The arguments for changing the window are mostly about making it so that 8 year old are winning in 8&u not 9 year olds an so on up the age ladder. That’s really all anyone is saying. As a pp pointed out, Little league even did some research on the topic and found that parents, kids, and volunteers overwhelmingly supported the concept of not having 13 year olds dominate a 12&u league so they made the change a few years back. It’s not an outrageous idea.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I skipped a grade and turned 18 in March of my freshman year of college. Why can’t I compete as an 18 year old in an 18 and under league? Not a 19 year old, or even an old 18 year old. I was a year and a half younger than most of my classmates - grew later, drove later, etc. Let me have this one thing!

So as a college sophomore you would have wanted to spend your summer participating in summer swim with a group of high school kids and younger, none of whom were your classmates? Sure

My kid has a bad swim bday so this isn’t even my kid I’m talking about, BUT…I could see kids wanting to do this. Here’s how it plays out on our team:

- kid is 17 and goes to college, including swimming in college
- kid returns after a year of college and is an assistant coach on our summer swim team
- kid also swims at meets, where she is anyway for work and where she’s getting paid to be
- kid knows the whole team as both a teammate over many years + from assistant coaching

No collegiate swimmer should be competing in summer rec swim that is meant for kids. If they want to come back and be an assistant coach, awesome, but competing against the kids, absolutely not.

Huh? Happens all the time. The “kids” are one year younger in some cases. Or the same age.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PLEASE...in the 15-18 year old divisions there were so many scratches that they were in the 30-49 the place times from Divisional just to fill the lanes. Older kids are not clamouring to swim at All Stars.

You can not have a September 1 birthday as a cut off...there is no way to justify making an 8 year old swim a 50 before they are 9. An argument for a cut off aligned with the date if the first NVSL meet (mid June) is at least a reasonable argument.

So eliminate 15-18 All Stars altogether if it’s just college kids looking for one last medal to add to their trophy case and the 30-49th place kids.

Most of the kids in 8&u All Stars are already swimming 50s in the winter/spring at the club level BEFORE their last summer of 25s in rec league.

AND if summer swim was just about All Stars then you would have an argument but it isn't and in the summer you have 8 year olds swimming in Monday meets that are not ready to race a 50...or do you want to punish all of those kids for one meet the entire summer

It’s just for fun though right? If the oldest 8s are slow, they’re slow and everyone will clap for them — just like the young 9s.

Is it really such a big deal to keep the current cut off and clap for kids who turned 9 three weeks earlier? It's still a 24 month window and of course the oldest kids in that window have a slight advantage. What exactly justifies changing that window just to benefit different kids?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PLEASE...in the 15-18 year old divisions there were so many scratches that they were in the 30-49 the place times from Divisional just to fill the lanes. Older kids are not clamouring to swim at All Stars.

You can not have a September 1 birthday as a cut off...there is no way to justify making an 8 year old swim a 50 before they are 9. An argument for a cut off aligned with the date if the first NVSL meet (mid June) is at least a reasonable argument.

So eliminate 15-18 All Stars altogether if it’s just college kids looking for one last medal to add to their trophy case and the 30-49th place kids.

Most of the kids in 8&u All Stars are already swimming 50s in the winter/spring at the club level BEFORE their last summer of 25s in rec league.

AND if summer swim was just about All Stars then you would have an argument but it isn't and in the summer you have 8 year olds swimming in Monday meets that are not ready to race a 50...or do you want to punish all of those kids for one meet the entire summer

It’s just for fun though right? If the oldest 8s are slow, they’re slow and everyone will clap for them — just like the young 9s.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PLEASE...in the 15-18 year old divisions there were so many scratches that they were in the 30-49 the place times from Divisional just to fill the lanes. Older kids are not clamouring to swim at All Stars.

You can not have a September 1 birthday as a cut off...there is no way to justify making an 8 year old swim a 50 before they are 9. An argument for a cut off aligned with the date if the first NVSL meet (mid June) is at least a reasonable argument.

So eliminate 15-18 All Stars altogether if it’s just college kids looking for one last medal to add to their trophy case and the 30-49th place kids.

Most of the kids in 8&u All Stars are already swimming 50s in the winter/spring at the club level BEFORE their last summer of 25s in rec league.

AND if summer swim was just about All Stars then you would have an argument but it isn't and in the summer you have 8 year olds swimming in Monday meets that are not ready to race a 50...or do you want to punish all of those kids for one meet the entire summer

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s the 18 year olds who go off to college and then come back as 19 year olds that people are mostly complaining about. I personally wouldn’t see a problem with the rare case of someone who skipped a grade or something and was still 18 at the end of the summer following a year in college.

Except that doesn't happen. Even the ones who come back after a year in college are 18 when the season starts.

Everyone keeps using the excuse that it is rec swim as a reason BUT I guarantee you the majority of older kids at All Stars are not “rec swimmers”. We have kids come back, swim in one A or B meet (usually a B meet because they can’t miss college practice) just so they can swim at Divisionals and qualify for All-Stars.

You can’t use a B meet time for divisional in MCSL. You have to have an A meet time to compete in divisionals.

Anonymous wrote:PLEASE...in the 15-18 year old divisions there were so many scratches that they were in the 30-49 the place times from Divisional just to fill the lanes. Older kids are not clamouring to swim at All Stars.

You can not have a September 1 birthday as a cut off...there is no way to justify making an 8 year old swim a 50 before they are 9. An argument for a cut off aligned with the date if the first NVSL meet (mid June) is at least a reasonable argument.

So eliminate 15-18 All Stars altogether if it’s just college kids looking for one last medal to add to their trophy case and the 30-49th place kids.

Most of the kids in 8&u All Stars are already swimming 50s in the winter/spring at the club level BEFORE their last summer of 25s in rec league.

I’m sorry but anyone who comes back to compete in summer league after a year of college swimming is pathetic. I grew up in a state where the cutoff for kindergarten was the end of the calendar year and thus went to K at 4.5 years old. I was always the youngest in my grade/class. I went to college at 17 with a D1 scholarship and was 18 the summer after my freshman year. No way was I going to compete against high schoolers after a year of NCAA training. I had so much more muscle mass it wasn’t fair at all. I would have dominated but would have felt so stupid. I was home that summer working as a nanny and practiced with my former club team. I loved summer swim but I had moved on with my life. No one who had graduated was coming back to compete in summer league because we knew it was not for us anymore.

You all are the moms everyone hates.

PLEASE...in the 15-18 year old divisions there were so many scratches that they were in the 30-49 the place times from Divisional just to fill the lanes. Older kids are not clamouring to swim at All Stars.

You can not have a September 1 birthday as a cut off...there is no way to justify making an 8 year old swim a 50 before they are 9. An argument for a cut off aligned with the date if the first NVSL meet (mid June) is at least a reasonable argument.

Anonymous wrote:Why would a kid in college care?

Reliving their glory days of beating up on weaker kids? Just like when they were 9 and 11 year olds crushing it in the 8&u and 9-10 races at All Stars. Look at the results. It’s happening all the time.

Why would a kid in college care?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s the 18 year olds who go off to college and then come back as 19 year olds that people are mostly complaining about. I personally wouldn’t see a problem with the rare case of someone who skipped a grade or something and was still 18 at the end of the summer following a year in college.

Except that doesn't happen. Even the ones who come back after a year in college are 18 when the season starts.

Everyone keeps using the excuse that it is rec swim as a reason BUT I guarantee you the majority of older kids at All Stars are not “rec swimmers”. We have kids come back, swim in one A or B meet (usually a B meet because they can’t miss college practice) just so they can swim at Divisionals and qualify for All-Stars.

All of this! The Amherst kid was a year round club swimmer who had never swam in All Stars in the 15-18 group until he came back from a college swim program as a 19 year old.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s the 18 year olds who go off to college and then come back as 19 year olds that people are mostly complaining about. I personally wouldn’t see a problem with the rare case of someone who skipped a grade or something and was still 18 at the end of the summer following a year in college.

Except that doesn't happen. Even the ones who come back after a year in college are 18 when the season starts.

Everyone keeps using the excuse that it is rec swim as a reason BUT I guarantee you the majority of older kids at All Stars are not “rec swimmers”. We have kids come back, swim in one A or B meet (usually a B meet because they can’t miss college practice) just so they can swim at Divisionals and qualify for All-Stars.

My kid has a September birthday so would
Be 18 summer after freshman year but I very much doubt would participate unless he happens to be coaching.