Anonymous wrote:I drive a cheaper all EV (not a Tesla). Not having to fill up is a huge plus. I have to charge my car about once or twice a week (it depends on the weather). The car itself has a very smooth/quick acceleration and is very easy to drive. I got a good deal on the car, especially with the tax rebate. I charge at home during non-peak hours so charging is cheap.

If you're looking for a commuter car and have the ability to put a charger in at home, I'd recommend it. Our other car is a plug in hybrid which has a shorter range but is usually enough to do most normal commute and errands on all EV. But we have that car for linger trips if needed.

If you're worried about range, the plug in hybrids are pretty great too.

This. I am a liberal but don't try to push my thoughts onto anyone. Usually... I have a Tesla and all of this applies. It is Wonderful to not visit gas stations or worry about the price of gas going up. EV is amazing. I'll push this view here since you asked!

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Anonymous wrote:I mean there are also reasons to buy an EV that have nothing to do with the environment. I've gotten poop, gum, spit and other disgusting things on my hands using gas pumps. I just charge my EV at home so that doesn't happen with that car.

Yeah, one of the biggest reasons I got an EV was I got solar on my roof and was running a credit every month. Pepco won't refund you the difference and I needed a new car anyway so it was win-win. I got a Model 3 and any other car I was looking at was going to be in that price range anyway, this way I get free "gas" and loads better acceleration than anything else in that price range. The environmental benefits are great but I'd have done it for the financial and performance benefits alone.

Pepco won't refund overages? When we installed solar in ~2015 they did in DC. We no longer own that home, but that is news to me.

They refund you at the wholesale rate, which is much lower than the rate they charge you for electricity you're using. So if you're generating a surplus from solar, charging your EV might be a more cost-effective place for you to put the excess energy rather than back into the grid. I think it's still better for the overall electric system to send excess electricity into the grid at times of peak demand and charge at night when there's less overall use, but free charging from the sun IS pretty appealing.

I don't even think that is true, see the later comment by the PP, but they give you a credit at their regular rate if I recall.

Based on my experience, they put a negative charge on the bill for months where there's an overage. It stays on there until it offsets charges, that's right. The rate is a lower rate than the rate they charge you for electricity. We've had solar on two different houses, but the systems were never large enough that we NEVER had positive charges -- at some point, even if we had a few months' worth of surplus built up, we wound up running out of it.

There are third-party suppliers who will give you a larger credit and/or just cut you a check for surpluses, but as far as EV charging goes, it's probably easier just to plug the car in when it's sunny.

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Anonymous wrote:I mean there are also reasons to buy an EV that have nothing to do with the environment. I've gotten poop, gum, spit and other disgusting things on my hands using gas pumps. I just charge my EV at home so that doesn't happen with that car.

Yeah, one of the biggest reasons I got an EV was I got solar on my roof and was running a credit every month. Pepco won't refund you the difference and I needed a new car anyway so it was win-win. I got a Model 3 and any other car I was looking at was going to be in that price range anyway, this way I get free "gas" and loads better acceleration than anything else in that price range. The environmental benefits are great but I'd have done it for the financial and performance benefits alone.

Pepco won't refund overages? When we installed solar in ~2015 they did in DC. We no longer own that home, but that is news to me.

They refund you at the wholesale rate, which is much lower than the rate they charge you for electricity you're using. So if you're generating a surplus from solar, charging your EV might be a more cost-effective place for you to put the excess energy rather than back into the grid. I think it's still better for the overall electric system to send excess electricity into the grid at times of peak demand and charge at night when there's less overall use, but free charging from the sun IS pretty appealing.

I don't even think that is true, see the later comment by the PP, but they give you a credit at their regular rate if I recall.

Once you drive an EV, it is hard to go back to a gas motor. Car starts instantly, and there is no engine noise. Acceleration is smooth, and once you get used to engine breaking, you hardly apply brakes except in fast stops. Maintenance is minimal (no oil or coolant), and it is easy to plug in at night.

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Anonymous wrote:I mean there are also reasons to buy an EV that have nothing to do with the environment. I've gotten poop, gum, spit and other disgusting things on my hands using gas pumps. I just charge my EV at home so that doesn't happen with that car.

Yeah, one of the biggest reasons I got an EV was I got solar on my roof and was running a credit every month. Pepco won't refund you the difference and I needed a new car anyway so it was win-win. I got a Model 3 and any other car I was looking at was going to be in that price range anyway, this way I get free "gas" and loads better acceleration than anything else in that price range. The environmental benefits are great but I'd have done it for the financial and performance benefits alone.

Pepco won't refund overages? When we installed solar in ~2015 they did in DC. We no longer own that home, but that is news to me.

Maybe I wasn't clear - they will give you a bill credit, but if your panels consistently overproduce all that ever happens is your negative bill gets bigger and bigger. You can't "cash out" and have them send you a check for your negative balance.

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Anonymous wrote:I mean there are also reasons to buy an EV that have nothing to do with the environment. I've gotten poop, gum, spit and other disgusting things on my hands using gas pumps. I just charge my EV at home so that doesn't happen with that car.

Yeah, one of the biggest reasons I got an EV was I got solar on my roof and was running a credit every month. Pepco won't refund you the difference and I needed a new car anyway so it was win-win. I got a Model 3 and any other car I was looking at was going to be in that price range anyway, this way I get free "gas" and loads better acceleration than anything else in that price range. The environmental benefits are great but I'd have done it for the financial and performance benefits alone.

Pepco won't refund overages? When we installed solar in ~2015 they did in DC. We no longer own that home, but that is news to me.

They refund you at the wholesale rate, which is much lower than the rate they charge you for electricity you're using. So if you're generating a surplus from solar, charging your EV might be a more cost-effective place for you to put the excess energy rather than back into the grid. I think it's still better for the overall electric system to send excess electricity into the grid at times of peak demand and charge at night when there's less overall use, but free charging from the sun IS pretty appealing.

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Anonymous wrote:I mean there are also reasons to buy an EV that have nothing to do with the environment. I've gotten poop, gum, spit and other disgusting things on my hands using gas pumps. I just charge my EV at home so that doesn't happen with that car.

Yeah, one of the biggest reasons I got an EV was I got solar on my roof and was running a credit every month. Pepco won't refund you the difference and I needed a new car anyway so it was win-win. I got a Model 3 and any other car I was looking at was going to be in that price range anyway, this way I get free "gas" and loads better acceleration than anything else in that price range. The environmental benefits are great but I'd have done it for the financial and performance benefits alone.

Pepco won't refund overages? When we installed solar in ~2015 they did in DC. We no longer own that home, but that is news to me.

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Anonymous wrote:90% it’s status and virtue signaling. And I’m an environmentalist. Most people who own EV fly enough that their commute is noise (esp in new WFH paradigm)

Let me guess, you also make that tired joke about getting a diet coke with your cheeseburger meal?

Flying + EV < Flying + ICE

The bottom line is it's a net benefit. Sorry the benefit isn't good enough for you, Mr. random internet stranger, but I really couldn't care less.

Well us factually it’s not true. Last estimate I saw was it’s a couple of gallons of gas per person for a 3 hour flight. Those planes are pretty efficient, esp on a per person basis.

That's not the point. The point is that REGARDLESS of what your other carbon emissions are, driving an EV is a net benefit over driving a gas car.

The point other people are making is that someone living in a large suburban home who flies to go on vacation is just virtue signaling.

Right, but they aren't just virtue signaling -- even with their large suburban home and their flights, they're still cutting their carbon footprint by driving an EV instead of a gas car. Which is a much easier change to make if you're getting a car anyway; is the idea here supposed to be that no one should do anything to lower their personal emissions unless they first sell their house and swear of air travel?

Exactly. I posted this earlier but it got buried in a quote:

No, it isn't. And this argument is dumb...amounts to if I can't do everything right, don't do anything right.
I have not found a viable alternative to flying, except for cutting down.
I HAVE found a viable alternative for driving...one that contributes less to noise and air pollution in my environment.
I also don't buy plastic or eat meat, even though I have a dog, a child, and a new house.
We do the best we can.

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Anonymous wrote:90% it’s status and virtue signaling. And I’m an environmentalist. Most people who own EV fly enough that their commute is noise (esp in new WFH paradigm)

Let me guess, you also make that tired joke about getting a diet coke with your cheeseburger meal?

Flying + EV < Flying + ICE

The bottom line is it's a net benefit. Sorry the benefit isn't good enough for you, Mr. random internet stranger, but I really couldn't care less.

Well us factually it’s not true. Last estimate I saw was it’s a couple of gallons of gas per person for a 3 hour flight. Those planes are pretty efficient, esp on a per person basis.

That's not the point. The point is that REGARDLESS of what your other carbon emissions are, driving an EV is a net benefit over driving a gas car.

The point other people are making is that someone living in a large suburban home who flies to go on vacation is just virtue signaling.

Right, but they aren't just virtue signaling -- even with their large suburban home and their flights, they're still cutting their carbon footprint by driving an EV instead of a gas car. Which is a much easier change to make if you're getting a car anyway; is the idea here supposed to be that no one should do anything to lower their personal emissions unless they first sell their house and swear of air travel?

We started with a 2015 SparkEV. We bought it used with a little over 400 miles on it in 2016. I loved that little car. Definitely no virtue signaling driving around a Chevy Spark, but that torque! 327 lb-ft. The SparkEV would get between 85-110 miles of range per charge. It was truly a little run around car (both of our workplaces are within 1.5 miles from home). We drive each car about 6k miles a year. A few months after buying the SparkEV, we purchased a new 2017 Volt. The Volt gets us between 52-65 miles on EV. We still have the Volt, but sold the SparkEV and bought a used 2019 Bolt for $19k.

We love not having to stop at gas stations. The instant torque is nice. The Volt doesn't seem as quick but it's rated at 294 lb-ft and the Bolt at 266 lb-ft is lower than our SparkEV was, but it's still plenty. Charging doesn't cost us much. We can have one plugged into 110 outlet and the other into a level 2, 240 home station, but that's not often necessary with the amount of driving we do.

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Anonymous wrote:How do they do for long trips? How long do you have to stop to charge? Have you ever gotten stuck because others are charging at your planned stop?

Our EV has a range of 250 miles. We don't make long trips very often, or we use our other (non-EV) vehicle just because it's bigger and we're carrying luggage.

250 miles is about 4 hours of driving, and you can look for charging spots along the way -- they usually have them at convenience stores or the like off major highways. Our EV comes with free charging on the Electrity America network, and they tend to have their charging stations at Walmarts or shopping malls. Charging is about 20 minutes to charge the battery mostly full.

NP. Suppose I wanted to drive to NYC. That sounds like it would be cutting it close so I wouldn't want to go the whole drive without a charge. I'm assuming I could charge at a rest stop. But if all the chargers are in use, then I have to wait 20 or so to begin to start my charging? So my 15 min rest stop to pee and fill up would know potentially become a 40min stop?

Tesla owner here, I can make it to Brooklyn with 5-10% to spare. There are like 15 chargers along the route from DC to NY, and you can use pretty much any of them since you only need like 10-20% for a safety buffer to make sure you get to a charger on your way back.

Total charging time is like 10 minutes on the way there, 30 on the way back. I've owned my car since 2019 and only ever had to wait for a spot to open up once. I'm not a "power through at all costs" driver, I like to make stops to get a drink or food and stretch my legs. I'd be pretty confident in saying there is 0 difference in travel time for me doing DC-NY in an EV vs. an ICE.

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:90% it’s status and virtue signaling. And I’m an environmentalist. Most people who own EV fly enough that their commute is noise (esp in new WFH paradigm)

Let me guess, you also make that tired joke about getting a diet coke with your cheeseburger meal?

Flying + EV < Flying + ICE

The bottom line is it's a net benefit. Sorry the benefit isn't good enough for you, Mr. random internet stranger, but I really couldn't care less.

Well us factually it’s not true. Last estimate I saw was it’s a couple of gallons of gas per person for a 3 hour flight. Those planes are pretty efficient, esp on a per person basis.

That's not the point. The point is that REGARDLESS of what your other carbon emissions are, driving an EV is a net benefit over driving a gas car.

The point other people are making is that someone living in a large suburban home who flies to go on vacation is just virtue signaling.

Anonymous wrote:I mean there are also reasons to buy an EV that have nothing to do with the environment. I've gotten poop, gum, spit and other disgusting things on my hands using gas pumps. I just charge my EV at home so that doesn't happen with that car.

Yeah, one of the biggest reasons I got an EV was I got solar on my roof and was running a credit every month. Pepco won't refund you the difference and I needed a new car anyway so it was win-win. I got a Model 3 and any other car I was looking at was going to be in that price range anyway, this way I get free "gas" and loads better acceleration than anything else in that price range. The environmental benefits are great but I'd have done it for the financial and performance benefits alone.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:90% it’s status and virtue signaling. And I’m an environmentalist. Most people who own EV fly enough that their commute is noise (esp in new WFH paradigm)

Let me guess, you also make that tired joke about getting a diet coke with your cheeseburger meal?

Flying + EV < Flying + ICE

The bottom line is it's a net benefit. Sorry the benefit isn't good enough for you, Mr. random internet stranger, but I really couldn't care less.

Well us factually it’s not true. Last estimate I saw was it’s a couple of gallons of gas per person for a 3 hour flight. Those planes are pretty efficient, esp on a per person basis.

That's not the point. The point is that REGARDLESS of what your other carbon emissions are, driving an EV is a net benefit over driving a gas car.

I mean there are also reasons to buy an EV that have nothing to do with the environment. I've gotten poop, gum, spit and other disgusting things on my hands using gas pumps. I just charge my EV at home so that doesn't happen with that car.