Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees."

Then you're not UMC. And you don't realize that many, if not most, of "the powerful" have salaries of $200K or less. You might have a nice income, but you don't belong to that elite UMC grouping. UMC people are not worker bees. Many work around the clock, but their work often involves higher level thinking and relationship building. Or they have skills and credentials that garner high salaries, like physicians or CPAs. These aren't people who punch a time clock or get paid overtime. They might only earn about the same as a DC cop with seniority who pulls lots of overtime and side gigs, but how they earn that money is very different.

I am a CPA and my spouse is a physician (since you brought those two professions up) and I echo what PP said: this is ridiculous. We don’t hang out with the rich and the powerful, we’re not inviting Congresspeople and their staff to our kids’ baptisms, and neither are most of our CPA / physician coworkers. I wouldn’t dare call our family middle class, though.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think anyone has mentioned these things that are part of a UMC childhood in the US:

Parents who attended elite colleges and whose circle of friends are similarly well educated
Parents who have graduate degrees
In the DMV, parents whose connections get you into the White House grounds for special events when their party is in power
In the DMV Members of Congress or their senior staff, or high level appointees are on your family's guest lists for celebrations like baptisms and 50th birthdays
Family friends who can help arrange for unpaid internships
Family friends whose name on a letter of recommendation will get noticed
Vacations involving water craft do not have anything to do with water skiing, those party barge pontoon boats, or jet skis. You either sail or paddle to move the boat if you're living the UMC lifestyle
Multiple languages spoken by people in your family, or at least one of your parents lived in another country for a semester
Membership in the local museum associations
At least a few works of art purchased directly from a somewhat successful artist - OR - a study of a masterpiece
Parents attend fundraisers and serve on boards

This! I think the level of social capital and connections is a key difference between a MC and UMC childhood. Being able to tap your parents’ or family’s extensive network of influential friends, family and acquaintances for advice and assistance with higher education admissions, internships (paid and unpaid) and professional opportunities in childhood and early professional experiences. This is especially true for those useful life experiences during the summers in high school that get noticed on college applications, those unpaid internships during the first or second year of college before on campus interviews start, the networking with highly placed employees when considering a career change or joining a board or social club. It’s much easier to identify career fields and opportunities when you can learn the ins and outs of the job from someone there and well positioned to go to bat for you and tell you about opportunities before they are publicly posted. A good piece of advice. The secret to a lot of success if you want to be in the UMC is “picking your parents well”!

This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees.

It can definitely be a mix. We are UMC and do fundraisers but we don’t do the full on donations because we don’t have that kind of money. We went to elite colleges. I SAH. We have connections to get internships but not necessarily into the WH. There’s 3 degrees in my mind of the UMC jump to UC. There’s 300k UMC (which is dual workers), $1 mil upper upper middle (where we fall), and finally $4-5 million entering UC but still not with those connections. I know if we joined the right country clubs we could. It’s still so very hard to break in. Regardless of elite degrees. Also some parents prioritize colleges or private school or certain things, than others.

But the elite want to hobknob with other movers and shakers. Why would they want to socialize with a SAHM? Maybe the husband if he’s important enough, but in that case he should be making those connections through work and organic networking, not needing to join a country club.

My husband networks a little bit via work but gets hung up on things shouldn’t be this way. That things should be fair. I’ve pushed him to do it more and it comes so easy-he’s important in his field. I also think of going back to work because all the women are doing something, a fashion line, or nonprofit work. But truly it’s so fake. We must for our kids though. It’s true the network makes things so much easier.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think anyone has mentioned these things that are part of a UMC childhood in the US:

Parents who attended elite colleges and whose circle of friends are similarly well educated
Parents who have graduate degrees
In the DMV, parents whose connections get you into the White House grounds for special events when their party is in power
In the DMV Members of Congress or their senior staff, or high level appointees are on your family's guest lists for celebrations like baptisms and 50th birthdays
Family friends who can help arrange for unpaid internships
Family friends whose name on a letter of recommendation will get noticed
Vacations involving water craft do not have anything to do with water skiing, those party barge pontoon boats, or jet skis. You either sail or paddle to move the boat if you're living the UMC lifestyle
Multiple languages spoken by people in your family, or at least one of your parents lived in another country for a semester
Membership in the local museum associations
At least a few works of art purchased directly from a somewhat successful artist - OR - a study of a masterpiece
Parents attend fundraisers and serve on boards

This! I think the level of social capital and connections is a key difference between a MC and UMC childhood. Being able to tap your parents’ or family’s extensive network of influential friends, family and acquaintances for advice and assistance with higher education admissions, internships (paid and unpaid) and professional opportunities in childhood and early professional experiences. This is especially true for those useful life experiences during the summers in high school that get noticed on college applications, those unpaid internships during the first or second year of college before on campus interviews start, the networking with highly placed employees when considering a career change or joining a board or social club. It’s much easier to identify career fields and opportunities when you can learn the ins and outs of the job from someone there and well positioned to go to bat for you and tell you about opportunities before they are publicly posted. A good piece of advice. The secret to a lot of success if you want to be in the UMC is “picking your parents well”!

This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees.

It can definitely be a mix. We are UMC and do fundraisers but we don’t do the full on donations because we don’t have that kind of money. We went to elite colleges. I SAH. We have connections to get internships but not necessarily into the WH. There’s 3 degrees in my mind of the UMC jump to UC. There’s 300k UMC (which is dual workers), $1 mil upper upper middle (where we fall), and finally $4-5 million entering UC but still not with those connections. I know if we joined the right country clubs we could. It’s still so very hard to break in. Regardless of elite degrees. Also some parents prioritize colleges or private school or certain things, than others.

But the elite want to hobknob with other movers and shakers. Why would they want to socialize with a SAHM? Maybe the husband if he’s important enough, but in that case he should be making those connections through work and organic networking, not needing to join a country club.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees."

Then you're not UMC. And you don't realize that many, if not most, of "the powerful" have salaries of $200K or less. You might have a nice income, but you don't belong to that elite UMC grouping. UMC people are not worker bees. Many work around the clock, but their work often involves higher level thinking and relationship building. Or they have skills and credentials that garner high salaries, like physicians or CPAs. These aren't people who punch a time clock or get paid overtime. They might only earn about the same as a DC cop with seniority who pulls lots of overtime and side gigs, but how they earn that money is very different.

I am a CPA and my spouse is a physician (since you brought those two professions up) and I echo what PP said: this is ridiculous. We don’t hang out with the rich and the powerful, we’re not inviting Congresspeople and their staff to our kids’ baptisms, and neither are most of our CPA / physician coworkers. I wouldn’t dare call our family middle class, though.

You may not hang out with the "rich and powerful" but I would bet you're reasonably well-connected amongst your colleagues, neighbors and friends. You have legacy status at the universities you attended and multiple universities that your spouse attended (undergrad, med school, residency, fellowship, etc.). Your spouse knows multiple other physicians and you both probably know plenty of people in the professional class (e.g., CPAs, lawyers, finance types, etc.) that could potentially be resources for your kids. It's not that the the Horatio Alger LMC types can't succeed. Rather, it's hard work and natural talents alone with a bit of luck that are the deciding factors. They also probably had to hustle to understand what you or your kids already know -- whether it's social etiquette or who to go to and what is necessary if you're interested in applying to a selective university, getting a prestigious internship, or preparing for that first job interview. For example, it's the difference between reading a book on investment banking and cold calling/DM someone in the field on LinkedIn rather than asking a family member about their experiences and what opportunities might be available. It can still work, but it's much easier if you're already qualified AND have personal connections to the industry. Moreover, as UMC, you can probably afford to pay 100% tuition and help your kids launch if they're in a field that benefits from unpaid internships or moving to a high cost of living area for that first job. There's a great book called "Paying for the Party" that illustrates how these class differences play out at a public university.

Hey, you’re the one who said we’re not UMC because we’re white collar worker bees.

Sorry, that wasn’t me. I think that’s someone conflating UMC with UC. Also, there’s a world of a difference between a single practitioner CPA doing the local dentist’s return and a Big 4 partner. The same is true for law and many other white collar professionals.

Hey, what if you’ve done both? Well, not Big 4 *partner* — I left too quickly — but I could’ve climbed the ladder if I’d have wanted to. Now I’m a solo practitioner because I like the flexibility it allows for family life. There are lots out there like me.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees."

Then you're not UMC. And you don't realize that many, if not most, of "the powerful" have salaries of $200K or less. You might have a nice income, but you don't belong to that elite UMC grouping. UMC people are not worker bees. Many work around the clock, but their work often involves higher level thinking and relationship building. Or they have skills and credentials that garner high salaries, like physicians or CPAs. These aren't people who punch a time clock or get paid overtime. They might only earn about the same as a DC cop with seniority who pulls lots of overtime and side gigs, but how they earn that money is very different.

I am a CPA and my spouse is a physician (since you brought those two professions up) and I echo what PP said: this is ridiculous. We don’t hang out with the rich and the powerful, we’re not inviting Congresspeople and their staff to our kids’ baptisms, and neither are most of our CPA / physician coworkers. I wouldn’t dare call our family middle class, though.

You may not hang out with the "rich and powerful" but I would bet you're reasonably well-connected amongst your colleagues, neighbors and friends. You have legacy status at the universities you attended and multiple universities that your spouse attended (undergrad, med school, residency, fellowship, etc.). Your spouse knows multiple other physicians and you both probably know plenty of people in the professional class (e.g., CPAs, lawyers, finance types, etc.) that could potentially be resources for your kids. It's not that the the Horatio Alger LMC types can't succeed. Rather, it's hard work and natural talents alone with a bit of luck that are the deciding factors. They also probably had to hustle to understand what you or your kids already know -- whether it's social etiquette or who to go to and what is necessary if you're interested in applying to a selective university, getting a prestigious internship, or preparing for that first job interview. For example, it's the difference between reading a book on investment banking and cold calling/DM someone in the field on LinkedIn rather than asking a family member about their experiences and what opportunities might be available. It can still work, but it's much easier if you're already qualified AND have personal connections to the industry. Moreover, as UMC, you can probably afford to pay 100% tuition and help your kids launch if they're in a field that benefits from unpaid internships or moving to a high cost of living area for that first job. There's a great book called "Paying for the Party" that illustrates how these class differences play out at a public university.

Hey, you’re the one who said we’re not UMC because we’re white collar worker bees.

Sorry, that wasn’t me. I think that’s someone conflating UMC with UC. Also, there’s a world of a difference between a single practitioner CPA doing the local dentist’s return and a Big 4 partner. The same is true for law and many other white collar professionals.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees."

Then you're not UMC. And you don't realize that many, if not most, of "the powerful" have salaries of $200K or less. You might have a nice income, but you don't belong to that elite UMC grouping. UMC people are not worker bees. Many work around the clock, but their work often involves higher level thinking and relationship building. Or they have skills and credentials that garner high salaries, like physicians or CPAs. These aren't people who punch a time clock or get paid overtime. They might only earn about the same as a DC cop with seniority who pulls lots of overtime and side gigs, but how they earn that money is very different.

I am a CPA and my spouse is a physician (since you brought those two professions up) and I echo what PP said: this is ridiculous. We don’t hang out with the rich and the powerful, we’re not inviting Congresspeople and their staff to our kids’ baptisms, and neither are most of our CPA / physician coworkers. I wouldn’t dare call our family middle class, though.

You may not hang out with the "rich and powerful" but I would bet you're reasonably well-connected amongst your colleagues, neighbors and friends. You have legacy status at the universities you attended and multiple universities that your spouse attended (undergrad, med school, residency, fellowship, etc.). Your spouse knows multiple other physicians and you both probably know plenty of people in the professional class (e.g., CPAs, lawyers, finance types, etc.) that could potentially be resources for your kids. It's not that the the Horatio Alger LMC types can't succeed. Rather, it's hard work and natural talents alone with a bit of luck that are the deciding factors. They also probably had to hustle to understand what you or your kids already know -- whether it's social etiquette or who to go to and what is necessary if you're interested in applying to a selective university, getting a prestigious internship, or preparing for that first job interview. For example, it's the difference between reading a book on investment banking and cold calling/DM someone in the field on LinkedIn rather than asking a family member about their experiences and what opportunities might be available. It can still work, but it's much easier if you're already qualified AND have personal connections to the industry. Moreover, as UMC, you can probably afford to pay 100% tuition and help your kids launch if they're in a field that benefits from unpaid internships or moving to a high cost of living area for that first job. There's a great book called "Paying for the Party" that illustrates how these class differences play out at a public university.

Hey, you’re the one who said we’re not UMC because we’re white collar worker bees.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees."

Then you're not UMC. And you don't realize that many, if not most, of "the powerful" have salaries of $200K or less. You might have a nice income, but you don't belong to that elite UMC grouping. UMC people are not worker bees. Many work around the clock, but their work often involves higher level thinking and relationship building. Or they have skills and credentials that garner high salaries, like physicians or CPAs. These aren't people who punch a time clock or get paid overtime. They might only earn about the same as a DC cop with seniority who pulls lots of overtime and side gigs, but how they earn that money is very different.

I am a CPA and my spouse is a physician (since you brought those two professions up) and I echo what PP said: this is ridiculous. We don’t hang out with the rich and the powerful, we’re not inviting Congresspeople and their staff to our kids’ baptisms, and neither are most of our CPA / physician coworkers. I wouldn’t dare call our family middle class, though.

You may not hang out with the "rich and powerful" but I would bet you're reasonably well-connected amongst your colleagues, neighbors and friends. You have legacy status at the universities you attended and multiple universities that your spouse attended (undergrad, med school, residency, fellowship, etc.). Your spouse knows multiple other physicians and you both probably know plenty of people in the professional class (e.g., CPAs, lawyers, finance types, etc.) that could potentially be resources for your kids. It's not that the the Horatio Alger LMC types can't succeed. Rather, it's hard work and natural talents alone with a bit of luck that are the deciding factors. They also probably had to hustle to understand what you or your kids already know -- whether it's social etiquette or who to go to and what is necessary if you're interested in applying to a selective university, getting a prestigious internship, or preparing for that first job interview. For example, it's the difference between reading a book on investment banking and cold calling/DM someone in the field on LinkedIn rather than asking a family member about their experiences and what opportunities might be available. It can still work, but it's much easier if you're already qualified AND have personal connections to the industry. Moreover, as UMC, you can probably afford to pay 100% tuition and help your kids launch if they're in a field that benefits from unpaid internships or moving to a high cost of living area for that first job. There's a great book called "Paying for the Party" that illustrates how these class differences play out at a public university.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees."

Then you're not UMC. And you don't realize that many, if not most, of "the powerful" have salaries of $200K or less. You might have a nice income, but you don't belong to that elite UMC grouping. UMC people are not worker bees. Many work around the clock, but their work often involves higher level thinking and relationship building. Or they have skills and credentials that garner high salaries, like physicians or CPAs. These aren't people who punch a time clock or get paid overtime. They might only earn about the same as a DC cop with seniority who pulls lots of overtime and side gigs, but how they earn that money is very different.

I am a CPA and my spouse is a physician (since you brought those two professions up) and I echo what PP said: this is ridiculous. We don’t hang out with the rich and the powerful, we’re not inviting Congresspeople and their staff to our kids’ baptisms, and neither are most of our CPA / physician coworkers. I wouldn’t dare call our family middle class, though.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees."

Then you're not UMC. And you don't realize that many, if not most, of "the powerful" have salaries of $200K or less. You might have a nice income, but you don't belong to that elite UMC grouping. UMC people are not worker bees. Many work around the clock, but their work often involves higher level thinking and relationship building. Or they have skills and credentials that garner high salaries, like physicians or CPAs. These aren't people who punch a time clock or get paid overtime. They might only earn about the same as a DC cop with seniority who pulls lots of overtime and side gigs, but how they earn that money is very different.

I am a CPA and my spouse is a physician (since you brought those two professions up) and I echo what PP said: this is ridiculous. We don’t hang out with the rich and the powerful, we’re not inviting Congresspeople and their staff to our kids’ baptisms, and neither are most of our CPA / physician coworkers. I wouldn’t dare call our family middle class, though.

Anonymous wrote:"This is ridiculous. Very few UMC families are in elite circles with the rich and powerful. Many of us are simply dual income white collar worker bees."

Then you're not UMC. And you don't realize that many, if not most, of "the powerful" have salaries of $200K or less. You might have a nice income, but you don't belong to that elite UMC grouping. UMC people are not worker bees. Many work around the clock, but their work often involves higher level thinking and relationship building. Or they have skills and credentials that garner high salaries, like physicians or CPAs. These aren't people who punch a time clock or get paid overtime. They might only earn about the same as a DC cop with seniority who pulls lots of overtime and side gigs, but how they earn that money is very different.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think anyone has mentioned these things that are part of a UMC childhood in the US:

Parents who attended elite colleges and whose circle of friends are similarly well educated
Parents who have graduate degrees
In the DMV, parents whose connections get you into the White House grounds for special events when their party is in power
In the DMV Members of Congress or their senior staff, or high level appointees are on your family's guest lists for celebrations like baptisms and 50th birthdays
Family friends who can help arrange for unpaid internships
Family friends whose name on a letter of recommendation will get noticed
Vacations involving water craft do not have anything to do with water skiing, those party barge pontoon boats, or jet skis. You either sail or paddle to move the boat if you're living the UMC lifestyle
Multiple languages spoken by people in your family, or at least one of your parents lived in another country for a semester
Membership in the local museum associations
At least a few works of art purchased directly from a somewhat successful artist - OR - a study of a masterpiece
Parents attend fundraisers and serve on boards

This! I think the level of social capital and connections is a key difference between a MC and UMC childhood. Being able to tap your parents’ or family’s extensive network of influential friends, family and acquaintances for advice and assistance with higher education admissions, internships (paid and unpaid) and professional opportunities in childhood and early professional experiences. This is especially true for those useful life experiences during the summers in high school that get noticed on college applications, those unpaid internships during the first or second year of college before on campus interviews start, the networking with highly placed employees when considering a career change or joining a board or social club. It’s much easier to identify career fields and opportunities when you can learn the ins and outs of the job from someone there and well positioned to go to bat for you and tell you about opportunities before they are publicly posted. A good piece of advice. The secret to a lot of success if you want to be in the UMC is “picking your parents well”!

This so called secret to success can be debunked by being highly intelligent and a hard worker. I was raised in an UMC family. Parents had connections, college was paid for, lived in a big house, rode horses, played sports, traveled, etc... My husband came from a LMC family. He went to a no name college but he is damm smart and has an excellent work ethic. We are well off because of him, not his parents. He started a very lucrative business after his first job out of college and has not had a handout or any strings pulled for him. Motivation, work ethic and intelligence is the secret to a lot of success.

Anonymous wrote:I don't think anyone has mentioned these things that are part of a UMC childhood in the US:

Parents who attended elite colleges and whose circle of friends are similarly well educated
Parents who have graduate degrees
In the DMV, parents whose connections get you into the White House grounds for special events when their party is in power

Family friends who can help arrange for unpaid internships
Family friends whose name on a letter of recommendation will get noticed
Multiple languages spoken by people in your family, or at least one of your parents lived in another country for a semester

Parents attend fundraisers and serve on boards