Anonymous wrote:Monday was hat day at my 5 year old's school. Usually I am the one who gets the kids ready and on the bus; but I was out of town until yesterday afternoon. I get a call at noon from my daughter's teacher saying that she had to confiscate my daughter's hat and daughter is very upset (what 5 year old wouldn't be upset that their hat was taken away?!) - turns out dh had nooo idea it was hat day, dd remembered, dh was doing lord knows what and didn't help dd find a hat to wear...so she went into his closet and picked something out and put it in her backpack to bring to school. The hat? A Miller High Life logo baseball cap. Of course she didn't really know that was beer, she just liked the yellow color. And I did find it kind of funny and chuckle a bit, but also...if I were home like I normally am, I would have known it was hat day and helped dd pick out something SCHOOL-APPROPRIATE. Mental load.

Anonymous wrote:I think many of the posters in this thread are doing a poor job of describing mental load. I don’t consider doing a Christmas card or finding a pediatrician mental load. On the contrary, I love tasks like that because they can be written down and delegated between partners. Great. That’s not the mental load. It’s the making of the list. It’s suggesting to your partner that you divy it up, it waking in the middle of the night to put something on the list. And so on. Too many people are talking about the bricks (tasks) but mental load is the mortar (all the work that gets those bricks in place).

Anyway, it’s not a DCUM phenomenon. It’s been around a long time but was popularized by a French comic named Emma who created the art at this link and published a graphic non-fiction book called The Mental Load. And it’s very specific to married couples, because it’s about allocation of responsibilities. Do a single parent household doesn’t really apply— without a partner, allocation of responsibilities doesn’t need to occur, beyond outsourcing, because you know who will handle things. And you can unilaterally decide not to care about something (like holiday cards) and then literally never think about it again.

Anyway, here’s the gist:

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2017/may/26/gender-wars-household-chores-comic

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even disagreeing that increased mental load for women is a real thing, but I must say the pp sounds like a parody of the hyper competitive, anxious umc nova mom we all know and "love." I mean really, spending mental energy on coordinated xmas card outfits? strategy for extracurriculars? choosing a kids dentist?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think many of the posters in this thread are doing a poor job of describing mental load. I don’t consider doing a Christmas card or finding a pediatrician mental load. On the contrary, I love tasks like that because they can be written down and delegated between partners. Great. That’s not the mental load. It’s the making of the list. It’s suggesting to your partner that you divy it up, it waking in the middle of the night to put something on the list. And so on. Too many people are talking about the bricks (tasks) but mental load is the mortar (all the work that gets those bricks in place).

Anyway, it’s not a DCUM phenomenon. It’s been around a long time but was popularized by a French comic named Emma who created the art at this link and published a graphic non-fiction book called The Mental Load. And it’s very specific to married couples, because it’s about allocation of responsibilities. Do a single parent household doesn’t really apply— without a partner, allocation of responsibilities doesn’t need to occur, beyond outsourcing, because you know who will handle things. And you can unilaterally decide not to care about something (like holiday cards) and then literally never think about it again.

Anyway, here’s the gist:

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2017/may/26/gender-wars-household-chores-comic

Obsessive thinking? Did you look at the link. These aren’t obsessive thoughts. They are basically project management. Do you think it’s “obsessive thinking” when a manager at work says “ok, let’s meet Tuesday to figure out who is going to handle which aspect of next weeks presentation”? It’s literally just thinking about how to get things done and facilitating them. If that’s obsessive, best of luck to you on functioning.

In what other circumstance is one person’s obsessive thinking the fault of another? This is like saying it’s a woman’s fault her stalker is obsessed with her.

Anonymous wrote:I think many of the posters in this thread are doing a poor job of describing mental load. I don’t consider doing a Christmas card or finding a pediatrician mental load. On the contrary, I love tasks like that because they can be written down and delegated between partners. Great. That’s not the mental load. It’s the making of the list. It’s suggesting to your partner that you divy it up, it waking in the middle of the night to put something on the list. And so on. Too many people are talking about the bricks (tasks) but mental load is the mortar (all the work that gets those bricks in place).

Anyway, it’s not a DCUM phenomenon. It’s been around a long time but was popularized by a French comic named Emma who created the art at this link and published a graphic non-fiction book called The Mental Load. And it’s very specific to married couples, because it’s about allocation of responsibilities. Do a single parent household doesn’t really apply— without a partner, allocation of responsibilities doesn’t need to occur, beyond outsourcing, because you know who will handle things. And you can unilaterally decide not to care about something (like holiday cards) and then literally never think about it again.

Anyway, here’s the gist:

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2017/may/26/gender-wars-household-chores-comic

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Lol at the paying the mortgage stuff. I’ve set the mortgage payment on autopay. It takes the least time of any of my tasks. (Maybe once a year or less when the payment changes I have to adjust it). It takes much, much more time to figure out summer activities for the kids. I wonder what super dad’s kids would have to say about his attention to their emotional and developmental needs.

I wasn’t referring to the physical act of paying the mortgage, rather the mental stress of providing for a family in the first place.

And it's your claim that the mental stress of providing for a family falls only on men?

Hoo-boy, as you are no doubt familiar with people saying, there in your timewarp version of reality.

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even disagreeing that increased mental load for women is a real thing, but I must say the pp sounds like a parody of the hyper competitive, anxious umc nova mom we all know and "love." I mean really, spending mental energy on coordinated xmas card outfits? strategy for extracurriculars? choosing a kids dentist?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
You are complicating things and you are the reason why your children need therapy. I am a working mom, and I don't do most of those things. I don't have any picky eaters because my priorities were to raise healthy kids, and not worry about Christmas cards. I don't keep track of anyone's addresses and don't send any cards (I am Christian and cards have nothing to do with Christmas). My kids are in high school and college now and we never had any professional shoots and we don't have a single photo with Santa. We never ever coordinated clothes (this sounds really crazy). I don't track birthdays for extended families, only my own family (my husband, my kids, my parents, and my sibling). I never tracked the school calendar and kids always were responsible for that. They are now pretty independent. We don't keep materials on hand (I hate clutter and I am very minimalistic) and kids learn to be creative when they need to make something last minute. Dentist and pediatrician - my husband chose them from the insurance provider's list and is close to our house. We never used therapists for children. We never chose extracurricular for kids, they were allowed to do what they like. Two kids were accepted into several Ivies. I potty trained them before they reach 1 y.o. and they didn't start daycare until the age of 3. Childcare varied over the years. We have no family around so we had to be very flexible and creative. Kids never had behavior issues. I think kids reflect your mental state, and if you are so anxious about all the things you listed, it is going to affect your kid's mental state a lot. No screen time policy as we never had cable TV or video games. Kids always were active in sport, several varsity teams.

NP here. And wow!
1. You are seriously going to blame PP for her kid's ADHD?! What is this, the 1960s?
2. If your kids are in college, then I don't think you really understand what it's like to have younger kids these days. When my older sister first talked about scheduling activities etc, I thought like you that she was nuts. And now I realize that things just don't work like they used to. Even if an elementary kid wants to play a sport, you have to sign up the day they open...or all of the slots will be gone. The HW load for even Kindergarteners is insane. We vacillate between not enforcing it and not wanting to undermine the teacher. But either way, my 5 y.o. is simply not able to manage this on his own. Neither is my 7 y.o...given how much more work she is given.
3. I don't do most of the stuff the PP talks about either (Christmas cards, matching outfits, etc)...but those aren't really the things that suck up your energy IMHO.

DP. No, but if mom (or dad, for that matter) is getting anxious about setting up professional photos and coordinating outfits for a Christmas card photo, or having a "screen time policy" or picking out a pediatrician/dentist...then yes, that sounds like the kind of home that would lead to anxious kids who need a therapist. I can say that because I DO have an anxious kid and looking back, yeah, a lot of it was because I stressed over things that do.not.matter.

ADHD =/= anxiety

NP. My kid has ADHD and of course it's not my fault she has it, but yeah when I'm anxious and stressed--especially about stupid stuff like scheduling professional photos or making sure we all look perfect and coordinated--that has a significant impact on her mood, behavior, and emotions. Household chaos absolutely can impact kids' mental state a lot as pp said, especially when you have kids with issues like ADHD that make them especially vulnerable to problematic mental states.

Anonymous wrote:Monday was hat day at my 5 year old's school. Usually I am the one who gets the kids ready and on the bus; but I was out of town until yesterday afternoon. I get a call at noon from my daughter's teacher saying that she had to confiscate my daughter's hat and daughter is very upset (what 5 year old wouldn't be upset that their hat was taken away?!) - turns out dh had nooo idea it was hat day, dd remembered, dh was doing lord knows what and didn't help dd find a hat to wear...so she went into his closet and picked something out and put it in her backpack to bring to school. The hat? A Miller High Life logo baseball cap. Of course she didn't really know that was beer, she just liked the yellow color. And I did find it kind of funny and chuckle a bit, but also...if I were home like I normally am, I would have known it was hat day and helped dd pick out something SCHOOL-APPROPRIATE. Mental load.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
You are complicating things and you are the reason why your children need therapy. I am a working mom, and I don't do most of those things. I don't have any picky eaters because my priorities were to raise healthy kids, and not worry about Christmas cards. I don't keep track of anyone's addresses and don't send any cards (I am Christian and cards have nothing to do with Christmas). My kids are in high school and college now and we never had any professional shoots and we don't have a single photo with Santa. We never ever coordinated clothes (this sounds really crazy). I don't track birthdays for extended families, only my own family (my husband, my kids, my parents, and my sibling). I never tracked the school calendar and kids always were responsible for that. They are now pretty independent. We don't keep materials on hand (I hate clutter and I am very minimalistic) and kids learn to be creative when they need to make something last minute. Dentist and pediatrician - my husband chose them from the insurance provider's list and is close to our house. We never used therapists for children. We never chose extracurricular for kids, they were allowed to do what they like. Two kids were accepted into several Ivies. I potty trained them before they reach 1 y.o. and they didn't start daycare until the age of 3. Childcare varied over the years. We have no family around so we had to be very flexible and creative. Kids never had behavior issues. I think kids reflect your mental state, and if you are so anxious about all the things you listed, it is going to affect your kid's mental state a lot. No screen time policy as we never had cable TV or video games. Kids always were active in sport, several varsity teams.

NP here. And wow!
1. You are seriously going to blame PP for her kid's ADHD?! What is this, the 1960s?
2. If your kids are in college, then I don't think you really understand what it's like to have younger kids these days. When my older sister first talked about scheduling activities etc, I thought like you that she was nuts. And now I realize that things just don't work like they used to. Even if an elementary kid wants to play a sport, you have to sign up the day they open...or all of the slots will be gone. The HW load for even Kindergarteners is insane. We vacillate between not enforcing it and not wanting to undermine the teacher. But either way, my 5 y.o. is simply not able to manage this on his own. Neither is my 7 y.o...given how much more work she is given.
3. I don't do most of the stuff the PP talks about either (Christmas cards, matching outfits, etc)...but those aren't really the things that suck up your energy IMHO.

DP. No, but if mom (or dad, for that matter) is getting anxious about setting up professional photos and coordinating outfits for a Christmas card photo, or having a "screen time policy" or picking out a pediatrician/dentist...then yes, that sounds like the kind of home that would lead to anxious kids who need a therapist. I can say that because I DO have an anxious kid and looking back, yeah, a lot of it was because I stressed over things that do.not.matter.

ADHD =/= anxiety