Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:taxes are very high in the USA where you lose about 60% so it's not really 200K it ends up being take home of like 134K which isn't much

https://www.yahoo.com/now/actually-home-200-000-salary-100000562.html

Taxes are actually absurdly low in the USA where we only pretend to live in a modern first world nation

Correct. I'm French. Go live and pay taxes in France and report back, first PP.

Anonymous wrote:I hate to say this but if you were talking about HHI for a family with kids in DMV area, I'd have to agree with your friend. 200k after deduction is no more than 100-120k then you have living expenses/college savings...etc. yeah, that's not enough.

Then how do I do it with a tween and teen, hmm? We have a pretty nice life.

Shame on you, PP. You know most people don't live on 200K a year in the DC area. You're disgusting.

200k is basically our family income goal. Right now we are at around 130k, but I'm working part time (though that comes with a big savings in childcare at the moment, so it's worth it). Hoping to get there in the next 5 years though, as I transition to full time work and DH likely moves up a level at work.

The trick is that we already own our home and only have one child. Moving to 200k without moving from a house where we already have a ton of equity, and then not shifting our lifestyle at all, means that money will be a massive boost in terms of college and retirement savings. We are already very frugal.

It's totally possible to do this. But not if you are determined to have multiple kids, live in a 3k square foot home in the best neighborhood, send kids to private schools, always have new clothes and nice furnishings, eat out a lot, always have a car or cars that are less than 5 years old, and take multiple nice vacations every year. But not one of those things is a necessity. You can have fewer kids and be very happy, no one needs as much space as they think, there are plenty of good publics out there if you are smart about it, clothes and furniture and cars still work and can even look nice when they are 5, 10, even 15 years old. And you can still travel plenty, and to interesting locations, on a budget -- we do a foreign trip only every other year, one of our vacations each year is a big road trip, and we have learned that with a very young child, this is a good time to take low-key and less expensive vacations to accessible destinations.

People often aren't very good at discerning between "needs" and "wants". You can have everything you need on 200k a year in this area (heck, I'm proof you can do that on 130k a year, though I'd like to be saving more). You will never, ever have everything you want. There are too many things to want! You just have to learn to live with that, no matter your income.

Anonymous wrote:Depends on her amount of debt, existing savings and expenses. If she's already 40 with credit card debt, 6 figure student loans, huge mortgage, no college savings for kid, no retirement saved, in a bad school district so she wants to do private, high COL, etc.

LOL. Is a 1 Billion a year salary a lot of money?
No. Allow me to also say that it isn't enough if you have a 30 Billions CC debt, 10 figure student loans, 1M a month mortgage payment, no college savings, no retirement savings.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:200K is the top 20% of HHI in the DC metropolitan area. If you feel you need to "compromise", you are an entitled spoiled brat whose completely out-of-touch with reality.

I'd love for you to link us a 4br+ 4000sf+ single family home in a top school district and low crime with a big yard, garage, and a 15 minute commute to downtown DC that you could afford on a $200K income while maxing out 2 401Ks, Roth IRAs, and 529s for 3 kids.

Because if you can't find all of that, you're going to have to give some of it up to be able to find something you can afford. And what's another word for giving things up to be able to get some of what you want? It starts with a "C..."

Agree. A comfortable, middle class to upper middle class lifestyle to me means:

- max out 401k(s) or IRA(s)
- adequately save in a 529 plan
- mortgage on a ~3000 SF house with a 2-car garage and a yard in a safe neighborhood in a good school district
- 2 vacations a year
- kids' activities (and child care if both parents work)
- family car(s)

$200,000 / year isn't enough for the above-described lifestyle. No chauffeurs or other extravagant expenses mentioned above.

That's not a middle class lifestyle, not in the US right now. Maybe it was for boomers but not today.

This is like parents with a kid who got a 33 on ACT saying he is in 97%tile in US. It maybe a true statement but not in DMV. It's barely 50%tile or so (my guess) b/c so many kids get 34-36s. It's not a generational issue, it's a locality issue.

This is so out of touch too! Just bc there are a lot of people with high scores and high incomes doesn't make 200k income and 35 ACT the "middle". Look at actual data--that's top 20% HHI in the DMV and top 5% ACT scores in the DMV.

You are proving my point. It’s middle for this area. That was the whole point. Ugh…

$200K HHI would put you at the 79th percentile in the District. I think you’d be closer to 85th percentile in the DC metro area.

$200K is middle class inside the Beltway.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:200K is the top 20% of HHI in the DC metropolitan area. If you feel you need to "compromise", you are an entitled spoiled brat whose completely out-of-touch with reality.

I'd love for you to link us a 4br+ 4000sf+ single family home in a top school district and low crime with a big yard, garage, and a 15 minute commute to downtown DC that you could afford on a $200K income while maxing out 2 401Ks, Roth IRAs, and 529s for 3 kids.

Because if you can't find all of that, you're going to have to give some of it up to be able to find something you can afford. And what's another word for giving things up to be able to get some of what you want? It starts with a "C..."

Agree. A comfortable, middle class to upper middle class lifestyle to me means:

- max out 401k(s) or IRA(s)
- adequately save in a 529 plan
- mortgage on a ~3000 SF house with a 2-car garage and a yard in a safe neighborhood in a good school district
- 2 vacations a year
- kids' activities (and child care if both parents work)
- family car(s)

$200,000 / year isn't enough for the above-described lifestyle. No chauffeurs or other extravagant expenses mentioned above.

That's not a middle class lifestyle, not in the US right now. Maybe it was for boomers but not today.

This is like parents with a kid who got a 33 on ACT saying he is in 97%tile in US. It maybe a true statement but not in DMV. It's barely 50%tile or so (my guess) b/c so many kids get 34-36s. It's not a generational issue, it's a locality issue.

This is so out of touch too! Just bc there are a lot of people with high scores and high incomes doesn't make 200k income and 35 ACT the "middle". Look at actual data--that's top 20% HHI in the DMV and top 5% ACT scores in the DMV.

200k is fine in the burbs like Rockville, mid level schools , two cars, savings for future.

Even 10 years ago, that seemed like plenty of money for raising a family. The way housing costs have gone, it really doesn't seem like a lot anymore for those just starting out.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:200K is the top 20% of HHI in the DC metropolitan area. If you feel you need to "compromise", you are an entitled spoiled brat whose completely out-of-touch with reality.

I'd love for you to link us a 4br+ 4000sf+ single family home in a top school district and low crime with a big yard, garage, and a 15 minute commute to downtown DC that you could afford on a $200K income while maxing out 2 401Ks, Roth IRAs, and 529s for 3 kids.

Because if you can't find all of that, you're going to have to give some of it up to be able to find something you can afford. And what's another word for giving things up to be able to get some of what you want? It starts with a "C..."

Agree. A comfortable, middle class to upper middle class lifestyle to me means:

- max out 401k(s) or IRA(s)
- adequately save in a 529 plan
- mortgage on a ~3000 SF house with a 2-car garage and a yard in a safe neighborhood in a good school district
- 2 vacations a year
- kids' activities (and child care if both parents work)
- family car(s)

$200,000 / year isn't enough for the above-described lifestyle. No chauffeurs or other extravagant expenses mentioned above.

That's not a middle class lifestyle, not in the US right now. Maybe it was for boomers but not today.

Who said anything about middle class? The PP said you don't have to compromise on housing if you earn $200K. Middle class is basically the definition of requiring compromise. Not having to compromise means getting absolutely everything you want in a house - size, location, commute, schools, etc.

PP defined a comfortable middle class Lifestyle as including at least 20k for retirement, half that or more for college savings, a house that will probably cost close to a million dollars in any major metro area, and thats before you even get to the vacations. That is not even close to middle class anymore unless you define middle class so expansively that you make everyone middle class.

It's location specific (you could live that lifestyle in the mid west on $200k, but not here) so if you live in a metro area, $200k isn't that much money. A family making $200k in any location probably isn't sending their kids to private schools, going on ski vacations or to Hawaii or Europe, or driving a luxury SUV, which are all indicators of UMC. Wealthy families are differentiated from UMC families by things like a net jets account, expensive art, full time housekeepers, multiple homes, country club memberships, etc. I agree with OP's friend that $200k isn't a lot of money around here.

I think there is a big difference whether the $200k is from one earner or two earners, and then how many kids they have. That money is going to go a lot further if it's a single earner with a SAH spouse and 1 kid vs. two working parents that need to cover childcare costs/college savings for 3 kids. Also if you bought a house years ago vs. trying to buy one now.

We have a similar HHI and it's totally fine, we are comfortable, but I agree with those who said you are still making choices/compromises with that income in a high COL area like the DMV. DH has a crappy commute and our house is always having old-house-problems. But we are on track to save enough for in-state tuition for our kids which is way more than my parents were able to do.

Wow. I am a single parent who makes just under 100K. I do pretty much live paycheck to paycheck, and do not save much, but my daughter and I have the basics, including a small home, plenty of food, and a modest vacation each summer.

I am not yet able to put much away for college for my daughter, but her grandparents have put away quite a bit for her, so there is at least a good start.

I would be thrilled to have a 200K salary, and I can't imagine thinking that is a small amount of money.

Anonymous wrote:taxes are very high in the USA where you lose about 60% so it's not really 200K it ends up being take home of like 134K which isn't much

https://www.yahoo.com/now/actually-home-200-000-salary-100000562.html

Taxes are actually absurdly low in the USA where we only pretend to live in a modern first world nation

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:200K is the top 20% of HHI in the DC metropolitan area. If you feel you need to "compromise", you are an entitled spoiled brat whose completely out-of-touch with reality.

I'd love for you to link us a 4br+ 4000sf+ single family home in a top school district and low crime with a big yard, garage, and a 15 minute commute to downtown DC that you could afford on a $200K income while maxing out 2 401Ks, Roth IRAs, and 529s for 3 kids.

Because if you can't find all of that, you're going to have to give some of it up to be able to find something you can afford. And what's another word for giving things up to be able to get some of what you want? It starts with a "C..."

Agree. A comfortable, middle class to upper middle class lifestyle to me means:

- max out 401k(s) or IRA(s)
- adequately save in a 529 plan
- mortgage on a ~3000 SF house with a 2-car garage and a yard in a safe neighborhood in a good school district
- 2 vacations a year
- kids' activities (and child care if both parents work)
- family car(s)

$200,000 / year isn't enough for the above-described lifestyle. No chauffeurs or other extravagant expenses mentioned above.

That's not a middle class lifestyle, not in the US right now. Maybe it was for boomers but not today.

Who said anything about middle class? The PP said you don't have to compromise on housing if you earn $200K. Middle class is basically the definition of requiring compromise. Not having to compromise means getting absolutely everything you want in a house - size, location, commute, schools, etc.

PP defined a comfortable middle class Lifestyle as including at least 20k for retirement, half that or more for college savings, a house that will probably cost close to a million dollars in any major metro area, and thats before you even get to the vacations. That is not even close to middle class anymore unless you define middle class so expansively that you make everyone middle class.

taxes are very high in the USA where you lose about 60% so it's not really 200K it ends up being take home of like 134K which isn't much

https://www.yahoo.com/now/actually-home-200-000-salary-100000562.html