Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 13:26     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
I see most of the complaining about the governor and his pages and pages of crap restrictions that are hard to interpret and don’t really give any answers.

He had pages on youth sports yet they have to be 10’ apart. And no shared equipment. Just say they can’t do anything but tennis or golf. Or people will just interpret and do what they want.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 13:24     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:An outdoor pool with limited number of users (50), who bring their own chairs, is much less of a virus vector than these other phase 2 activities: indoor gyms, salons, spas, indoor restaurants, churches, etc.

It is very frustrating that it is just easier for politicians to cancel things for kids that don't have lobbyists or bring money to the state.


Any activities that have very young kids are going to be hard to keep the kids 6' apart from others.


OK, let's just say oh it's too hard and throw our hands up. Who cares about young kids right? They don't deserve any sort of outside recreation or break from the monotony of months at home. No pools, no playgrounds, no zoo, no library, no sports, no school. All because they have no voice.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 13:24     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:An outdoor pool with limited number of users (50), who bring their own chairs, is much less of a virus vector than these other phase 2 activities: indoor gyms, salons, spas, indoor restaurants, churches, etc.

It is very frustrating that it is just easier for politicians to cancel things for kids that don't have lobbyists or bring money to the state.


Any activities that have very young kids are going to be hard to keep the kids 6' apart from others.


Well it’s time to start easing in. You don’t think these kids are already playing outside together? How the hell will we be able to go to school for even part of next year if we don’t start lifting things a bit?
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 13:23     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:Whatever, don't go to the pool if you are worried about it. Just keep quarantining. Or go to a riot/protest since they don't seem worried about it either.


Maybe we should just riot swim
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 13:18     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Whatever, don't go to the pool if you are worried about it. Just keep quarantining. Or go to a riot/protest since they don't seem worried about it either.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 13:04     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:An outdoor pool with limited number of users (50), who bring their own chairs, is much less of a virus vector than these other phase 2 activities: indoor gyms, salons, spas, indoor restaurants, churches, etc.

It is very frustrating that it is just easier for politicians to cancel things for kids that don't have lobbyists or bring money to the state.


Any activities that have very young kids are going to be hard to keep the kids 6' apart from others.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 12:59     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
An outdoor pool with limited number of users (50), who bring their own chairs, is much less of a virus vector than these other phase 2 activities: indoor gyms, salons, spas, indoor restaurants, churches, etc.

It is very frustrating that it is just easier for politicians to cancel things for kids that don't have lobbyists or bring money to the state.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 11:58     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Karen's have been busy on this board I see.


the Karen thing is so tired and lame.


You're right it is. Shouldn't have used that. But, I've also never lived in an area where people bitch and whine as much as they do in this area. People need to learn to suck it up. No matter how you crack it - and whatever your political affiliation - over 100,000 people have died from this thing and all people are griping about is how summer swim is cancelled and that they basically (when you cut through all the layered BS) can't socialize at the pool. Those who are complaining about under-utilized pool space and wanting to get more lap swimming in - fair point and 100% agree.

Stop the entitled whining. Or call it being a "Karen". I don't care.


I think the issue is how arbitrary the application of the rules is. See the beach/restaurant/outdoor pool comparisons. The requirements for pools seem overly restrictive in comparison, especially when outdoor swimming at a pool is constantly rated as a low risk activity compared to other examples.


I am the one who you replied to. This is a fair point and a logical expression. My spouse runs a pool in the area. I know the effort put in - over several months - to develop a plan for Phase 1. I think the different applications go back to liability. A beach is essentially run by the government (city/town/state/etc.). It is a use at your own risk scenario. Pools are run by HOAs, Country Clubs, etc. They in many instances are run/governed by an all volunteer board. The risk threshold for each pool varies by how comfortable the governing authority is. Hence the arbitrary application of the rules. Think of when you have done pickup at a local restaurant. Do they all do the exact same thing? Likely no. They have regulations they must comply with but how to achieve those is applied differently. I've seen anywhere from table shoved in front of a counter to create a 6 foot space to an entire wall of plexiglass built to separate the counter from the customers. I think this is a good forum to share thoughts and ideas on how to accomplish the same thing but the whining drives me nits.


no that's not right. There has been a small amount of complaining about how different pools implement lap swimming. What you are seeing a lot of complaining about now is how the GOVERNMENT has laid out completely arbitrary rules for how pools operate in Phase 2 as compared to what beaches, restaurants, practically any other activity- is allowed to do. That's what seems arbitrary. I'm a volunteer board member too--- I'm complaining about what the GOVERNMENT is doing that is arbitrary. There is no increased COVID risk if I float in the pool vs if I float in the ocean- or if my kids 'play' in the pool as compared to the ocean. But the GOVERNMENT has decreed that ocean 'recreational' swimming is okay- but pool recreational swimming is limited to 'exercise, lap swimming, diving, and instruction.' Is going down the slide a 'riskier' covid activity than going off diving board? Is jumping off the diving board a riskier covid activity than diving off the diving board? Of course not. That's what we are saying is arbitrary.


Are you being serious?

There is no increased COVID risk if I float in the pool vs if I float in the ocean- or if my kids 'play' in the pool as compared to the ocean. Yes - there is. A pool is a defined space/surface are with more public/common area touch points. The ocean and the beach is a much more open space.

But the GOVERNMENT has decreed that ocean 'recreational' swimming is okay- but pool recreational swimming is limited to 'exercise, lap swimming, diving, and instruction.' A defined number of people over a specific time, in which hand rails, and public areas can be wiped down between users. If you open the pool fully (or with limited numbers but to wander around a pool deck, it eliminates (or at best reduces) the ability to do such.

Is going down the slide a 'riskier' covid activity than going off diving board? [b]Yes - of course it is. There is far less surface area contact between a slide and a diving board.[b]

Swimmers are by nature more disciplined individuals. They swim for exercise. They want to be able to get back to the form of exercise they enjpy and haven't been able to for several months. What you are talking about is a social activity. Splashing around. That is what you can do at the beach if you need to.

We respectfully disagree.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 11:29     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
I accept whatever the rules are. However, I think in light of this information, our pool needs to go ahead and decide that it will not open this year, and refund members' money, after subtracting out whatever is necessary regardless of operation costs (insurance, maintenance). This is not going to work for families like ours who use the pool for their young kids.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 11:22     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Karen's have been busy on this board I see.


the Karen thing is so tired and lame.


You're right it is. Shouldn't have used that. But, I've also never lived in an area where people bitch and whine as much as they do in this area. People need to learn to suck it up. No matter how you crack it - and whatever your political affiliation - over 100,000 people have died from this thing and all people are griping about is how summer swim is cancelled and that they basically (when you cut through all the layered BS) can't socialize at the pool. Those who are complaining about under-utilized pool space and wanting to get more lap swimming in - fair point and 100% agree.

Stop the entitled whining. Or call it being a "Karen". I don't care.


I think the issue is how arbitrary the application of the rules is. See the beach/restaurant/outdoor pool comparisons. The requirements for pools seem overly restrictive in comparison, especially when outdoor swimming at a pool is constantly rated as a low risk activity compared to other examples.


I am the one who you replied to. This is a fair point and a logical expression. My spouse runs a pool in the area. I know the effort put in - over several months - to develop a plan for Phase 1. I think the different applications go back to liability. A beach is essentially run by the government (city/town/state/etc.). It is a use at your own risk scenario. Pools are run by HOAs, Country Clubs, etc. They in many instances are run/governed by an all volunteer board. The risk threshold for each pool varies by how comfortable the governing authority is. Hence the arbitrary application of the rules. Think of when you have done pickup at a local restaurant. Do they all do the exact same thing? Likely no. They have regulations they must comply with but how to achieve those is applied differently. I've seen anywhere from table shoved in front of a counter to create a 6 foot space to an entire wall of plexiglass built to separate the counter from the customers. I think this is a good forum to share thoughts and ideas on how to accomplish the same thing but the whining drives me nits.


no that's not right. There has been a small amount of complaining about how different pools implement lap swimming. What you are seeing a lot of complaining about now is how the GOVERNMENT has laid out completely arbitrary rules for how pools operate in Phase 2 as compared to what beaches, restaurants, practically any other activity- is allowed to do. That's what seems arbitrary. I'm a volunteer board member too--- I'm complaining about what the GOVERNMENT is doing that is arbitrary. There is no increased COVID risk if I float in the pool vs if I float in the ocean- or if my kids 'play' in the pool as compared to the ocean. But the GOVERNMENT has decreed that ocean 'recreational' swimming is okay- but pool recreational swimming is limited to 'exercise, lap swimming, diving, and instruction.' Is going down the slide a 'riskier' covid activity than going off diving board? Is jumping off the diving board a riskier covid activity than diving off the diving board? Of course not. That's what we are saying is arbitrary.


They decided that because the travel and tourism industry has organized lobbyists and deep pockets to carve out their own exemptions to everything. The recreational pool and pool club industry does not. They were unable to effectively lobby the government and now must remain fairly closed. It’s just shocking to most of us to see this play out in real life.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 11:08     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Karen's have been busy on this board I see.


the Karen thing is so tired and lame.


You're right it is. Shouldn't have used that. But, I've also never lived in an area where people bitch and whine as much as they do in this area. People need to learn to suck it up. No matter how you crack it - and whatever your political affiliation - over 100,000 people have died from this thing and all people are griping about is how summer swim is cancelled and that they basically (when you cut through all the layered BS) can't socialize at the pool. Those who are complaining about under-utilized pool space and wanting to get more lap swimming in - fair point and 100% agree.

Stop the entitled whining. Or call it being a "Karen". I don't care.


I think the issue is how arbitrary the application of the rules is. See the beach/restaurant/outdoor pool comparisons. The requirements for pools seem overly restrictive in comparison, especially when outdoor swimming at a pool is constantly rated as a low risk activity compared to other examples.


I am the one who you replied to. This is a fair point and a logical expression. My spouse runs a pool in the area. I know the effort put in - over several months - to develop a plan for Phase 1. I think the different applications go back to liability. A beach is essentially run by the government (city/town/state/etc.). It is a use at your own risk scenario. Pools are run by HOAs, Country Clubs, etc. They in many instances are run/governed by an all volunteer board. The risk threshold for each pool varies by how comfortable the governing authority is. Hence the arbitrary application of the rules. Think of when you have done pickup at a local restaurant. Do they all do the exact same thing? Likely no. They have regulations they must comply with but how to achieve those is applied differently. I've seen anywhere from table shoved in front of a counter to create a 6 foot space to an entire wall of plexiglass built to separate the counter from the customers. I think this is a good forum to share thoughts and ideas on how to accomplish the same thing but the whining drives me nits.


no that's not right. There has been a small amount of complaining about how different pools implement lap swimming. What you are seeing a lot of complaining about now is how the GOVERNMENT has laid out completely arbitrary rules for how pools operate in Phase 2 as compared to what beaches, restaurants, practically any other activity- is allowed to do. That's what seems arbitrary. I'm a volunteer board member too--- I'm complaining about what the GOVERNMENT is doing that is arbitrary. There is no increased COVID risk if I float in the pool vs if I float in the ocean- or if my kids 'play' in the pool as compared to the ocean. But the GOVERNMENT has decreed that ocean 'recreational' swimming is okay- but pool recreational swimming is limited to 'exercise, lap swimming, diving, and instruction.' Is going down the slide a 'riskier' covid activity than going off diving board? Is jumping off the diving board a riskier covid activity than diving off the diving board? Of course not. That's what we are saying is arbitrary.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 10:58     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Karen's have been busy on this board I see.


the Karen thing is so tired and lame.


You're right it is. Shouldn't have used that. But, I've also never lived in an area where people bitch and whine as much as they do in this area. People need to learn to suck it up. No matter how you crack it - and whatever your political affiliation - over 100,000 people have died from this thing and all people are griping about is how summer swim is cancelled and that they basically (when you cut through all the layered BS) can't socialize at the pool. Those who are complaining about under-utilized pool space and wanting to get more lap swimming in - fair point and 100% agree.

Stop the entitled whining. Or call it being a "Karen". I don't care.


I think the issue is how arbitrary the application of the rules is. See the beach/restaurant/outdoor pool comparisons. The requirements for pools seem overly restrictive in comparison, especially when outdoor swimming at a pool is constantly rated as a low risk activity compared to other examples.


I am the one who you replied to. This is a fair point and a logical expression. My spouse runs a pool in the area. I know the effort put in - over several months - to develop a plan for Phase 1. I think the different applications go back to liability. A beach is essentially run by the government (city/town/state/etc.). It is a use at your own risk scenario. Pools are run by HOAs, Country Clubs, etc. They in many instances are run/governed by an all volunteer board. The risk threshold for each pool varies by how comfortable the governing authority is. Hence the arbitrary application of the rules. Think of when you have done pickup at a local restaurant. Do they all do the exact same thing? Likely no. They have regulations they must comply with but how to achieve those is applied differently. I've seen anywhere from table shoved in front of a counter to create a 6 foot space to an entire wall of plexiglass built to separate the counter from the customers. I think this is a good forum to share thoughts and ideas on how to accomplish the same thing but the whining drives me nits.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 10:45     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Karen's have been busy on this board I see.


the Karen thing is so tired and lame.


You're right it is. Shouldn't have used that. But, I've also never lived in an area where people bitch and whine as much as they do in this area. People need to learn to suck it up. No matter how you crack it - and whatever your political affiliation - over 100,000 people have died from this thing and all people are griping about is how summer swim is cancelled and that they basically (when you cut through all the layered BS) can't socialize at the pool. Those who are complaining about under-utilized pool space and wanting to get more lap swimming in - fair point and 100% agree.

Stop the entitled whining. Or call it being a "Karen". I don't care.


I think the issue is how arbitrary the application of the rules is. See the beach/restaurant/outdoor pool comparisons. The requirements for pools seem overly restrictive in comparison, especially when outdoor swimming at a pool is constantly rated as a low risk activity compared to other examples.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 10:37     Subject: Re:Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:our pool has 11 lanes for lap swimming. They opened sign up yesterday and there are a lot of empty slots, even on the weekends. Limited to 18+ which cuts out at least 50% of the pool members.


With this under-utilization of capacity, is your pool planning to adjust policies before Phase 2 and start allowing under-18 swimmers?

I don't get why pools are setting these adult-only policies when many of their best swimmers are the youth on their NVSL teams.


Our pool set the limit at 15yrs for now, saying in part it's about younger kids not only being able to swim laps but also respect social distancing requirements. They've said they hope to reconsider but this is the starting point.


I posted about our pool only allowing over 18 and having a lot of empty lanes. I sure hope they adjust for phase 2. We have a large swim team, the majority of whom are under 14 so there are certainly plenty of kids who are capable of lap swimming.


So many of these policies make no sense. Beaches open but pool can't, come on.
Anonymous
Post 06/03/2020 10:37     Subject: Which summer swim clubs are opening (nova)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Karen's have been busy on this board I see.


the Karen thing is so tired and lame.


You're right it is. Shouldn't have used that. But, I've also never lived in an area where people bitch and whine as much as they do in this area. People need to learn to suck it up. No matter how you crack it - and whatever your political affiliation - over 100,000 people have died from this thing and all people are griping about is how summer swim is cancelled and that they basically (when you cut through all the layered BS) can't socialize at the pool. Those who are complaining about under-utilized pool space and wanting to get more lap swimming in - fair point and 100% agree.

Stop the entitled whining. Or call it being a "Karen". I don't care.