Anonymous wrote:Kind of. My kid got into her safeties and I would be perfectly happy if she went to them - solid good schools but nothing super prestigious or elite about them.

+1 I don't care about rankings but I do care about some of the inputs to those -- retention rate, are classes taught mainly by full-time faculty not TAs, depth of resources in the particular field my kids are interested in, quality of facilities. We focused on those things, not rankings. Right now DD's favorites are a mid-range private that's a safety and gave a lot of merit $ and an in-state reach that she may not get into. Either of those would be fine with me.

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Anonymous wrote:Maybe she should consider a vocational school. If you and she care so little about an academic education, why are you trying to force her into one? As for the credential alone, it’s not worth much from a ho-hum school, especially if the program and grades are also weak.

Where did I say her and I care so little about academic education? Are you inferring that just because we don’t care about the prestige of the school? And where did I say I was forcing her into college? She absolutely positively wants to go.

Why don’t you care though? I think that’s what people are curious about. Is she not going in order to secure a future for herself?

You are confusing a school's prestige (created by a magazine no less) with the great academic education students receive at hundreds of colleges in the U.S. If you are hyperfocused on one kind of job at one Wall Street firm, then maybe this is a thing for you. Otherwise, prestige only matters at your mom's cocktail party.

This is a straw man. Consistently well-ranked schools really are that good and their student selectivity proves it and their alumni reinforce it. While it is true that a quality education can be had at many schools, it is not true for every school. Though a student may achieve in spite of their poor schooling, such an improbable outcome shouldn’t be compared to that of someone who has graduated from a top school. As for the latter, most would consider them a success or an interesting and smart person regardless of their eventual material success.

Thank you.

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Anonymous wrote:Just curious how many of us are out there. My Junior does well in school (not stellar), is artsy and a pretty good kid all around. I am letting her steer the ship in regards to college/major. I really just want her to be happy. Don’t give a crap about college rankings at all (pretty sure she doesn’t either). Anyone else?

Of course you don’t “care”… your child can’t compete for the top schools and rather than admit that your child’s capabilities limit her to a certain range of tier 3 schools, it’s easier to “claim” that you are opting out of the race but you were never in it to begin with,

Do people like you invest in therapy for your kids as much as getting them into a prestigious college?

Just the opposite. I cared a lot. Not about USNWR rankings or whether I have a “prestigious” car magnet. I care a lot about fit. Academic fit. We worked hard with our kids to take their favorite classes and the things they were really interested in and help them find an occupational path they would enjoy and do well. One that excited them and maximized their interests and talents. And then find colleges that had good programs and good outcomes in their area of interest. And personal fit. Someplace where they would meet their people, enjoy the culture, Be active in the community outside of classes and have fun. For example, one kid plays an instrument recreationally and it was important to her to find a school with music performance opportunities for non-majors.

Academic fit, plus social fit (plus financial fit!) takes effort. But the payoff is happy kids who love their college, get good grades and are on a path to being self supporting in something they enjoy.

But, you do you. Let your kid choose a college because the girls are hot and discover a year in theY don’t have the major he wants and most of the kids a d-bags.

DCUM and the black and white thinking. OP-I don’t care about prestige. Some of DCUM-well I guess you don’t care about rigor and academics and your kids future. FFS.

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Anonymous wrote:I do care because I equate top schools with better opportunities. I know that my child wants a lifestyle that is at least the same as how they grew up (UMC) and a top school will make that more likely. Do you not care because you don’t care about those sorts of outcomes?

How do you know a top school will make that outcome more likely? Your child could go to a less prestigious school and continue their UMC existence.

It’s more likely because the kind of employers that pay really well routinely hire from top schools. While it’s certainly not impossible to achieve a UMC existence without a top school (and if that weren’t possible for my kid for whatever reason, I wouldn’t think that it couldn’t be achieved) , I don’t think anyone can reasonably argue that it’s not more likely. I understand that a top school is not dispositive of success but it’s one more thing that helps.

This is simply not true. Some of the most successful people I know went to no-name state schools. And I also know Ivy grads who have done nothing with their lives. It’s not the school that counts. It’s the ambition, drive, perseverance and grit of the student that makes the difference.

+100

The Dale and Kruger study already shows that IT DOESN’T MATTER. All the hand-wringing on DCUM over the Ivies is useless.

+ another 100--everyone should be aware of Dale and Kruger before making college decisions.

Anonymous wrote:I do care because I equate top schools with better opportunities. I know that my child wants a lifestyle that is at least the same as how they grew up (UMC) and a top school will make that more likely. Do you not care because you don’t care about those sorts of outcomes?

Save a few majors, a kid can go to a public university and still end up UMC.

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do care because I equate top schools with better opportunities. I know that my child wants a lifestyle that is at least the same as how they grew up (UMC) and a top school will make that more likely. Do you not care because you don’t care about those sorts of outcomes?

How do you know a top school will make that outcome more likely? Your child could go to a less prestigious school and continue their UMC existence.

It’s more likely because the kind of employers that pay really well routinely hire from top schools. While it’s certainly not impossible to achieve a UMC existence without a top school (and if that weren’t possible for my kid for whatever reason, I wouldn’t think that it couldn’t be achieved) , I don’t think anyone can reasonably argue that it’s not more likely. I understand that a top school is not dispositive of success but it’s one more thing that helps.

"I don’t think anyone can reasonably argue that it’s not more likely"

Not true-- https://lesshighschoolstress.com/

Anonymous wrote:Just curious how many of us are out there. My Junior does well in school (not stellar), is artsy and a pretty good kid all around. I am letting her steer the ship in regards to college/major. I really just want her to be happy. Don’t give a crap about college rankings at all (pretty sure she doesn’t either). Anyone else?

Of course you don’t “care”… your child can’t compete for the top schools and rather than admit that your child’s capabilities limit her to a certain range of tier 3 schools, it’s easier to “claim” that you are opting out of the race but you were never in it to begin with,

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do care because I equate top schools with better opportunities. I know that my child wants a lifestyle that is at least the same as how they grew up (UMC) and a top school will make that more likely. Do you not care because you don’t care about those sorts of outcomes?

This except we are middle class

I don’t want my kids boomeranging and living in my basement after college while underemployed. I want them to support themselves and be productive citizens. So yes I care about their future and along with that comes caring about their college and major.

Part of happiness is be able to house, clothe, and feed yourselves. Are you super wealthy op and able to give your kid a financial safety net? We are not in that position.

But if your kid works hard and is self-motivated (as OP implied), they won't end up in your basement.

I work in higher ed. I have one child that went to an Ivy. I also know that a quality education can be had in a myriad of ways. Two year to four year, four year private, four year public - all are good options, and parents often exclude the importance of fit and learning style and prioritize prestige. A driven child will excel anywhere; conversely a nurturing, small school can bring out the best in a late bloomer. Low income and first generation students can flourish at two-year colleges, allowing them to master college before transferring to more rigorous schools. My two cents - focus on fit.

My junior may not even go to a 4 year. I have been helping her come up with a list of schools she hopefully could get into, but she has to get her grades up or that option won’t be possible. I know she really would like to go to a 4 year school, but her ADHD has always made school a struggle.

Honestly, the job she is shooting for only requires a credential from a 2 year program.

I have researched multiple avenues for her, including some 2 year programs in Canada, and she recently became interested in a school on Michigan’s UP.

I have known pretty much from the beginning that a top/prestige school will never happen for her. But in my research, I have found some great schools that may not be “top” but offer a great education and experience for kids who aren’t academic stars.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe she should consider a vocational school. If you and she care so little about an academic education, why are you trying to force her into one? As for the credential alone, it’s not worth much from a ho-hum school, especially if the program and grades are also weak.

Where did I say her and I care so little about academic education? Are you inferring that just because we don’t care about the prestige of the school? And where did I say I was forcing her into college? She absolutely positively wants to go.

Why don’t you care though? I think that’s what people are curious about. Is she not going in order to secure a future for herself?

You are confusing a school's prestige (created by a magazine no less) with the great academic education students receive at hundreds of colleges in the U.S. If you are hyperfocused on one kind of job at one Wall Street firm, then maybe this is a thing for you. Otherwise, prestige only matters at your mom's cocktail party.

This is a straw man. Consistently well-ranked schools really are that good and their student selectivity proves it and their alumni reinforce it. While it is true that a quality education can be had at many schools, it is not true for every school. Though a student may achieve in spite of their poor schooling, such an improbable outcome shouldn’t be compared to that of someone who has graduated from a top school. As for the latter, most would consider them a success or an interesting and smart person regardless of their eventual material success.

Anonymous wrote:Maybe she should consider a vocational school. If you and she care so little about an academic education, why are you trying to force her into one? As for the credential alone, it’s not worth much from a ho-hum school, especially if the program and grades are also weak.

Why would you assume that a child doing well in high school would not do well in college? Or that they would not end up at a college with strong programs in their area of interest? Or suggest that you should go to a vocational school if you don't care about rankings?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do care because I equate top schools with better opportunities. I know that my child wants a lifestyle that is at least the same as how they grew up (UMC) and a top school will make that more likely. Do you not care because you don’t care about those sorts of outcomes?

How do you know a top school will make that outcome more likely? Your child could go to a less prestigious school and continue their UMC existence.

It’s more likely because the kind of employers that pay really well routinely hire from top schools. While it’s certainly not impossible to achieve a UMC existence without a top school (and if that weren’t possible for my kid for whatever reason, I wouldn’t think that it couldn’t be achieved) , I don’t think anyone can reasonably argue that it’s not more likely. I understand that a top school is not dispositive of success but it’s one more thing that helps.

This is simply not true. Some of the most successful people I know went to no-name state schools. And I also know Ivy grads who have done nothing with their lives. It’s not the school that counts. It’s the ambition, drive, perseverance and grit of the student that makes the difference.

+100

The Dale and Kruger study already shows that IT DOESN’T MATTER. All the hand-wringing on DCUM over the Ivies is useless.