. No way would they get in. Thankfully, they know this and I didn't have to tell them. They'll do great at other types of schools and have a fantastic life. It's all good.

Except it's not enough anymore just to have grit and drive and do everything you can to shine. You clearly have not been through this process in a long time, and especially recently. Applications have increased exponentially, schools don't require or in some cases accept test scores, institutions prioritize first gen/URM/legacy and other factors completely out of someone's control (no matter how much grit and drive they have). My kid does have grit and drive, along with a very high GPA and test scores, very involved in extracurriculars with leadership, athletics and a part-time job and I still think almost every school is a reach and he will be fortunate to get into any selective school. You think very highly of yourself. And you are living in a fantasy land.

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Anonymous wrote:Has he looked at scattergrams for his HS yet? My DS is HS freshman and we just got access to ours; too a peek this weekend. Sobering experience.

NP here with a high schooler and I don't know what this is. Can you elaborate?

"Naviance is an American college and career readiness software provider that partners with high schools and other K–12 institutions to provide students with college planning and career assessment tools. "

"Naviance's scattergrams show the acceptance history of students within a particular high school to a specific college or university using the historical average GPAs and test scores from the high school. A Naviance scattergram is a scatter plot that shows students within a high school who were accepted, denied and wait-listed by a specific college using symbols in the graph legend"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naviance

Thank you.

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Anonymous wrote:DS is a superior student/athlete/artist/overall human being to his parents who matriculated HYPSM. 20+ years ago when we were going through it, however, college admissions wasn't a nuclear arms race. I'm fairly certain we would NEVER be accepted if we were applying now. I've been trying to drill this into DS's head since middle school, but he's now a junior and still has delusions of grandeur. I cannot for the life of me get him excited about safety colleges. Advice?

he will probably get in via legacy route. don't worry too much

No guarantees here. Youngest DC now in first year of school. The number of qualified Ivy legacies not admitted in their class seemed pretty high. And DH has a number of college classmates with kids not admitted to their alma mater.

So legacy helps, but it is not a guarantee.

No guarantees in life.

but a legacy has a much better chance than unhooked students.

slightly better chance among the already highly qualified.

+1 and you have to apply ED for any legacy boost so you forfeit any other potential options should you get in.

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Anonymous wrote:DS is a superior student/athlete/artist/overall human being to his parents who matriculated HYPSM. 20+ years ago when we were going through it, however, college admissions wasn't a nuclear arms race. I'm fairly certain we would NEVER be accepted if we were applying now. I've been trying to drill this into DS's head since middle school, but he's now a junior and still has delusions of grandeur. I cannot for the life of me get him excited about safety colleges. Advice?

he will probably get in via legacy route. don't worry too much

No guarantees here. Youngest DC now in first year of school. The number of qualified Ivy legacies not admitted in their class seemed pretty high. And DH has a number of college classmates with kids not admitted to their alma mater.

So legacy helps, but it is not a guarantee.

No guarantees in life.

but a legacy has a much better chance than unhooked students.

slightly better chance among the already highly qualified.

Anonymous wrote:When he isn't accepted reality will hit. No need to be the one who sinks his ship. Life will do that for him.

+1 I didn't go to an ivy, but have many friends and acquaintances that did and it's surprising that only a minute fraction have kids who did. Know people who doubled ivied, along with spouse, and their kids aren't even at top-25 schools. It seems like they're all happy and thriving though.

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Anonymous wrote:Your post rings untrue to me OP. Are you for real? There is no need to tell your kid anything...the "market" will. He can apply to fancy places and see where that takes him. His school should advise him about his chances and make sure he applies to a range of schools.

I would barf if anyone I knew told their own child they were not a "special snowflake". Kids have to know at least their own family is rooting for them. They find out soon enough that the world at large is a terrible place. Home is supposed to be a safe space free of taunting.

tell me you don’t know any Asian people without telling me you don’t know any Asian people

lol.. it's a disservice to your teens about to apply to college to not tell them how the world works. I'd barf if anyone I knew didn't tell their near college aged kids about the real world.

You can tell your kids how life works and still root for them. They are not diametrically opposed.

OP, have him look at reddit (as another PP suggested) and College Confidential threads for admits this year. They often post stats and outcomes. That way he can see both the high the caliber and random aspects of top tier admissions. He may be delusional (like the poster above who is so certain that she would get into all these schools again) that he just needs great stats and grit. He may have a shot with those, compelling essays and his legacy, but there is just no guarantee or even likelihood of admission without more to ensure that he is the student they want to add as they build their class. Kids getting in are often national winners and/or with unique talents in addition to top stats and good writing. It's just a tough, tough gamble. Stats may get you a seat at the table and legacy, talents, awards, unique perspective may add wild cards to your hand to sweeten the deal, but there are just no guarantees when admit rates are 6% overall.

What does he want to study? Maybe people can offer some suggestions. If liberal arts, I would add Vassar to the list -- we loved the campus. Look at departments and faculty. Maybe there are faculty at other schools doing interesting things. Or honors programs. They may have special housing, awards and research opps. Get him out and visiting some campuses. There will be a campus that attracts him and maybe a great tour guide that helps. Good luck!

Anonymous wrote:Your post rings untrue to me OP. Are you for real? There is no need to tell your kid anything...the "market" will. He can apply to fancy places and see where that takes him. His school should advise him about his chances and make sure he applies to a range of schools.

I would barf if anyone I knew told their own child they were not a "special snowflake". Kids have to know at least their own family is rooting for them. They find out soon enough that the world at large is a terrible place. Home is supposed to be a safe space free of taunting.

tell me you don’t know any Asian people without telling me you don’t know any Asian people

I think you are actually looking for advice on how to get excited about safeties. What worked for my kid was to visit and see a vibrant student body exists at a lot of places. And a lot of schools offer really cool opportunities. Just do your research so you choose a place that will actually appeal to your kid’s interests. If you can go on a likely nice weather day, that helps too.

One of my favorite quotes is attributed to Margaret Mead, though not sure if she actually said it: “always remember you are absolutely unique. Just like everybody else.”

I got into all of them (H, Y, S, and P) and I have no doubt I'd get in today if I were a HS senior. I don't understand why anybody would think otherwise. My grit and drive would have motivated me to do whatever it took to max out my resources and shine. Now, my kid doesn't have that same level of internal motivation and doesn't have the same top GPA and SAT scores. No way would they get in. Thankfully, they know this and I didn't have to tell them. They'll do great at other types of schools and have a fantastic life. It's all good.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DS is a superior student/athlete/artist/overall human being to his parents who matriculated HYPSM. 20+ years ago when we were going through it, however, college admissions wasn't a nuclear arms race. I'm fairly certain we would NEVER be accepted if we were applying now. I've been trying to drill this into DS's head since middle school, but he's now a junior and still has delusions of grandeur. I cannot for the life of me get him excited about safety colleges. Advice?

he will probably get in via legacy route. don't worry too much

No guarantees here. Youngest DC now in first year of school. The number of qualified Ivy legacies not admitted in their class seemed pretty high. And DH has a number of college classmates with kids not admitted to their alma mater.

So legacy helps, but it is not a guarantee.

No guarantees in life.

but a legacy has a much better chance than unhooked students.

Absolutely.