Anonymous
03/24/2016 10:26
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Anonymous wrote:Low expectations when?
Low overall expectations might be soft bigotry but low expectations for a 115 suddenly put in a class of 130s, not so much.
One way to see the kids going into the Blair magnet is that they are on 3 different levels after 8th grade. The group that only had Algebra I, the group that had Geometry and the group that had Algebra II.
Does anyone know how they pick the Algebra I group and how they do in 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th grade?
When or do they ever catch up?
Low expectations when you say that the kids would surely do better being big fish in a little pond because there's no way they can handle the big pond.
Anonymous
03/24/2016 10:17
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Low expectations when?
Low overall expectations might be soft bigotry but low expectations for a 115 suddenly put in a class of 130s, not so much.
One way to see the kids going into the Blair magnet is that they are on 3 different levels after 8th grade. The group that only had Algebra I, the group that had Geometry and the group that had Algebra II.
Does anyone know how they pick the Algebra I group and how they do in 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th grade?
When or do they ever catch up?
Low overall expectations might be soft bigotry but low expectations for a 115 suddenly put in a class of 130s, not so much.
One way to see the kids going into the Blair magnet is that they are on 3 different levels after 8th grade. The group that only had Algebra I, the group that had Geometry and the group that had Algebra II.
Does anyone know how they pick the Algebra I group and how they do in 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th grade?
When or do they ever catch up?
Anonymous
03/24/2016 09:07
Subject: Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Well, there's the soft bigotry of low expectations (to quote somebody I don't usually quote).
Anonymous
03/24/2016 09:00
Subject: Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
What makes you angry? What makes you feel racist? And why does it make you feel racist?
Makes me angry that they would even remotely consider getting rid of these programs or changing them to admit a less qualified but more racially diverse set of students.
There seems to be an implication that the current system is racist. So if I support the current system I am racist.
There are many reasons these programs are not racially diverse. Nothing will be solved by gutting these programs. Kids that truly need these programs and are thriving in them will be the ones hurt in the process.
Many southern states have used different criteria for disadvantaged children of all races. In the city where I used to work, children from homes viewed as "at risk" needed to score at WISC Full Scale Score of 115 (or either a Verbal or Nonverbal score of 130), while children from homes viewed as not at risk, needed a Full Scale Score of 130 to qualify. We felt that if a child could come from the local public housing community and a limited educational background yet earn a Full Scale Score of 115 (without all the prepping that many DCUM posters say they do), then that child deserved a spot.
How do they know who comes from an "at risk" home? If the kid qualifies for "FARMS"?
I don't doubt that there are kids who are bright in lower income families (I was one), but if you admit kids with lower scores, and overall lower academic achievement, doesn't that risk having to either lower the bar in the classroom or the kids won't be able to keep up.
This is kind of what they found with lower income college kids from middle-of-nowhere towns. When they get to the elite colleges, they can't keep up because the level of expectation between their HS (though they did very well) and an elite college is miles apart.
If these kids don't do as well as other kids in the home ES (meaning that they get lower scores), then without lowering the bar in the magnet classrooms, some of these kids will struggle all throughout. I am not normally a parent that worries that much about a kid's self esteem, but in this case, I would be concerned that many of such kids are URM, already have that perceived stigma against them, and then they can't keep up with the rigors of a magnet. That just fuels a stereotype, and batters their self confidence.
I would think it's better for such kids to stay in their home schools and shine, be the big fish in the little pond, so to speak. I actually feel that way about one of my DCs who I don't think will make it to the magnet.
Anonymous
03/24/2016 08:54
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Anonymous wrote:"Many southern states have used different criteria for disadvantaged children of all races. In the city where I used to work, children from homes viewed as "at risk" needed to score at WISC Full Scale Score of 115 (or either a Verbal or Nonverbal score of 130), while children from homes viewed as not at risk, needed a Full Scale Score of 130 to qualify. We felt that if a child could come from the local public housing community and a limited educational background yet earn a Full Scale Score of 115 (without all the prepping that many DCUM posters say they do), then that child deserved a spot. "
It would really be interesting to see how they define "at risk". If people are willing to PREP, would they be willing to live in a worse neighborhood? Get divorced?
Now that's an entertaining idea. Are people so devoted to their child's education that they're willing to reduce their household income to FARMS eligibility levels?
Anonymous
03/24/2016 08:51
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
"Many southern states have used different criteria for disadvantaged children of all races. In the city where I used to work, children from homes viewed as "at risk" needed to score at WISC Full Scale Score of 115 (or either a Verbal or Nonverbal score of 130), while children from homes viewed as not at risk, needed a Full Scale Score of 130 to qualify. We felt that if a child could come from the local public housing community and a limited educational background yet earn a Full Scale Score of 115 (without all the prepping that many DCUM posters say they do), then that child deserved a spot. "
It would really be interesting to see how they define "at risk". If people are willing to PREP, would they be willing to live in a worse neighborhood? Get divorced?
It would really be interesting to see how they define "at risk". If people are willing to PREP, would they be willing to live in a worse neighborhood? Get divorced?
Anonymous
03/24/2016 08:48
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Anonymous wrote:Your kids will be fine
If you think special programs are what's right for them more power to you
What gets me is what were people doing even say less than 20 years ago when none of these options existed and kids gasp turned out fine
All these special snowflake issues today lol
HS magnets were there 20 years ago (Blair SMAC, RM/IB, and PHS's GE program) but I don't think that was your point...
A lot has changed and continues to change since then. One of the biggest mistakes parents can make is taking "...when I was in elementary (MS, HS, or even College)..."
Anonymous
03/24/2016 08:05
Subject: Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
At my kid's school, 14-15 kids took the test and 4 kids were invited to the HGC. That suggests a good-sized group of very bright, motivated kids will remain at the home school. And, in this case, there will still be three classes and each will be a little smaller.
Anonymous
03/24/2016 07:45
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
I hardly think taking an average of 5 kids out of a given school negatively affects anything.
When the HGC kids left, that did negatively affect the remaining kids at my kid's school.
How were the remaining kids negatively impacted? I am sure the HGC kids were not teaching the class!
For my first kid, just enough kids left for the HGC that the school lost a teacher position for the grade, so class size for the remaining kids went way up.
For my second kid, in third grade, there was a good-sized advanced group, made up of kids who ended up at the HGC plus kids who didn't get into the HGC. In fourth grade, the advanced group was much smaller. Basically the non-HGC advanced kids were left stranded.
Is this typical or common? I have no idea. It was real for the kids at my kids' school, though.
Anonymous
03/24/2016 06:15
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Your kids will be fine
If you think special programs are what's right for them more power to you
What gets me is what were people doing even say less than 20 years ago when none of these options existed and kids gasp turned out fine
All these special snowflake issues today lol
If you think special programs are what's right for them more power to you
What gets me is what were people doing even say less than 20 years ago when none of these options existed and kids gasp turned out fine
All these special snowflake issues today lol
Anonymous
03/23/2016 23:07
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Anonymous wrote:You seem legit good for you
Start off with some common definitions on what a magnet is
From my understanding a magnet is a way for an advanced student to go and pursue advanced studies outside of their home school. At the other school they are surrounded by other magnet kids and not mixed with the normal kids
I'll lump AAP and G&T in there as well
What does this do
Cause an insane amount of test prep by fearful parents looking for some college goldent tickets for their kid to qualify instead of having you know the kids who are actually interested in the subject matter attedn
Causes the local school to lose a star student and family which has a negative effect on the people left behind
Causes additional financial costs and time sinks due to buses and longer commutes for the student
I don't see a benefit for the host school. If anything it causes attention and resources to be diverted from the neighborhood kids and to the magnet kids
What I think should happen
Noone goes anywhere
Starting in kindergarden you group kids by low medium and high for reading and math (most teachers can do this the ones that can't should be gone) for the majority of the day all of the kids are together. Stop doing this crazy pulling people out to do coursework two and three grades ahead.
Starting in middle school you groups kids by ability level for all of their classes
In high school you have regular honors and AP. At every public high school there is at least one section of all AP high performing kids
You get rid of the crazy notion of taking Algebra before eighth grade. I mean really you have sophomores taking Calculus why???? what are they going to take in college
Most importantly you challenge kids wherever they are
Now for the actual geniuses out there. They should probably be skipping grades or maybe even high school altogether but you are talking about the top .01%. I am estimating maybe 50 kids for each graduating class in the whole county.
Just some thoughts
You have no idea what you are talking about. You also have no idea about special needs kids. I have 2 kids who are not "normal". Both in magnets not because I am crazy person or obsessed with "golden" tickets , but because this is the only place where they can fit. One of my children is actually taking Algebra in 6th grade, but that child is not taking foreign language or advance writing, since that child is not genius but that strange kids who is only wired for technical subjects. That kids is terrible with regular subjects, so no way to skip grades. On top of everything if you will speak with physiologists they will tell you that many so called "advanced" kids are socially immature, and 2-3 years behind their classmates in social skills.
If my children will stay with regular kids, they would be bullied and have no friends. In magnets they have few friends and some understanding from the rest of the kids that everyone is different...
These magnets were partially created for kids who cannot be taken care by regular schools. We live in very good school district, but if my kids would not be in magnet, I would have no other choice but to homeschool my kids. There are no even private schools that can accommodate advanced technical kids who do not fit the mold...
It is extremely difficult to raise such kids. You are very lucky to have normal kids. Believe me, you do not want to be in my shoes.
Anonymous
03/23/2016 22:51
Subject: Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Full disclosure: I'm a huge proponent of the magnets. I've got two kids in them and they have been a true necessity for both of them both socially and academically. Home elementary was a disaster for them and without magnets, we would have switched to private long ago.
When my oldest was applying to Takoma, there were two kids, one AA and one Latino, who were and are smart and hard workers. It stunned us that neither got into the middle school magnets. Both did apply. I've followed one of them through middle school and he is still an all A student who is highly motivated.
It seems to me that in researching and studying this issue, the county can look for some sampling of these kids and dig deeper into what is holding this set of kids out of the magnet.
Agree with others that economic status is a key indicator of academic preparation. Will say that one of these kids was a recent immigrant child with a supportive family. The other was higher SES.
When my oldest was applying to Takoma, there were two kids, one AA and one Latino, who were and are smart and hard workers. It stunned us that neither got into the middle school magnets. Both did apply. I've followed one of them through middle school and he is still an all A student who is highly motivated.
It seems to me that in researching and studying this issue, the county can look for some sampling of these kids and dig deeper into what is holding this set of kids out of the magnet.
Agree with others that economic status is a key indicator of academic preparation. Will say that one of these kids was a recent immigrant child with a supportive family. The other was higher SES.
Anonymous
03/23/2016 22:29
Subject: Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
What makes you angry? What makes you feel racist? And why does it make you feel racist?
Makes me angry that they would even remotely consider getting rid of these programs or changing them to admit a less qualified but more racially diverse set of students.
There seems to be an implication that the current system is racist. So if I support the current system I am racist.
There are many reasons these programs are not racially diverse. Nothing will be solved by gutting these programs. Kids that truly need these programs and are thriving in them will be the ones hurt in the process.
Many southern states have used different criteria for disadvantaged children of all races. In the city where I used to work, children from homes viewed as "at risk" needed to score at WISC Full Scale Score of 115 (or either a Verbal or Nonverbal score of 130), while children from homes viewed as not at risk, needed a Full Scale Score of 130 to qualify. We felt that if a child could come from the local public housing community and a limited educational background yet earn a Full Scale Score of 115 (without all the prepping that many DCUM posters say they do), then that child deserved a spot.
Anonymous
03/23/2016 22:21
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
I hardly think taking an average of 5 kids out of a given school negatively affects anything.
When the HGC kids left, that did negatively affect the remaining kids at my kid's school.
How were the remaining kids negatively impacted? I am sure the HGC kids were not teaching the class!
Anonymous
03/23/2016 20:06
Subject: Re:Another article about the magnet programs in Washington Post
You seem legit good for you
Start off with some common definitions on what a magnet is
From my understanding a magnet is a way for an advanced student to go and pursue advanced studies outside of their home school. At the other school they are surrounded by other magnet kids and not mixed with the normal kids
I'll lump AAP and G&T in there as well
What does this do
Cause an insane amount of test prep by fearful parents looking for some college goldent tickets for their kid to qualify instead of having you know the kids who are actually interested in the subject matter attedn
Causes the local school to lose a star student and family which has a negative effect on the people left behind
Causes additional financial costs and time sinks due to buses and longer commutes for the student
I don't see a benefit for the host school. If anything it causes attention and resources to be diverted from the neighborhood kids and to the magnet kids
What I think should happen
Noone goes anywhere
Starting in kindergarden you group kids by low medium and high for reading and math (most teachers can do this the ones that can't should be gone) for the majority of the day all of the kids are together. Stop doing this crazy pulling people out to do coursework two and three grades ahead.
Starting in middle school you groups kids by ability level for all of their classes
In high school you have regular honors and AP. At every public high school there is at least one section of all AP high performing kids
You get rid of the crazy notion of taking Algebra before eighth grade. I mean really you have sophomores taking Calculus why???? what are they going to take in college
Most importantly you challenge kids wherever they are
Now for the actual geniuses out there. They should probably be skipping grades or maybe even high school altogether but you are talking about the top .01%. I am estimating maybe 50 kids for each graduating class in the whole county.
Just some thoughts
Start off with some common definitions on what a magnet is
From my understanding a magnet is a way for an advanced student to go and pursue advanced studies outside of their home school. At the other school they are surrounded by other magnet kids and not mixed with the normal kids
I'll lump AAP and G&T in there as well
What does this do
Cause an insane amount of test prep by fearful parents looking for some college goldent tickets for their kid to qualify instead of having you know the kids who are actually interested in the subject matter attedn
Causes the local school to lose a star student and family which has a negative effect on the people left behind
Causes additional financial costs and time sinks due to buses and longer commutes for the student
I don't see a benefit for the host school. If anything it causes attention and resources to be diverted from the neighborhood kids and to the magnet kids
What I think should happen
Noone goes anywhere
Starting in kindergarden you group kids by low medium and high for reading and math (most teachers can do this the ones that can't should be gone) for the majority of the day all of the kids are together. Stop doing this crazy pulling people out to do coursework two and three grades ahead.
Starting in middle school you groups kids by ability level for all of their classes
In high school you have regular honors and AP. At every public high school there is at least one section of all AP high performing kids
You get rid of the crazy notion of taking Algebra before eighth grade. I mean really you have sophomores taking Calculus why???? what are they going to take in college
Most importantly you challenge kids wherever they are
Now for the actual geniuses out there. They should probably be skipping grades or maybe even high school altogether but you are talking about the top .01%. I am estimating maybe 50 kids for each graduating class in the whole county.
Just some thoughts