Anonymous
09/21/2021 12:36
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
I also knew several people who did ROTC at MIT. One spent a summer in a submarine based in CT. Wellesley also does it’s ROTC through MIT.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 12:25
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:I attended my DS’s medical school graduation a few years ago. He had a handful of fellow classmates who were military. They wore their specific uniform vs the doctorate cap and gown to the ceremony. My DS told me when it came to deciding upon their residency specialty, it had to be approved by their military branch. For example, if you wanted OBGYN and they didn’t need that specialty that year, you had to choose something else.
This is what I've heard as well. The two people I know got the residencies they wanted in the military residency program - surgical and psychiatry. But it's still a competition and you end up getting a residency in whatever the military needs that year. From what I understand, it may be easier to get a surgery residency in the military vs. the normal civilian residency placements. But that's hearsay and I have no evidence.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 12:24
Subject: Re:What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:Lot of misinformation on this thread. Speaking only from the experience of the Army. Some of this info might be dated, but it was accurate as of about 10 years ago:
If you have a college degree or are going to graduate, you can "enlist" with the purpose of attending Officer Candidate School. There's a selection process, and you don't have to sign anything binding before finding out if you have a slot (recruiters might say otherwise, but they're lying because they don't get bonuses for OCS enlistments, only regular enlisted). OCS is like 12-16 weeks and comes after attending Basic Training (used to be 9 weeks, no idea these days). You'll be paid at E-4 until you receive the commission.
ROTC can lead to scholarship money. One reason to do it is the sense of camaraderie. It's a big time commitment, but so are some sports and if that's what you like then good for you.
If you really care about making it a career, you should know there is an unspoken but obvious hierarchy in where Army officers come from. West Point > ROTC > OCS. Good people get promoted, and all lieutenants are treated (deservedly) like spoiled, dangerous amateurs, but as you get to mid-late career, wouldn't you know it, theres lots more of the former and fewer of the latter. Some of it is professional networks, some of it is snobbery. It's not right, but it is what it is. So that's a benefit to ROTC.
Now this is where some of my info might be dated. When an ROTC or West Point cadet graduates and is commissioned, and when an OCS candidate receives their commission, all three are mixed together and attend a course that used to be called BOLC II. This is where the three enlistment pathways merge, acclimatize and become "equals". After a few weeks of that they go their separate ways to their specialization schools. Armor, Infantry, Air Defense, etc.
Other branches might be different. I think the Marines might have an enlistment pathway that is more flexible, starting out enlisted for a few summers in the reserves while you're in college and then sending you to Officer Basic School or whatever they call it. That's what they told me, but at the time it sounded like the kind of recruiter pitch that gets bodies enlisted and then the "promises" about specific schools or becoming an officer kind of disappear. That's why I didn't pursue it.
Question for you, PP. Do you have a rough estimate of the % of junior officers from West Point, ROTC, and OCS? Curious more than anything, but I would assume that OCS is the biggest bucket of the three?
Anonymous
09/21/2021 12:21
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You don't "enlist" as an officer. Do your own research.
They are literally trying to do that. Why are you such a prick?
This is NOT research. Good grief. It's a forum. LAZY
Anonymous
09/21/2021 12:13
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
I attended my DS’s medical school graduation a few years ago. He had a handful of fellow classmates who were military. They wore their specific uniform vs the doctorate cap and gown to the ceremony. My DS told me when it came to deciding upon their residency specialty, it had to be approved by their military branch. For example, if you wanted OBGYN and they didn’t need that specialty that year, you had to choose something else.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 12:07
Subject: Re:What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Lot of misinformation on this thread. Speaking only from the experience of the Army. Some of this info might be dated, but it was accurate as of about 10 years ago:
If you have a college degree or are going to graduate, you can "enlist" with the purpose of attending Officer Candidate School. There's a selection process, and you don't have to sign anything binding before finding out if you have a slot (recruiters might say otherwise, but they're lying because they don't get bonuses for OCS enlistments, only regular enlisted). OCS is like 12-16 weeks and comes after attending Basic Training (used to be 9 weeks, no idea these days). You'll be paid at E-4 until you receive the commission.
ROTC can lead to scholarship money. One reason to do it is the sense of camaraderie. It's a big time commitment, but so are some sports and if that's what you like then good for you.
If you really care about making it a career, you should know there is an unspoken but obvious hierarchy in where Army officers come from. West Point > ROTC > OCS. Good people get promoted, and all lieutenants are treated (deservedly) like spoiled, dangerous amateurs, but as you get to mid-late career, wouldn't you know it, theres lots more of the former and fewer of the latter. Some of it is professional networks, some of it is snobbery. It's not right, but it is what it is. So that's a benefit to ROTC.
Now this is where some of my info might be dated. When an ROTC or West Point cadet graduates and is commissioned, and when an OCS candidate receives their commission, all three are mixed together and attend a course that used to be called BOLC II. This is where the three enlistment pathways merge, acclimatize and become "equals". After a few weeks of that they go their separate ways to their specialization schools. Armor, Infantry, Air Defense, etc.
Other branches might be different. I think the Marines might have an enlistment pathway that is more flexible, starting out enlisted for a few summers in the reserves while you're in college and then sending you to Officer Basic School or whatever they call it. That's what they told me, but at the time it sounded like the kind of recruiter pitch that gets bodies enlisted and then the "promises" about specific schools or becoming an officer kind of disappear. That's why I didn't pursue it.
If you have a college degree or are going to graduate, you can "enlist" with the purpose of attending Officer Candidate School. There's a selection process, and you don't have to sign anything binding before finding out if you have a slot (recruiters might say otherwise, but they're lying because they don't get bonuses for OCS enlistments, only regular enlisted). OCS is like 12-16 weeks and comes after attending Basic Training (used to be 9 weeks, no idea these days). You'll be paid at E-4 until you receive the commission.
ROTC can lead to scholarship money. One reason to do it is the sense of camaraderie. It's a big time commitment, but so are some sports and if that's what you like then good for you.
If you really care about making it a career, you should know there is an unspoken but obvious hierarchy in where Army officers come from. West Point > ROTC > OCS. Good people get promoted, and all lieutenants are treated (deservedly) like spoiled, dangerous amateurs, but as you get to mid-late career, wouldn't you know it, theres lots more of the former and fewer of the latter. Some of it is professional networks, some of it is snobbery. It's not right, but it is what it is. So that's a benefit to ROTC.
Now this is where some of my info might be dated. When an ROTC or West Point cadet graduates and is commissioned, and when an OCS candidate receives their commission, all three are mixed together and attend a course that used to be called BOLC II. This is where the three enlistment pathways merge, acclimatize and become "equals". After a few weeks of that they go their separate ways to their specialization schools. Armor, Infantry, Air Defense, etc.
Other branches might be different. I think the Marines might have an enlistment pathway that is more flexible, starting out enlisted for a few summers in the reserves while you're in college and then sending you to Officer Basic School or whatever they call it. That's what they told me, but at the time it sounded like the kind of recruiter pitch that gets bodies enlisted and then the "promises" about specific schools or becoming an officer kind of disappear. That's why I didn't pursue it.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 11:51
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:Rotc makes college kinda miserable.
I don't really think this is true. My child made a difficult decision not to pursue D1 sports because he felt that the time requirement would make him miserable. Honestly, the couple of kids we know who do ROTC seem to have a little more flexibility in their lives than the D1 athletes!
One drawback is that sometimes their post-college assignment is not at all what their preference would have been. You have to go where the military tells you you're needed.
But for a motivated kid, it's an amazing resource.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 11:45
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:Doesn't the summer experience ROTC students get also kinda make a difference? I looked into OCS after undergrad to get money to pay for grad school, and the thought of being a military officer after 9-17 weeks of training was kinda intimidating to me -- the idea of being 22 and potentially being expected to give orders to enlisted people with several years of experience seemed less than ideal. I'd imagine that 4 years of ROTC including a couple of weeks full time each summer would be an easier transition than civilian to officer in just a couple of months.
Yes, this is part of it, although I'm not sure most high school or college students are savvy enough to think much about this aspect. You'd theoretically be more comfortable with just the plain-old leadership aspect, and possibly more importantly, will have had some exposure and networking/acquaintance connections to the variety of paths and jobs in the military over the course of your 4 years of ROTC.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 11:39
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Doesn't the summer experience ROTC students get also kinda make a difference? I looked into OCS after undergrad to get money to pay for grad school, and the thought of being a military officer after 9-17 weeks of training was kinda intimidating to me -- the idea of being 22 and potentially being expected to give orders to enlisted people with several years of experience seemed less than ideal. I'd imagine that 4 years of ROTC including a couple of weeks full time each summer would be an easier transition than civilian to officer in just a couple of months.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 11:24
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Excuse my ignorance, but say you’re interested in ROTC at Princeton, do you apply directly to that ROTC program or do you apply to Princeton and if you get in then join ROTC?
I have the same question, too. Which game first - the chicken (ROTC acceptance) or the egg (Princeton acceptance)?
Also, if you do ROTC scholarship for undergrad and want to become a doctor, does that mean you no longer get a tuition benefit for med school?
I have two friends who had med school paid for by the military and then served their 8 year commitment right after med school (4 years residency + 4 years regular service as a military doctor). Frankly, they said it was better than going through the normal residency process (better pay, better hours).
In my experience you will receive your ROTC scholarship award before hearing from colleges like Princeton with their late March acceptances. That would be different if you applied SCEA to Princeton where you would hear in December.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 11:11
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:If you don't do ROTC and you don't attend one of the military academies, when you graduate college, you have to attend Officer Training School. Takes more time. ROTC... as soon as you graduate, you have a job. Then you either remain for required number of years, or you stay in for full career.
+1
ROTC skips OTS. That's really the biggest difference, assuming that paying for college isn't a motivation.
Thank you both.
Google says Officer Training School is 9 to 17 weeks. Are you paid for OTS? How do some take 1/2 the time (9 weeks) vs. 17?
Does this mean the ROTC friend is merely 9 to 17 weeks "ahead" of my son after college -- or are there other things I'm missing?
Is everything the ROTC friend did from freshman year to senior year akin to the OTS -- or was this past summer, the ROTC summer program essentially the OTS?
After graduating from ROTC or an Academy, each service has a certain amount of billets they have to fill. For example, navy has pilot, nfo, submariner, or surface for the most part. ROTC and Academy grads get the first pick on billets and duty stations, OTC gets the rest. ROTC training is much more in depth than OTC training. OTC grads play a bit of catch up when first joining the fleet, but everything quickly evens out. I have a friend that went through OTC in order to get the GI Bill money for grad school. Everyone has their own reasons.
Getting tuition (for most people) is the big bonus of ROTC over OTS later, and having a better pick of billets. I'm Air Force and it's much easier to become a pilot, for example, though the Academy or ROTC.
Anonymous
09/21/2021 10:05
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:Excuse my ignorance, but say you’re interested in ROTC at Princeton, do you apply directly to that ROTC program or do you apply to Princeton and if you get in then join ROTC?
I have the same question, too. Which game first - the chicken (ROTC acceptance) or the egg (Princeton acceptance)?
Also, if you do ROTC scholarship for undergrad and want to become a doctor, does that mean you no longer get a tuition benefit for med school?
I have two friends who had med school paid for by the military and then served their 8 year commitment right after med school (4 years residency + 4 years regular service as a military doctor). Frankly, they said it was better than going through the normal residency process (better pay, better hours).
Anonymous
09/21/2021 06:22
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:If you don’t do ROTC, you have to enlist as an E-4 (and hope you earn a slot to OTS/OCS. It’s not a guarantee and a lot of people don’t want to take the chance while being an enlisted service member
This is not at all true.
Anonymous
09/20/2021 22:50
Subject: Re:What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Can you elaborate?Rotc makes college kinda miserable.
Depends on the school and the program. Some programs were pretty easy it terms of time requirements and others are more like a military college. The Citadel has ROTC and so does Georgetown. Totally different experiences.
Fwiw, I had a friend that did ROTC at Georgetown and then at Harvard Law. Then he became a JAG. Seems to have worked out well for him.
Anonymous
09/20/2021 22:47
Subject: What's the benefit of ROTC versus just graduating from college and becoming an officer?
Anonymous wrote:You don't "enlist" as an officer. Do your own research.
You suck with your stupid quotes.