Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:47     Subject: Re:How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
I'm the professor who wrote at the top of this page. Even staff who do not work directly with someone initially refer to faculty by "professor." It is simply the formal title used in this professional setting. It is the default unless someone insists on a first name. My belief is that professors should not ask students to refer to them by their first name. If they do insist students use their first name, I would worry they have boundary isssues.

I am flabbergasted to read all these parents who are shocked or resentful that there are formal boundaries in academia. It's not about subservience. It's about professionalism.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:42     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:The sad part is that OP and her DD have to live in the world they actually live in, and deal with any consequences thereof, not the world they want to live in.

Sucks not to always be on top. Sucks to try so hard to insult someone, when they don't really care that much -- and yet still are going to pass judgement on you, because that is their job.

Oh, well. Maybe OP feels better for ranting here. One can only hope. It's a small enough gift.


Consequence for an adult addressing another adult by their first name? It's not like OP said her daughter uses "Hey cat lady" or "Yo" to greet professors. What's wrong with "Hi Ryan" or "Hi Suzy"? It's completely normal and okay.


Yeah, consequences. I know you don't like this, but it's true, and all the ranting you indulge in doesn't change it.

If a person in training does not abide by the norms and standards of the profession (and that includes academia), then this will be reflected in what opportunities are made available and will be reflected in formal assessments, including recommendations.

Sorry. Deal with it. *shrug*
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:42     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.


+1. Campus isn't British aristocracy. And lets not even get into the historic inequities that prevented people of color, the poor, and women from having access to earn certain credentials. As long as you're polite, there's nothing wrong with using people's first name. It's lunacy that would send anyone off the edge. Go see a shrink if it does. Your credentials earn you a higher salary and more prestigious jobs, not perpetual servitude.



I don't think you meant what you typed. And you are wrong. Professors are called "Dr." on campus and "Professor" in law school. I never called anyone by their first name nor have my children. It's a siign of respect and expected.


But only if it is expected. Not at all clear that it was in the case of OP's DD.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:40     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.


+1. Campus isn't British aristocracy. And lets not even get into the historic inequities that prevented people of color, the poor, and women from having access to earn certain credentials. As long as you're polite, there's nothing wrong with using people's first name. It's lunacy that would send anyone off the edge. Go see a shrink if it does. Your credentials earn you a higher salary and more prestigious jobs, not perpetual servitude.



I don't think you meant what you typed. And you are wrong. Professors are called "Dr." on campus and "Professor" in law school. I never called anyone by their first name nor have my children. It's a siign of respect and expected.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:40     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:Let's say for the sake of argument, the daughter is correct that most profs are fine with first name - that doesn't make those who aren't "rude" or "obnoxious jerks" or hacks insisting on bootlicking as others have suggested.

They have a different preference, they let it be known, and it should be respected.


I'll agree with this. If someone if doing my performance rating, or giving me a grade, I'll call them whatever they want to be called.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:39     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Your daughter is now in the world of academia. This is how academia works: You err on the side of respect until you are invited into a more informal relationship.

Don't like it? You don't have to stay in academia.

I have a master's degree and have worked as an administrative staff member at four universities and a law school. This is how academia is. Now you know, too.


What exactly is disrespectful about using someone's first name?


Really??? In high school the kids refer to teachers as Ms. or Mr. When I was in college and I met my friends' parents it was Ms. or Mr. Why in heaven's name would your DD decide to call her professors by their first names? Also, I think certain boundaries should be maintained between professor and student, and using Professor or Dr. helps to maintain that.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:38     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:The sad part is that OP and her DD have to live in the world they actually live in, and deal with any consequences thereof, not the world they want to live in.

Sucks not to always be on top. Sucks to try so hard to insult someone, when they don't really care that much -- and yet still are going to pass judgement on you, because that is their job.

Oh, well. Maybe OP feels better for ranting here. One can only hope. It's a small enough gift.


Consequence for an adult addressing another adult by their first name? It's not like OP said her daughter uses "Hey cat lady" or "Yo" to greet professors. What's wrong with "Hi Ryan" or "Hi Suzy"? It's completely normal and okay.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:38     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.


+1. Campus isn't British aristocracy. And lets not even get into the historic inequities that prevented people of color, the poor, and women from having access to earn certain credentials. As long as you're polite, there's nothing wrong with using people's first name. It's lunacy that would send anyone off the edge. Go see a shrink if it does. Your credentials earn you a higher salary and more prestigious jobs, not perpetual servitude.


Especially for an advisor. They're not profs. I'd tell the advisor to kiss my ass.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:37     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.


+1. Campus isn't British aristocracy. And lets not even get into the historic inequities that prevented people of color, the poor, and women from having access to earn certain credentials. As long as you're polite, there's nothing wrong with using people's first name. It's lunacy that would send anyone off the edge. Go see a shrink if it does. Your credentials earn you a higher salary and more prestigious jobs, not perpetual servitude.


Why do you consider using "Dr.,""Professor,""Mr.,""Ms.," etc, to be perpetual servitude?
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:35     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.


+1. Campus isn't British aristocracy. And lets not even get into the historic inequities that prevented people of color, the poor, and women from having access to earn certain credentials. As long as you're polite, there's nothing wrong with using people's first name. It's lunacy that would send anyone off the edge. Go see a shrink if it does. Your credentials earn you a higher salary and more prestigious jobs, not perpetual servitude.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:33     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Let's say for the sake of argument, the daughter is correct that most profs are fine with first name - that doesn't make those who aren't "rude" or "obnoxious jerks" or hacks insisting on bootlicking as others have suggested.

They have a different preference, they let it be known, and it should be respected.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:31     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
Anonymous wrote:This thread is funny to me because my freshman daughter has asked my advice navigating this issue especially with emails to profs. (Go ahead and flame me for her lack of independence.)

FWIW it seems that about 50% of the time professors invite the students to call them by their first name. It seems to be more often in smaller seminar classes. One even said "Feel free to call me Ryan but I know most of you won't" Indicating that many freshman feel uncomfortable with this informality.

What I have suggested is default to formality unless expressly invited otherwise. I thought OP's daughter's take on emails was strange - how does she know informal is OK? Did profs say, "don't bother being formal" - I doubt that. Or just because she received no complaints until the advisor she assumed it was OK.


+1 And I have a feeling that the first name usage was not the only thing overly familiar/inappropriate about the daughter's emails.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:31     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
College teachers tell students how to address them but students too busy texting to notice.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:27     Subject: How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
This thread is funny to me because my freshman daughter has asked my advice navigating this issue especially with emails to profs. (Go ahead and flame me for her lack of independence.)

FWIW it seems that about 50% of the time professors invite the students to call them by their first name. It seems to be more often in smaller seminar classes. One even said "Feel free to call me Ryan but I know most of you won't" Indicating that many freshman feel uncomfortable with this informality.

What I have suggested is default to formality unless expressly invited otherwise. I thought OP's daughter's take on emails was strange - how does she know informal is OK? Did profs say, "don't bother being formal" - I doubt that. Or just because she received no complaints until the advisor she assumed it was OK.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2019 15:26     Subject: Re:How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction
I am a happy confident professor. No student calls me by my first name, ever. If someone does do it, I would raise my eyebrow so high it would fall off my face. Most still say professor after they graduate.

Some southern students say dr., everywhere else it's professor.