Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

Mutual adult consent is necessary but not sufficient for moral sexuality. I agree that comparing homosexuality to bestiality or CSA is not helpful. But just because it's consensual does not make it morally right. You just snuck that premise in there.

If one doesnt think it's morally right, they don't have to engage.

What I believe is morally right is different than what you believe is morally right. Some people dont believe it's morally right to eat animals. I wholeheartedly support their right to not eat animals. I don't support those people trying to push their beliefs onto me or others. Same with this.

Perhaps you could make this case if you and your gay partner live alone on an island. But none of us do. Our moral decisions have knock on effects. Sometimes those indirect effects are more serious than the direct ones. Beyond those measurable indirect effects, society is also morally injured when it is forced to tolerate immorality.

So how do two men in a relationship affect you? Is literally tolerating their existence that much of a burden to you?

Not their existence. That is not at issue.

But their open, flagrant immorality, yes. That is a burden to society.

You still havent answered how two men or two women in a consensual adult relationship affects you at all.

How does people having sex in a public place affects you? Same for indecent exposure?
Why do you think we don’t allow it?
We could just ignore them? Right? Or maybe you would allow it?

Open and flagrant immorality isn’t good for society. It negatively affects people.

As long as people - gay or straight - aren’t having sex out in public then we are all good.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

They can’t consent because we said so and made it our laws.
Children could also rise up and complain about these laws being unfair, insisting that they are mature enough to consent.

That won’t change anything because We believe that even though the child claims to be in love with an adult, we won’t condone these types of relationships because they are immoral.

Btw, I’m surprised you said children can’t consent to sex, but you and your lgbtq friends think these same children can consent to gender affirming surgery without parental consent.

What about a 12 year who was impregnated without consent? Is that immoral?

Of course it is immoral.

Under Jewish law and cultural tradition during the time Jesus walked the earth, it was considered moral. It was the way Jewish people traditionally treated 12 year old girls- they could be married and bear their husband’s child/children. That was how it was then.

So morality can change over time.

Today in 2023, a gay couple can be married and have a family. And even have sex (just as straight couples do). Nothing immoral about that.

Among the sexual perversions proscribed as criminal offenses in the moral code of the Torah are homosexual relations between males (Lev. 18:22). Both offending parties are threatened with capital punishment (Lev. 20:13), though minors under 13 years of age are exempt from this as from any other penalty (Sanh. 54a). Talmudic law extends the prohibition, but not the penalty, which is limited to flagellation, also to lesbianism, i.e., homosexual intimacies between women, based on the general warning not to indulge in the abhorrent practices of the Egyptians and the Canaanites (Sifra 9:8). While the laws on both offenses are codified by Maimonides (Yad, Issurei Bi’ah, 1:14; and 21:8), the prohibition of homosexuality proper is omitted from R. Joseph Caro’s Shulhan Arukh. This omission reflects the perceived absence of homosexuality among Jews rather than any difference of views on the criminality of these acts.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/homosexuality

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

They can’t consent because we said so and made it our laws.
Children could also rise up and complain about these laws being unfair, insisting that they are mature enough to consent.

That won’t change anything because We believe that even though the child claims to be in love with an adult, we won’t condone these types of relationships because they are immoral.

Btw, I’m surprised you said children can’t consent to sex, but you and your lgbtq friends think these same children can consent to gender affirming surgery without parental consent.

What about a 12 year who was impregnated without consent? Is that immoral?

Prohibited Marriages and Illegitimate Children

The minimum age for marriage under Jewish law is 13 for boys, 12 for girls; however, the kiddushin can take place before that, and often did in medieval times. The Talmud recommends that a man marry at age 18, or somewhere between 16 and 24.

The Torah allowed for a father to marry off his young daughter, yet the Talmud states that as a matter of recommended practice, "it is prohibited to marry off a young daughter until she is old enough and she says 'I like him'."

https://jwa.org/encyclopedia/article/legal-religious-status-of-married-woman

The first major written collection of the Jewish oral traditions, the Mishnah, also known as the "Oral Torah", tells us:



The basis for this tradition comes directly from Moshe and the Torah itself, with Numbers 31:17-18 stating:

17 Now kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has ever slept with a man. 18 But the young girls who have never slept with a man, keep alive for yourselves.

Jewish people could keep their enemies, specifically the young girls, as sex slaves. The Mishnah, however, attempts to moderate this activity through the imposition of a moral/legal obligation upon the man - in having sexual intercourse with "a girl [aged] three years and one day" she becomes his wife and is owed all the legal rights of a wife.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

Mutual adult consent is necessary but not sufficient for moral sexuality. I agree that comparing homosexuality to bestiality or CSA is not helpful. But just because it's consensual does not make it morally right. You just snuck that premise in there.

If one doesnt think it's morally right, they don't have to engage.

What I believe is morally right is different than what you believe is morally right. Some people dont believe it's morally right to eat animals. I wholeheartedly support their right to not eat animals. I don't support those people trying to push their beliefs onto me or others. Same with this.

Perhaps you could make this case if you and your gay partner live alone on an island. But none of us do. Our moral decisions have knock on effects. Sometimes those indirect effects are more serious than the direct ones. Beyond those measurable indirect effects, society is also morally injured when it is forced to tolerate immorality.

So how do two men in a relationship affect you? Is literally tolerating their existence that much of a burden to you?

Not their existence. That is not at issue.

But their open, flagrant immorality, yes. That is a burden to society.

You still havent answered how two men or two women in a consensual adult relationship affects you at all.

How does people having sex in a public place affects you? Same for indecent exposure?
Why do you think we don’t allow it?
We could just ignore them? Right? Or maybe you would allow it?

Open and flagrant immorality isn’t good for society. It negatively affects people.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

They can’t consent because we said so and made it our laws.
Children could also rise up and complain about these laws being unfair, insisting that they are mature enough to consent.

That won’t change anything because We believe that even though the child claims to be in love with an adult, we won’t condone these types of relationships because they are immoral.

Btw, I’m surprised you said children can’t consent to sex, but you and your lgbtq friends think these same children can consent to gender affirming surgery without parental consent.

This isn’t happening, but you keep showing those true Christian colors. So you hate gays and trans folk, but are totally cool with child rape. What a fcked up religious point of view.

What religious people are ok with child rape? During biblical times, under Jewish law and tradition, girls married men.

The Torah says a Jewish father had the right to marry off his daughter from her day of birth until what was considered the age of majority – “12 years, six months and a day.” Only if a daughter became widowed or divorced did a father lose the right to marry her to another man.

Are you under the impression Jewish people still do this? I really don’t think they do.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

They can’t consent because we said so and made it our laws.
Children could also rise up and complain about these laws being unfair, insisting that they are mature enough to consent.

That won’t change anything because We believe that even though the child claims to be in love with an adult, we won’t condone these types of relationships because they are immoral.

Btw, I’m surprised you said children can’t consent to sex, but you and your lgbtq friends think these same children can consent to gender affirming surgery without parental consent.

This isn’t happening, but you keep showing those true Christian colors. So you hate gays and trans folk, but are totally cool with child rape. What a fcked up religious point of view.

No, not ok with child abuse. I was showing where we would be if we followed your perverse thinking about allowing everything just because 2 people love each other.

No matter how much a minor loves an adult, how much they want to have sex with them, if they have sex, we consider it immoral and WE have (Our society) decided that this is crime. They can be in love as much as they like. It doesn’t matter.
You would have allowed that in your world because they love each others.

Understand that we aren’t just going to condone homosexuality because the two people love each others. We care about morality.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

They can’t consent because we said so and made it our laws.
Children could also rise up and complain about these laws being unfair, insisting that they are mature enough to consent.

That won’t change anything because We believe that even though the child claims to be in love with an adult, we won’t condone these types of relationships because they are immoral.

Btw, I’m surprised you said children can’t consent to sex, but you and your lgbtq friends think these same children can consent to gender affirming surgery without parental consent.

What about a 12 year who was impregnated without consent? Is that immoral?

Of course it is immoral.

Under Jewish law and cultural tradition during the time Jesus walked the earth, it was considered moral. It was the way Jewish people traditionally treated 12 year old girls- they could be married and bear their husband’s child/children. That was how it was then.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

They can’t consent because we said so and made it our laws.
Children could also rise up and complain about these laws being unfair, insisting that they are mature enough to consent.

That won’t change anything because We believe that even though the child claims to be in love with an adult, we won’t condone these types of relationships because they are immoral.

Btw, I’m surprised you said children can’t consent to sex, but you and your lgbtq friends think these same children can consent to gender affirming surgery without parental consent.

What about a 12 year who was impregnated without consent? Is that immoral?

Of course it is immoral.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

Animals and children can't consent. Why do you compare a consenting adult relationship with animal and child rape? How do two adult men or women in a relationship affect you at all?

Mutual adult consent is necessary but not sufficient for moral sexuality. I agree that comparing homosexuality to bestiality or CSA is not helpful. But just because it's consensual does not make it morally right. You just snuck that premise in there.

If one doesnt think it's morally right, they don't have to engage.

What I believe is morally right is different than what you believe is morally right. Some people dont believe it's morally right to eat animals. I wholeheartedly support their right to not eat animals. I don't support those people trying to push their beliefs onto me or others. Same with this.

Perhaps you could make this case if you and your gay partner live alone on an island. But none of us do. Our moral decisions have knock on effects. Sometimes those indirect effects are more serious than the direct ones. Beyond those measurable indirect effects, society is also morally injured when it is forced to tolerate immorality.

So how do two men in a relationship affect you? Is literally tolerating their existence that much of a burden to you?

Not their existence. That is not at issue.

But their open, flagrant immorality, yes. That is a burden to society.

You still havent answered how two men or two women in a consensual adult relationship affects you at all.

What they do in their bedroom doesn’t affect me. Most people have no problems with it as long as they keep their immorality within their own walls.

But they are taking their immorality outside of their private space. They are pushing society to redefine family, marriage, and many aspects of our life. Teaching our children in school that these immoral behaviors are normal, cool, and even encouraging them to explore these relationships.

This is no longer about two men or two women doing their things in the privacy of their home. This is about transforming our society. So, yes it affects us, it affects our children’s education.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

You are comparing homosexuality to child rape and … beastiality?

Really?

Oh and BTW child rape does cause harm!

Not comparing them. Just following your “no boundaries” rule about sexual relationships as long as they are based on love.

Nobody talked about child rape here btw.
If a minor loves an adult and want to have sex with them, we should celebrate it because it’s love? Who are you to say that the child should not love?

You see how this has nothing to do with love? It’s about immoral acts. We know what they are and we set boundaries.

It’s not immoral for 2 consenting adults to have sex.

What if they are married to other people?

What if one of them has a spouse sick with cancer?

What if one of them have an std or sti they are not disclosing to their consenting partner and unknowing spouse?

Jesus never said don’t molest children. Do we think He was silent on the matter because He was ok with child molestation?

Jesus never said don’t get high- is He ok with drug use/abuse?

Jesus never said don’t drive drunk, does that mean drunk driving is ok?

Jesus never said don’t go into a school and shoot students and teachers, does that mean it’s ok?

Since child marriage was common in that day, isn’t it likely that jesus was pro child rape?

Jesus was the first person to give women rights. In His day, women were literally property. The Jewish people in His community, their culture allowed this treatment of women. In fact, Jesus stopped a group of Jewish men, leaders, community members, from stoning a prostitute to death. He told the prostitute to go and sin no more. He loved her, and wanted her to live her life without being sexually sinful.

Women were completely separate from men, Jewish men and women lived almost completely separately, the only time they were together was in bed. Jewish culture and the cultures of people at the time, their customs were that young women and girls were married to older men. Jesus didn’t make that happen, nor did Christianity. If you can think of a group of people or culture that didn’t marry young girls off to older men, let us know. They all did it.

Jewish culture in the first century was decidedly patriarchal. The daily prayers of Jewish men included this prayer of thanksgiving: “Praised be God that he has not created me a woman.” A woman’s place was in the home. Women were responsible for bearing the children, rearing them and maintaining a hospitable home. Men were not to greet women in public. Some Jewish writers of Jesus’ time, such as Philo, taught that women should never leave the home except to go to the synagogue.

So yeah, blame the Jewish people of the time. Their men were so misogynistic they woke up everyday and thanked God they weren’t women. Women were under the domination of their fathers, then husbands. Totally.

Rabbi Eliezer, a first-century teacher, is noted for saying, “Rather should the word of the Torah be burned than entrusted to a woman.”

Jesus was radical because He simply spoke publicly to women.

Jewish people taught that women were “unclean” during their period- Jesus rejected that and said that was not true.

Jesus treated Martha and Mary as if they were valuable and worthy of attention and respect, something that the Jewish people during that time would not do.

Women were present at His death, and Jesus revealed Himself after His resurrection to women.

No other man before Jesus treated women with respect and as if they were worthy of being listened to and included in any facet of life. Jesus was amazing in his role as a Jewish man, teacher, and leader.

The Jewish people of Jesus’ time were prochild rape. They subjugated girls and women to the extreme and Jesus was the lone voice to proclaim there was a better way to treat women and girls.

How can you be so ignorant of the customs of Jesus’ time? He definitely was not abusing women and girls or treating them like chattel and disparaging them as their own fathers, husbands, and community did.

Crack a book occasionally. It’s borderline embarrassing and exactly why listening to people posting here about what Jesus really meant or what the Bible “really” says should be avoided. People with no knowledge or understanding are speaking about things they know nothing about. Don’t do it, and don’t listen to tik tok, or read crap that is made up by people advocating for political parties or political agendas.

Jesus came to save us from our sin, not to applaud wildly while we sin and praise each other for our sin. Going to church to be told how great you are is just another way to serve your own desires and earthly purpose. You can live your life based on your sexual desires for a limited time, hope you all find something beyond sex to occasionally think about or to do in your lives. There should be things that are as important as your sex life to you, but I sense people posting here in this thread center their life around who they have sex with instead of God.

So then why do many religious people want to treat women poorly today?

And shouldn’t people center their life around their families?

Being gay or straight doesn’t have anything to do with families. It’s who you have sex with. Homophobia implies that Christians hate people who have sex with same sex people.

Gay people cannot have children through the natural biological process straight people have children by. They can adopt children, or use a medical procedure to become pregnant.

The people posting on this thread center their entire lives around sex. It’s not healthy for gay or straight people to center their lives around their sex life. Sex is not the meaning of life. Sex is a part of life, but not the most important thing in life by a long shot. Defining the entirety of who you are as a human being by who you have sex with, that’s how you want to live? That’s your most important issue in life, making sure everyone knows who you have sex with, and making sure everyone approves of the people you have sex with?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

You are comparing homosexuality to child rape and … beastiality?

Really?

Oh and BTW child rape does cause harm!

Not comparing them. Just following your “no boundaries” rule about sexual relationships as long as they are based on love.

Nobody talked about child rape here btw.
If a minor loves an adult and want to have sex with them, we should celebrate it because it’s love? Who are you to say that the child should not love?

You see how this has nothing to do with love? It’s about immoral acts. We know what they are and we set boundaries.

It’s not immoral for 2 consenting adults to have sex.

What if they are married to other people?

What if one of them has a spouse sick with cancer?

What if one of them have an std or sti they are not disclosing to their consenting partner and unknowing spouse?

Jesus never said don’t molest children. Do we think He was silent on the matter because He was ok with child molestation?

Jesus never said don’t get high- is He ok with drug use/abuse?

Jesus never said don’t drive drunk, does that mean drunk driving is ok?

Jesus never said don’t go into a school and shoot students and teachers, does that mean it’s ok?

Since child marriage was common in that day, isn’t it likely that jesus was pro child rape?

Jesus was the first person to give women rights. In His day, women were literally property. The Jewish people in His community, their culture allowed this treatment of women. In fact, Jesus stopped a group of Jewish men, leaders, community members, from stoning a prostitute to death. He told the prostitute to go and sin no more. He loved her, and wanted her to live her life without being sexually sinful.

Women were completely separate from men, Jewish men and women lived almost completely separately, the only time they were together was in bed. Jewish culture and the cultures of people at the time, their customs were that young women and girls were married to older men. Jesus didn’t make that happen, nor did Christianity. If you can think of a group of people or culture that didn’t marry young girls off to older men, let us know. They all did it.

Jewish culture in the first century was decidedly patriarchal. The daily prayers of Jewish men included this prayer of thanksgiving: “Praised be God that he has not created me a woman.” A woman’s place was in the home. Women were responsible for bearing the children, rearing them and maintaining a hospitable home. Men were not to greet women in public. Some Jewish writers of Jesus’ time, such as Philo, taught that women should never leave the home except to go to the synagogue.

So yeah, blame the Jewish people of the time. Their men were so misogynistic they woke up everyday and thanked God they weren’t women. Women were under the domination of their fathers, then husbands. Totally.

Rabbi Eliezer, a first-century teacher, is noted for saying, “Rather should the word of the Torah be burned than entrusted to a woman.”

Jesus was radical because He simply spoke publicly to women.

Jewish people taught that women were “unclean” during their period- Jesus rejected that and said that was not true.

Jesus treated Martha and Mary as if they were valuable and worthy of attention and respect, something that the Jewish people during that time would not do.

Women were present at His death, and Jesus revealed Himself after His resurrection to women.

No other man before Jesus treated women with respect and as if they were worthy of being listened to and included in any facet of life. Jesus was amazing in his role as a Jewish man, teacher, and leader.

The Jewish people of Jesus’ time were prochild rape. They subjugated girls and women to the extreme and Jesus was the lone voice to proclaim there was a better way to treat women and girls.

How can you be so ignorant of the customs of Jesus’ time? He definitely was not abusing women and girls or treating them like chattel and disparaging them as their own fathers, husbands, and community did.

Crack a book occasionally. It’s borderline embarrassing and exactly why listening to people posting here about what Jesus really meant or what the Bible “really” says should be avoided. People with no knowledge or understanding are speaking about things they know nothing about. Don’t do it, and don’t listen to tik tok, or read crap that is made up by people advocating for political parties or political agendas.

Jesus came to save us from our sin, not to applaud wildly while we sin and praise each other for our sin. Going to church to be told how great you are is just another way to serve your own desires and earthly purpose. You can live your life based on your sexual desires for a limited time, hope you all find something beyond sex to occasionally think about or to do in your lives. There should be things that are as important as your sex life to you, but I sense people posting here in this thread center their life around who they have sex with instead of God.

So then why do many religious people want to treat women poorly today?

And shouldn’t people center their life around their families?

+1
Why are people using jesus name to strip women of their rights? Why aren’t more Christian’s standing up for women’s rights and claiming jesus as a feminist?

Jesus was not a feminist.

Jesus’ pro-woman stance had nothing to do with a cultural, secular worldview, racism, eugenics, socialism, Marxism, misandry, and murder. Jesus exalted women long before the feminist movement came into existence.

Jesus advocated for women in a culture where women were denied their most basic rights.

Jesus doesn’t get on board with human ideas, humans get on board with Jesus’ ideas.

Jesus exalted women based on their divine design and purpose – not because He held to a worldview of equality.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

You are comparing homosexuality to child rape and … beastiality?

Really?

Oh and BTW child rape does cause harm!

Not comparing them. Just following your “no boundaries” rule about sexual relationships as long as they are based on love.

Nobody talked about child rape here btw.
If a minor loves an adult and want to have sex with them, we should celebrate it because it’s love? Who are you to say that the child should not love?

You see how this has nothing to do with love? It’s about immoral acts. We know what they are and we set boundaries.

It’s not immoral for 2 consenting adults to have sex.

What if they are married to other people?

What if one of them has a spouse sick with cancer?

What if one of them have an std or sti they are not disclosing to their consenting partner and unknowing spouse?

Jesus never said don’t molest children. Do we think He was silent on the matter because He was ok with child molestation?

Jesus never said don’t get high- is He ok with drug use/abuse?

Jesus never said don’t drive drunk, does that mean drunk driving is ok?

Jesus never said don’t go into a school and shoot students and teachers, does that mean it’s ok?

Since child marriage was common in that day, isn’t it likely that jesus was pro child rape?

Jesus was the first person to give women rights. In His day, women were literally property. The Jewish people in His community, their culture allowed this treatment of women. In fact, Jesus stopped a group of Jewish men, leaders, community members, from stoning a prostitute to death. He told the prostitute to go and sin no more. He loved her, and wanted her to live her life without being sexually sinful.

Women were completely separate from men, Jewish men and women lived almost completely separately, the only time they were together was in bed. Jewish culture and the cultures of people at the time, their customs were that young women and girls were married to older men. Jesus didn’t make that happen, nor did Christianity. If you can think of a group of people or culture that didn’t marry young girls off to older men, let us know. They all did it.

Jewish culture in the first century was decidedly patriarchal. The daily prayers of Jewish men included this prayer of thanksgiving: “Praised be God that he has not created me a woman.” A woman’s place was in the home. Women were responsible for bearing the children, rearing them and maintaining a hospitable home. Men were not to greet women in public. Some Jewish writers of Jesus’ time, such as Philo, taught that women should never leave the home except to go to the synagogue.

So yeah, blame the Jewish people of the time. Their men were so misogynistic they woke up everyday and thanked God they weren’t women. Women were under the domination of their fathers, then husbands. Totally.

Rabbi Eliezer, a first-century teacher, is noted for saying, “Rather should the word of the Torah be burned than entrusted to a woman.”

Jesus was radical because He simply spoke publicly to women.

Jewish people taught that women were “unclean” during their period- Jesus rejected that and said that was not true.

Jesus treated Martha and Mary as if they were valuable and worthy of attention and respect, something that the Jewish people during that time would not do.

Women were present at His death, and Jesus revealed Himself after His resurrection to women.

No other man before Jesus treated women with respect and as if they were worthy of being listened to and included in any facet of life. Jesus was amazing in his role as a Jewish man, teacher, and leader.

The Jewish people of Jesus’ time were prochild rape. They subjugated girls and women to the extreme and Jesus was the lone voice to proclaim there was a better way to treat women and girls.

How can you be so ignorant of the customs of Jesus’ time? He definitely was not abusing women and girls or treating them like chattel and disparaging them as their own fathers, husbands, and community did.

Crack a book occasionally. It’s borderline embarrassing and exactly why listening to people posting here about what Jesus really meant or what the Bible “really” says should be avoided. People with no knowledge or understanding are speaking about things they know nothing about. Don’t do it, and don’t listen to tik tok, or read crap that is made up by people advocating for political parties or political agendas.

Jesus came to save us from our sin, not to applaud wildly while we sin and praise each other for our sin. Going to church to be told how great you are is just another way to serve your own desires and earthly purpose. You can live your life based on your sexual desires for a limited time, hope you all find something beyond sex to occasionally think about or to do in your lives. There should be things that are as important as your sex life to you, but I sense people posting here in this thread center their life around who they have sex with instead of God.

So then why do many religious people want to treat women poorly today?

And shouldn’t people center their life around their families?

+1
Why are people using jesus name to strip women of their rights? Why aren’t more Christian’s standing up for women’s rights and claiming jesus as a feminist?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

You are comparing homosexuality to child rape and … beastiality?

Really?

Oh and BTW child rape does cause harm!

Not comparing them. Just following your “no boundaries” rule about sexual relationships as long as they are based on love.

Nobody talked about child rape here btw.
If a minor loves an adult and want to have sex with them, we should celebrate it because it’s love? Who are you to say that the child should not love?

You see how this has nothing to do with love? It’s about immoral acts. We know what they are and we set boundaries.

It’s not immoral for 2 consenting adults to have sex.

What if they are married to other people?

What if one of them has a spouse sick with cancer?

What if one of them have an std or sti they are not disclosing to their consenting partner and unknowing spouse?

Jesus never said don’t molest children. Do we think He was silent on the matter because He was ok with child molestation?

Jesus never said don’t get high- is He ok with drug use/abuse?

Jesus never said don’t drive drunk, does that mean drunk driving is ok?

Jesus never said don’t go into a school and shoot students and teachers, does that mean it’s ok?

Since child marriage was common in that day, isn’t it likely that jesus was pro child rape?

Jesus was the first person to give women rights. In His day, women were literally property. The Jewish people in His community, their culture allowed this treatment of women. In fact, Jesus stopped a group of Jewish men, leaders, community members, from stoning a prostitute to death. He told the prostitute to go and sin no more. He loved her, and wanted her to live her life without being sexually sinful.

Women were completely separate from men, Jewish men and women lived almost completely separately, the only time they were together was in bed. Jewish culture and the cultures of people at the time, their customs were that young women and girls were married to older men. Jesus didn’t make that happen, nor did Christianity. If you can think of a group of people or culture that didn’t marry young girls off to older men, let us know. They all did it.

Jewish culture in the first century was decidedly patriarchal. The daily prayers of Jewish men included this prayer of thanksgiving: “Praised be God that he has not created me a woman.” A woman’s place was in the home. Women were responsible for bearing the children, rearing them and maintaining a hospitable home. Men were not to greet women in public. Some Jewish writers of Jesus’ time, such as Philo, taught that women should never leave the home except to go to the synagogue.

So yeah, blame the Jewish people of the time. Their men were so misogynistic they woke up everyday and thanked God they weren’t women. Women were under the domination of their fathers, then husbands. Totally.

Rabbi Eliezer, a first-century teacher, is noted for saying, “Rather should the word of the Torah be burned than entrusted to a woman.”

Jesus was radical because He simply spoke publicly to women.

Jewish people taught that women were “unclean” during their period- Jesus rejected that and said that was not true.

Jesus treated Martha and Mary as if they were valuable and worthy of attention and respect, something that the Jewish people during that time would not do.

Women were present at His death, and Jesus revealed Himself after His resurrection to women.

No other man before Jesus treated women with respect and as if they were worthy of being listened to and included in any facet of life. Jesus was amazing in his role as a Jewish man, teacher, and leader.

The Jewish people of Jesus’ time were prochild rape. They subjugated girls and women to the extreme and Jesus was the lone voice to proclaim there was a better way to treat women and girls.

How can you be so ignorant of the customs of Jesus’ time? He definitely was not abusing women and girls or treating them like chattel and disparaging them as their own fathers, husbands, and community did.

Crack a book occasionally. It’s borderline embarrassing and exactly why listening to people posting here about what Jesus really meant or what the Bible “really” says should be avoided. People with no knowledge or understanding are speaking about things they know nothing about. Don’t do it, and don’t listen to tik tok, or read crap that is made up by people advocating for political parties or political agendas.

Jesus came to save us from our sin, not to applaud wildly while we sin and praise each other for our sin. Going to church to be told how great you are is just another way to serve your own desires and earthly purpose. You can live your life based on your sexual desires for a limited time, hope you all find something beyond sex to occasionally think about or to do in your lives. There should be things that are as important as your sex life to you, but I sense people posting here in this thread center their life around who they have sex with instead of God.

So then why do many religious people want to treat women poorly today?

And shouldn’t people center their life around their families?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know how anyone could worship a god who created a subclass of people who loved in a certain way and then told them they were not allowed to love in that way or else they would go to hell. What kind of sicko mind would come up with such torture? To create some humans a certain way and then tell them they must deny themselves a crucial part of their humanity for their entire lives? Disgusting if it were so.

Luckily the god I worship would never be so cruel.

No human is a subclass.

Have you ever lied? Stolen anything? Done anything that you knew was wrong, but did it anyway? I have. And it was sin. God didn’t create us to throw our hands up and say “oh well. Guess I will do whatever I want.” We know when we sin, we die like to admit it. It makes is human to want to sin, as we all are sinful, but with God’s grace and strength we recognize our misdeeds/sins and try to turn away from them and do better.

I don’t think denying the urge to sin is denying my humanity. If we didn’t deny ourselves, what would we be? Slaves to emotion and greed and anger.

If a married person sees someone and says they love that person and sleeps with them, yes they did wrong. They should deny themselves and be faithful ti their spouse. If they can’t do that they should not have gotten married.

You’re comparing harming someone through stealing and lying to love between two people? This is why people leave religion.

And it also sounds like you must be asexual because you seem to imply you’d be able to repress your sexuality easily if you were told to.

NP
You are talking about love? Just calling it love doesn’t make it morally right.
How about we allow and celebrate love between adults and minor children?
How about we allow and celebrate love between humans and animals.
That’s love right? Not hurting anyone.

Don’t hide behind love to justify your sins.

You are comparing homosexuality to child rape and … beastiality?

Really?

Oh and BTW child rape does cause harm!

Not comparing them. Just following your “no boundaries” rule about sexual relationships as long as they are based on love.

Nobody talked about child rape here btw.
If a minor loves an adult and want to have sex with them, we should celebrate it because it’s love? Who are you to say that the child should not love?

You see how this has nothing to do with love? It’s about immoral acts. We know what they are and we set boundaries.

It’s not immoral for 2 consenting adults to have sex.

What if they are married to other people?

What if one of them has a spouse sick with cancer?

What if one of them have an std or sti they are not disclosing to their consenting partner and unknowing spouse?

Jesus never said don’t molest children. Do we think He was silent on the matter because He was ok with child molestation?

Jesus never said don’t get high- is He ok with drug use/abuse?

Jesus never said don’t drive drunk, does that mean drunk driving is ok?

Jesus never said don’t go into a school and shoot students and teachers, does that mean it’s ok?

Since child marriage was common in that day, isn’t it likely that jesus was pro child rape?

Jesus was the first person to give women rights. In His day, women were literally property. The Jewish people in His community, their culture allowed this treatment of women. In fact, Jesus stopped a group of Jewish men, leaders, community members, from stoning a prostitute to death. He told the prostitute to go and sin no more. He loved her, and wanted her to live her life without being sexually sinful.

Women were completely separate from men, Jewish men and women lived almost completely separately, the only time they were together was in bed. Jewish culture and the cultures of people at the time, their customs were that young women and girls were married to older men. Jesus didn’t make that happen, nor did Christianity. If you can think of a group of people or culture that didn’t marry young girls off to older men, let us know. They all did it.

Jewish culture in the first century was decidedly patriarchal. The daily prayers of Jewish men included this prayer of thanksgiving: “Praised be God that he has not created me a woman.” A woman’s place was in the home. Women were responsible for bearing the children, rearing them and maintaining a hospitable home. Men were not to greet women in public. Some Jewish writers of Jesus’ time, such as Philo, taught that women should never leave the home except to go to the synagogue.

So yeah, blame the Jewish people of the time. Their men were so misogynistic they woke up everyday and thanked God they weren’t women. Women were under the domination of their fathers, then husbands. Totally.

Rabbi Eliezer, a first-century teacher, is noted for saying, “Rather should the word of the Torah be burned than entrusted to a woman.”

Jesus was radical because He simply spoke publicly to women.

Jewish people taught that women were “unclean” during their period- Jesus rejected that and said that was not true.

Jesus treated Martha and Mary as if they were valuable and worthy of attention and respect, something that the Jewish people during that time would not do.

Women were present at His death, and Jesus revealed Himself after His resurrection to women.

No other man before Jesus treated women with respect and as if they were worthy of being listened to and included in any facet of life. Jesus was amazing in his role as a Jewish man, teacher, and leader.

The Jewish people of Jesus’ time were prochild rape. They subjugated girls and women to the extreme and Jesus was the lone voice to proclaim there was a better way to treat women and girls.

How can you be so ignorant of the customs of Jesus’ time? He definitely was not abusing women and girls or treating them like chattel and disparaging them as their own fathers, husbands, and community did.

Crack a book occasionally. It’s borderline embarrassing and exactly why listening to people posting here about what Jesus really meant or what the Bible “really” says should be avoided. People with no knowledge or understanding are speaking about things they know nothing about. Don’t do it, and don’t listen to tik tok, or read crap that is made up by people advocating for political parties or political agendas.

Jesus came to save us from our sin, not to applaud wildly while we sin and praise each other for our sin. Going to church to be told how great you are is just another way to serve your own desires and earthly purpose. You can live your life based on your sexual desires for a limited time, hope you all find something beyond sex to occasionally think about or to do in your lives. There should be things that are as important as your sex life to you, but I sense people posting here in this thread center their life around who they have sex with instead of God.