So for vast swaths of the rest of our nation, it's ok to think of yourself and not your guests? And it's acceptable to make your guests at your celebratory event feel uncomfortable and obligated to pay money for being at your event?

You are completely failing to register the fact that for many guests, the things that YOU find offensive cause them no offense at all, and they view it as part of a tradition. Baby shower money tree, I have never heard of, but dollar dance was present at probably every wedding I attended other than a handful in DC. Guests at the celebratory event did not feel uncomfortable and obligated to pay - rather, it was very much a commonplace and expected tradition, and the expectation is that you get to dance with the bride (or groom) for a few moments, offer your best wishes - and yes, GASP, give them a dollar. Oh, the horror.

Seriously, if you are so easily offended and made to feel uncomfortable, how do you function?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For all of you knocking the "dollar dance" at weddings, it is very much a cultural thing. Know your audience.

In DC, that means know that everyone will be offended by everything you do or don't do, if it doesn't comply with their very own standards and/or the latest edition of Miss Manners or Emily Post. And if their standards exceed those of MM/EP, you will offend by not meeting their standards (see, e.g., imaginary requirement that thank you cards be sent to gift givers who were thanked in person).

Did you put where you were registered on your wedding invite too?????

Engraved wedding invitations on a lovely, thick ecru paper, ordered from fancy schmancy store, formal in every way, no registry information at all. I followed all possible elevated, annoyed, pretentious, irritating and holier-than-thou requirements of etiquette to ensure I didn't offend any of the persons who were invited to our wedding (quite a mixed crowd). That said, I am smart enough to recognize that certain standards of etiquette - that which is deemed proper or improper - are very much cultural and/or regional, and what would offend one group (snotballs on DCUM) would not offend another (vast swaths of the rest of our nation). But go ahead and find yourself superior, if it makes you feel better.

So for vast swaths of the rest of our nation, it's ok to think of yourself and not your guests? And it's acceptable to make your guests at your celebratory event feel uncomfortable and obligated to pay money for being at your event?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the dollar dance is usually an Italian thing, right?

I'm afraid to say yes for fear the next post will be about how low-class and dirty we all are. Where I grew up is very Italian and Catholic and the dollar dance is extremely common. You pay a dollar, dance with the bride, then you get a shot of something like whiskey, limoncello, sambuca, etc. I don't love it, so I didn't have one, but trust me, the last thing they are in my little hometown are "greedy and entitled."

Also Polish and other more Eastern European countries. But apparently if you don't hail from that heritage, you are free to bash their traditions. In turn, not being Jewish, I guess I should get outraged about those crazy Jewish kids shattering glass in front of wedding guests. How vulgar.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For all of you knocking the "dollar dance" at weddings, it is very much a cultural thing. Know your audience.

In DC, that means know that everyone will be offended by everything you do or don't do, if it doesn't comply with their very own standards and/or the latest edition of Miss Manners or Emily Post. And if their standards exceed those of MM/EP, you will offend by not meeting their standards (see, e.g., imaginary requirement that thank you cards be sent to gift givers who were thanked in person).

Did you put where you were registered on your wedding invite too?????

Engraved wedding invitations on a lovely, thick ecru paper, ordered from fancy schmancy store, formal in every way, no registry information at all. I followed all possible elevated, annoyed, pretentious, irritating and holier-than-thou requirements of etiquette to ensure I didn't offend any of the persons who were invited to our wedding (quite a mixed crowd). That said, I am smart enough to recognize that certain standards of etiquette - that which is deemed proper or improper - are very much cultural and/or regional, and what would offend one group (snotballs on DCUM) would not offend another (vast swaths of the rest of our nation). But go ahead and find yourself superior, if it makes you feel better.

Anonymous wrote:I think the dollar dance is usually an Italian thing, right?

I'm afraid to say yes for fear the next post will be about how low-class and dirty we all are. Where I grew up is very Italian and Catholic and the dollar dance is extremely common. You pay a dollar, dance with the bride, then you get a shot of something like whiskey, limoncello, sambuca, etc. I don't love it, so I didn't have one, but trust me, the last thing they are in my little hometown are "greedy and entitled."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm realizing more and more how clueless people are about basic etiquette. I used to think my mom was too hung up on the "rules", but now I appreciate knowing how to properly host things. I was just talking to BIL's fiancee last night about her potluck wedding shower. Her friend is "hosting", her mother is cooking most of the food, and she has asked MIL to bring food as well. Part of her ignorance about etiquette is cultural, but the same can't be said for most people who just don't have a clue.

Who defines etiquette though? I know it's great to be polite but really, it's 2010 not 1940. Sometimes etiquette is as outdated as some of the religious BS of the Catholic Church. Sit, stand, kneel, sit, stand, kneel... Like the blind leading the blind. It's so regional, cultural, and changeable. You etiquette ladies smitten can be classy and far from tacky w/out judging others or following your outdated etiquette books. Sheesh.

Ah here comes the Catholic Bashing! Nice

Isn't it, though? And it certainly gives the PP-Catholic-basher credibility!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm realizing more and more how clueless people are about basic etiquette. I used to think my mom was too hung up on the "rules", but now I appreciate knowing how to properly host things. I was just talking to BIL's fiancee last night about her potluck wedding shower. Her friend is "hosting", her mother is cooking most of the food, and she has asked MIL to bring food as well. Part of her ignorance about etiquette is cultural, but the same can't be said for most people who just don't have a clue.

Who defines etiquette though? I know it's great to be polite but really, it's 2010 not 1940. Sometimes etiquette is as outdated as some of the religious BS of the Catholic Church. Sit, stand, kneel, sit, stand, kneel... Like the blind leading the blind. It's so regional, cultural, and changeable. You etiquette ladies smitten can be classy and far from tacky w/out judging others or following your outdated etiquette books. Sheesh.

Ah here comes the Catholic Bashing! Nice

I come from a culture (Russian Jewish) where money giving is a standard gift for big events like babies and weddings BUT you never ask for it outright! Also, this is a tradition among closely related people--not coworkers and general shower audiences.

OP, you're right to think that this shower approach is tacky. If you feel obligated to go, I really like the PPs' suggestions that instead of cash you get a gift card (w/o the amount showing) and there's the shower gift and their stupid money tree thing in one.

Anonymous wrote:For all of you knocking the "dollar dance" at weddings, it is very much a cultural thing. Know your audience.

In DC, that means know that everyone will be offended by everything you do or don't do, if it doesn't comply with their very own standards and/or the latest edition of Miss Manners or Emily Post. And if their standards exceed those of MM/EP, you will offend by not meeting their standards (see, e.g., imaginary requirement that thank you cards be sent to gift givers who were thanked in person).

Did you put where you were registered on your wedding invite too?????

I'm Korean, and while gift giving in my culture is understood as money, no one actually out right asks for it! That is considered crass (although mothers and sisters happily host showers, not friends).

There is an elaborate unspoken ritual where you're supposed to refuse the monetary gift, the money is offered, it's refused, etc., and then you finally accept.

Well, I am from the DC area and I find the money tree concept AND asking for your guests to bring food/drink to be disgusting. And I'm not a huge etiquette person. And to ask this of a co-worker who already feels obliged to go? Yuck.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm realizing more and more how clueless people are about basic etiquette. I used to think my mom was too hung up on the "rules", but now I appreciate knowing how to properly host things. I was just talking to BIL's fiancee last night about her potluck wedding shower. Her friend is "hosting", her mother is cooking most of the food, and she has asked MIL to bring food as well. Part of her ignorance about etiquette is cultural, but the same can't be said for most people who just don't have a clue.

Who defines etiquette though? I know it's great to be polite but really, it's 2010 not 1940. Sometimes etiquette is as outdated as some of the religious BS of the Catholic Church. Sit, stand, kneel, sit, stand, kneel... Like the blind leading the blind. It's so regional, cultural, and changeable. You etiquette ladies smitten can be classy and far from tacky w/out judging others or following your outdated etiquette books. Sheesh.

Leaving aside the substance of why we need etiquette:

1. The sweeping insult re: millions of practicing Catholics is just mean and gratuitous.
2. You contradict yourself when you say that those rituals of Catholic worship are "so regional, cultural, and changeable." In fact, not much has changed on that score for many hundreds of years.

16:18 WELL SAID.

Plus, I see the money dance is cultural, but from google research it does not seem that the money tree is. Perhaps it's regional.


Heck why not just skip thr wedding and send out a card to all saying "we got hitched or knocked up, now send some green. Here's a thank you in advance so I don't have to waste time writing a note."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm realizing more and more how clueless people are about basic etiquette. I used to think my mom was too hung up on the "rules", but now I appreciate knowing how to properly host things. I was just talking to BIL's fiancee last night about her potluck wedding shower. Her friend is "hosting", her mother is cooking most of the food, and she has asked MIL to bring food as well. Part of her ignorance about etiquette is cultural, but the same can't be said for most people who just don't have a clue.

Who defines etiquette though? I know it's great to be polite but really, it's 2010 not 1940. Sometimes etiquette is as outdated as some of the religious BS of the Catholic Church. Sit, stand, kneel, sit, stand, kneel... Like the blind leading the blind. It's so regional, cultural, and changeable. You etiquette ladies smitten can be classy and far from tacky w/out judging others or following your outdated etiquette books. Sheesh.

According to Emily Post: "The definition of etiquette -- a code of behavior based on thoughtfulness -- has not changed since Emily's day. The etiquette guidelines we use to smooth the way change all the time. "

And: When asked "What is the definition of etiquette?", Naomi Polson, who received her etiquette certificate in Washington DC and is the Founding Director of The Etiquette Company, replies, "Etiquette has to do with good manners. It's not so much our own good manners, but making other people feel comfortable by the way we behave. So it's more or less thinking of others and how others perceive us: So that everyone knows the rules for doing things and everyone is in a very comfortable position in society."

Etiquette and manners are useful because they grease the wheels of human interaction, and make people comfortable engaging with other people in social situations.

RE asking for money at showers & weddings: It is not thoughtful to ask people for money at a celebratory social event. Such a request suggests that the hosts are not thinking of others; they are thinking of themselves. Such a request does not make invited guests feel comfortable.

That's why it is bad manners.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm realizing more and more how clueless people are about basic etiquette. I used to think my mom was too hung up on the "rules", but now I appreciate knowing how to properly host things. I was just talking to BIL's fiancee last night about her potluck wedding shower. Her friend is "hosting", her mother is cooking most of the food, and she has asked MIL to bring food as well. Part of her ignorance about etiquette is cultural, but the same can't be said for most people who just don't have a clue.

Who defines etiquette though? I know it's great to be polite but really, it's 2010 not 1940. Sometimes etiquette is as outdated as some of the religious BS of the Catholic Church. Sit, stand, kneel, sit, stand, kneel... Like the blind leading the blind. It's so regional, cultural, and changeable. You etiquette ladies smitten can be classy and far from tacky w/out judging others or following your outdated etiquette books. Sheesh.

Um, there are reasons you kneel - its not just for exercise during mass you know...