Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do agree FCPS does try to look beyond the scores. They look for feedback from several teachers with regards to a child and what potential they are showing in the classroom. My DC was one that got in last year with both test scores below the pool cut off, but a very high GBRS and excellent work samples. She is THRIVING in AAP and I am so thankful to her teachers that identified her as needing more than the general education curriculum and not just writing her off because her scores were a little below the cutoff. DC tells me all the time about half of the kids in her AAP class don't do their classwork on time, or their homework, constantly goof off, etc. I'm sure plenty of those kids had much higher test scores than she did. However, she is completing her work on time, producing great work, and thriving; again, with probably lower test scores.

The Board is clearly doing their job looking beyond the test scores. Test scores truly are only one piece to the puzzle but there is so much more when it comes to measuring a child's academic potential - drive, determination, curiosity, motivation to learn and apply new material, a creative or "think outside the box" mind, etc., etc.

I'm honestly glad to see the Board seems to be even going a little lower this year in terms of test scores, if the child is proving themselves capable on a daily basis in the classroom. Many children with a high level of determination and drive will thrive and do well in FCPS AAP program.

But thinking outside the box is what can and will change our world. It is what really stands out in a classroom. When I ask a question in a classroom, it is very evident when a black and white type or kid answers the question and when a kid who thinks outside the box answers the question. I'm a teacher AND have two in AAP. One of my kids is highly gifted. My highly gifted kid has always answered questions completed differently than my more black and white child. Both kids are compliant, motivated, well behaved, driven, curious, etc. BUT it is HOW my highly gifted kid assimilitates the materials he is given. I'm guessing your child is a good student, memorizes easily, studies, cares about grades, etc. My kids are the same...but my highly gifted child just sees the world differently. He always has. From the age of 2 he would answer questions differently. When his sibling started aap he'd be answering her math questions when he was still in kindergarten. he understands why things happen or can make connections, etc.

Oh, and when my kids come home and blab about who isn't doing their work at school, I tell them to myob.

Um...I think she the poster did highlight "think outside the box" is an important trait to look for. You completely missed the point.

Typically, a kid who does well on these tests is a think outside the box kid, though. It is a kid who can see things a different way, esp. with a test like the NNAT and certain parts of the cogat. That is the point. If you were to fill in a missing piece of a puzzle and it isn't immediately clear to you what the piece was that was missing, you're not that kind of a thinker.

Yes, and while that may be ONE way to indeed to identify "outside the box" thinkers, there are other ways as well, that cannot always be measured by standardized tests. Hence the importance of a GBRS, unique work samples, parent input, etc. Which is why plenty of kids get in each year with below pool scores and do so well.

You're missing MY point. Absolutely kids who are not highly gifted can still do great in AAP even if they aren't out of the box thinkers. Most likely though a kid like that won't change the world. That kid can be skilled and trained to do amazing things, but can that kid create new techniques and come up with new creations? Probably not ones that will change the world for others. I/m thinking way beyond AAP. You're looking at this narrowly: can highly gifted kids and smart kids do well in AAP. Yep, they can. Do highly gifted kids stand out as out of the box thinkers? Absolutely. This is coming from a parent who has a highly gifted kid and one who is probably really smart but not highly gifted. I'm guessing my other kid isn't highly gifted but she got a 140 on the NNAT a 140 on the Cogat (no wisc, so I have no idea) and a 16 gbrs). She clearly is bright....but when she makes connections it is no where near like my other child. It is just...different...he is the kind of person who could change things in the world.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do agree FCPS does try to look beyond the scores. They look for feedback from several teachers with regards to a child and what potential they are showing in the classroom. My DC was one that got in last year with both test scores below the pool cut off, but a very high GBRS and excellent work samples. She is THRIVING in AAP and I am so thankful to her teachers that identified her as needing more than the general education curriculum and not just writing her off because her scores were a little below the cutoff. DC tells me all the time about half of the kids in her AAP class don't do their classwork on time, or their homework, constantly goof off, etc. I'm sure plenty of those kids had much higher test scores than she did. However, she is completing her work on time, producing great work, and thriving; again, with probably lower test scores.

The Board is clearly doing their job looking beyond the test scores. Test scores truly are only one piece to the puzzle but there is so much more when it comes to measuring a child's academic potential - drive, determination, curiosity, motivation to learn and apply new material, a creative or "think outside the box" mind, etc., etc.

I'm honestly glad to see the Board seems to be even going a little lower this year in terms of test scores, if the child is proving themselves capable on a daily basis in the classroom. Many children with a high level of determination and drive will thrive and do well in FCPS AAP program.

But thinking outside the box is what can and will change our world. It is what really stands out in a classroom. When I ask a question in a classroom, it is very evident when a black and white type or kid answers the question and when a kid who thinks outside the box answers the question. I'm a teacher AND have two in AAP. One of my kids is highly gifted. My highly gifted kid has always answered questions completed differently than my more black and white child. Both kids are compliant, motivated, well behaved, driven, curious, etc. BUT it is HOW my highly gifted kid assimilitates the materials he is given. I'm guessing your child is a good student, memorizes easily, studies, cares about grades, etc. My kids are the same...but my highly gifted child just sees the world differently. He always has. From the age of 2 he would answer questions differently. When his sibling started aap he'd be answering her math questions when he was still in kindergarten. he understands why things happen or can make connections, etc.

Oh, and when my kids come home and blab about who isn't doing their work at school, I tell them to myob.

Um...I think she the poster did highlight "think outside the box" is an important trait to look for. You completely missed the point.

Typically, a kid who does well on these tests is a think outside the box kid, though. It is a kid who can see things a different way, esp. with a test like the NNAT and certain parts of the cogat. That is the point. If you were to fill in a missing piece of a puzzle and it isn't immediately clear to you what the piece was that was missing, you're not that kind of a thinker.

Yes, and while that may be ONE way to indeed to identify "outside the box" thinkers, there are other ways as well, that cannot always be measured by standardized tests. Hence the importance of a GBRS, unique work samples, parent input, etc. Which is why plenty of kids get in each year with below pool scores and do so well.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What research shows that???

Read Nurture Shock by Po Bronson, which goes into a fair amount of detail on the inefficacy of testing at young ages.

That's an 8 year old book on testing in general. Anything else?

I wasn't aware that books expired. If you do take the time to read the book, it discusses research on the use of testing to identify children for gifted programs. The research showed that each of the tests used identified some children that continued on the predicted trajectory (generally meaning future higher IQs in this context) but would also identify a significant percentage of children who did not bear out the prediction and, importantly, failed to identify a significant number of children who were ultimately quite gifted. When the book was written, testing was clearly a poor proxy for determining future academic success. I am not aware of any recent research showing that the testing has gotten more accurate since the book was published but perhaps you could point me to more current information on the topic to see if something has changed.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DS father said he lost the letter...already and I never got to read it.

There was a yellow form in the there that you have to fill out and return if you want your child to be in Level IV next year.

Oh no! Any suggestions on what to do now? Call the central office?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NNAT-98
Ffx Cogat-120
GBRS-no idea
Admitted

Kind of surprising.

I'd be a bit worried about keeping up.

I was not this poster, but am worried about this for my child. I don't even know my child's NNAT's and Cogat scores. They were slightly above average, but nothing to write home about. I don't know what her GBRS were either. She was not in the pool, but my husband applied for her. Much to my surprise, she got in. Perhaps teacher recs? She has good grades, but I don't quite get it.

We are now faced with a big decision. My son was in the program and it was a no-brainer for him in terms of academic fit. My daughter has a true love of learning and joy of life and I fear that the rigours and competitive nature of the program will take that joy from her. Suggestions welcome.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do agree FCPS does try to look beyond the scores. They look for feedback from several teachers with regards to a child and what potential they are showing in the classroom. My DC was one that got in last year with both test scores below the pool cut off, but a very high GBRS and excellent work samples. She is THRIVING in AAP and I am so thankful to her teachers that identified her as needing more than the general education curriculum and not just writing her off because her scores were a little below the cutoff. DC tells me all the time about half of the kids in her AAP class don't do their classwork on time, or their homework, constantly goof off, etc. I'm sure plenty of those kids had much higher test scores than she did. However, she is completing her work on time, producing great work, and thriving; again, with probably lower test scores.

The Board is clearly doing their job looking beyond the test scores. Test scores truly are only one piece to the puzzle but there is so much more when it comes to measuring a child's academic potential - drive, determination, curiosity, motivation to learn and apply new material, a creative or "think outside the box" mind, etc., etc.

I'm honestly glad to see the Board seems to be even going a little lower this year in terms of test scores, if the child is proving themselves capable on a daily basis in the classroom. Many children with a high level of determination and drive will thrive and do well in FCPS AAP program.

But thinking outside the box is what can and will change our world. It is what really stands out in a classroom. When I ask a question in a classroom, it is very evident when a black and white type or kid answers the question and when a kid who thinks outside the box answers the question. I'm a teacher AND have two in AAP. One of my kids is highly gifted. My highly gifted kid has always answered questions completed differently than my more black and white child. Both kids are compliant, motivated, well behaved, driven, curious, etc. BUT it is HOW my highly gifted kid assimilitates the materials he is given. I'm guessing your child is a good student, memorizes easily, studies, cares about grades, etc. My kids are the same...but my highly gifted child just sees the world differently. He always has. From the age of 2 he would answer questions differently. When his sibling started aap he'd be answering her math questions when he was still in kindergarten. he understands why things happen or can make connections, etc.

Oh, and when my kids come home and blab about who isn't doing their work at school, I tell them to myob.

Um...I think she the poster did highlight "think outside the box" is an important trait to look for. You completely missed the point.

Typically, a kid who does well on these tests is a think outside the box kid, though. It is a kid who can see things a different way, esp. with a test like the NNAT and certain parts of the cogat. That is the point. If you were to fill in a missing piece of a puzzle and it isn't immediately clear to you what the piece was that was missing, you're not that kind of a thinker.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do agree FCPS does try to look beyond the scores. They look for feedback from several teachers with regards to a child and what potential they are showing in the classroom. My DC was one that got in last year with both test scores below the pool cut off, but a very high GBRS and excellent work samples. She is THRIVING in AAP and I am so thankful to her teachers that identified her as needing more than the general education curriculum and not just writing her off because her scores were a little below the cutoff. DC tells me all the time about half of the kids in her AAP class don't do their classwork on time, or their homework, constantly goof off, etc. I'm sure plenty of those kids had much higher test scores than she did. However, she is completing her work on time, producing great work, and thriving; again, with probably lower test scores.

The Board is clearly doing their job looking beyond the test scores. Test scores truly are only one piece to the puzzle but there is so much more when it comes to measuring a child's academic potential - drive, determination, curiosity, motivation to learn and apply new material, a creative or "think outside the box" mind, etc., etc.

I'm honestly glad to see the Board seems to be even going a little lower this year in terms of test scores, if the child is proving themselves capable on a daily basis in the classroom. Many children with a high level of determination and drive will thrive and do well in FCPS AAP program.

But thinking outside the box is what can and will change our world. It is what really stands out in a classroom. When I ask a question in a classroom, it is very evident when a black and white type or kid answers the question and when a kid who thinks outside the box answers the question. I'm a teacher AND have two in AAP. One of my kids is highly gifted. My highly gifted kid has always answered questions completed differently than my more black and white child. Both kids are compliant, motivated, well behaved, driven, curious, etc. BUT it is HOW my highly gifted kid assimilitates the materials he is given. I'm guessing your child is a good student, memorizes easily, studies, cares about grades, etc. My kids are the same...but my highly gifted child just sees the world differently. He always has. From the age of 2 he would answer questions differently. When his sibling started aap he'd be answering her math questions when he was still in kindergarten. he understands why things happen or can make connections, etc.

Oh, and when my kids come home and blab about who isn't doing their work at school, I tell them to myob.

Um...I think she the poster did highlight "think outside the box" is an important trait to look for. You completely missed the point.

Anonymous wrote:I do agree FCPS does try to look beyond the scores. They look for feedback from several teachers with regards to a child and what potential they are showing in the classroom. My DC was one that got in last year with both test scores below the pool cut off, but a very high GBRS and excellent work samples. She is THRIVING in AAP and I am so thankful to her teachers that identified her as needing more than the general education curriculum and not just writing her off because her scores were a little below the cutoff. DC tells me all the time about half of the kids in her AAP class don't do their classwork on time, or their homework, constantly goof off, etc. I'm sure plenty of those kids had much higher test scores than she did. However, she is completing her work on time, producing great work, and thriving; again, with probably lower test scores.

The Board is clearly doing their job looking beyond the test scores. Test scores truly are only one piece to the puzzle but there is so much more when it comes to measuring a child's academic potential - drive, determination, curiosity, motivation to learn and apply new material, a creative or "think outside the box" mind, etc., etc.

I'm honestly glad to see the Board seems to be even going a little lower this year in terms of test scores, if the child is proving themselves capable on a daily basis in the classroom. Many children with a high level of determination and drive will thrive and do well in FCPS AAP program.

But thinking outside the box is what can and will change our world. It is what really stands out in a classroom. When I ask a question in a classroom, it is very evident when a black and white type or kid answers the question and when a kid who thinks outside the box answers the question. I'm a teacher AND have two in AAP. One of my kids is highly gifted. My highly gifted kid has always answered questions completed differently than my more black and white child. Both kids are compliant, motivated, well behaved, driven, curious, etc. BUT it is HOW my highly gifted kid assimilitates the materials he is given. I'm guessing your child is a good student, memorizes easily, studies, cares about grades, etc. My kids are the same...but my highly gifted child just sees the world differently. He always has. From the age of 2 he would answer questions differently. When his sibling started aap he'd be answering her math questions when he was still in kindergarten. he understands why things happen or can make connections, etc.

Oh, and when my kids come home and blab about who isn't doing their work at school, I tell them to myob.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What research shows that???

Read Nurture Shock by Po Bronson, which goes into a fair amount of detail on the inefficacy of testing at young ages.

Whatever that book said about testing has been lost on me. I remember what it said about lying being age appropriate and talking to your kids about race.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What research shows that???

Read Nurture Shock by Po Bronson, which goes into a fair amount of detail on the inefficacy of testing at young ages.

That's an 8 year old book on testing in general. Anything else?

Anonymous wrote:DS father said he lost the letter...already and I never got to read it.

There was a yellow form in the there that you have to fill out and return if you want your child to be in Level IV next year.

I do agree FCPS does try to look beyond the scores. They look for feedback from several teachers with regards to a child and what potential they are showing in the classroom. My DC was one that got in last year with both test scores below the pool cut off, but a very high GBRS and excellent work samples. She is THRIVING in AAP and I am so thankful to her teachers that identified her as needing more than the general education curriculum and not just writing her off because her scores were a little below the cutoff. DC tells me all the time about half of the kids in her AAP class don't do their classwork on time, or their homework, constantly goof off, etc. I'm sure plenty of those kids had much higher test scores than she did. However, she is completing her work on time, producing great work, and thriving; again, with probably lower test scores.

The Board is clearly doing their job looking beyond the test scores. Test scores truly are only one piece to the puzzle but there is so much more when it comes to measuring a child's academic potential - drive, determination, curiosity, motivation to learn and apply new material, a creative or "think outside the box" mind, etc., etc.

I'm honestly glad to see the Board seems to be even going a little lower this year in terms of test scores, if the child is proving themselves capable on a daily basis in the classroom. Many children with a high level of determination and drive will thrive and do well in FCPS AAP program.

Anonymous wrote:What research shows that???

Read Nurture Shock by Po Bronson, which goes into a fair amount of detail on the inefficacy of testing at young ages.

What research shows that???

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Eligible:

NNAT 104
cogat 121
GBRS ?

How are folks learning the GBRS? I'm not seeking to find out. Just curious.

I wonder if there were fewer parent referrals. The eligible NNAT and CogAT scores seem over all low this year. I don't even think I would have considered referring with these scores. I'm glad they are being more inclusive. I think a lot more kids can handle the AAP curriculum.

I think last year scores came out after referrals were due. This year at least at our school they stressed that you might not know Cogat before referrals were due so everyone should plan to parent refer if interested.

They did not come out last year after the referrals were due. It was close, but they certainly came for nearly everyone before the deadline.

I did consider not referring with these scores but I thought my son could handle and would be served best by an AAP curriculum and I thought his teacher would agree with that. I got the impression the school was putting particular effort into his referral package (e.g. they asked to replace the work sample I submitted with something else) -- although I have no point of comparison so that may be what they do for everyone. Anyway, the fact that he got it suggests to me that FCPS does try to look beyond the scores, which is heartening since the research shows that these scores do not accurately identify a child's aptitude at this age.