Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:43
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
But I don't think people are as worried about the destination as they are about the journey. Are there any major roads or busy intersections nearby?
Do you think that a six-year-old and a ten-year-old are inherently incapable of crossing a major road by themselves, or do you think it depends on the specific six-year-old and ten-year-old and the specific major road?
Studies suggest this is not until about 8 years old to be reliable.
Which studies?
Here's one for starters - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3256780/
6 years olds 11 times more likely to make unsafe judgments than 10 year olds.
But that doesn't mean that every six-year-old will make an unsafe judgment, or that every 10-year-old will make a safer judgment than every six-year-old.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:42
Subject: Re:Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Which park were the children in when the police picked them up this time? I apologize if this is buried somewhere in the thread.
I believe it was Bullis Park but not sure.
The Post article says Fenton & Easley.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:42
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
But I don't think people are as worried about the destination as they are about the journey. Are there any major roads or busy intersections nearby?
Do you think that a six-year-old and a ten-year-old are inherently incapable of crossing a major road by themselves, or do you think it depends on the specific six-year-old and ten-year-old and the specific major road?
Studies suggest this is not until about 8 years old to be reliable.
Which studies?
If you google Blair High School walk project, their brilliant students did a "walk safe" campaign that showed that crossing the street at a young age is dangerous and leads to fatalities and injury.
Crossing the street at any age is dangerous and leads to fatalities and injuries. We could reduce the number of pedestrian fatalities to zero if only people didn't insist on walking places, instead of driving in a car as nature intended.
Are there any studies that show that no 6-year-old is capable of crossing the street safely?
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:41
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:39
Subject: Re:Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Which park were the children in when the police picked them up this time? I apologize if this is buried somewhere in the thread.
I believe it was Bullis Park but not sure.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:39
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
The traffic corridor where these kids were walking has been identifed as "high risk" by the county: http://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/dot-pedsafety/resources/files/prsa_reports/colesville_fenton_prsa_public-10-23-12-final.pdf
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:39
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
But I don't think people are as worried about the destination as they are about the journey. Are there any major roads or busy intersections nearby?
Do you think that a six-year-old and a ten-year-old are inherently incapable of crossing a major road by themselves, or do you think it depends on the specific six-year-old and ten-year-old and the specific major road?
Studies suggest this is not until about 8 years old to be reliable.
Which studies?
Here's one for starters - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3256780/
6 years olds 11 times more likely to make unsafe judgments than 10 year olds.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:38
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
But I don't think people are as worried about the destination as they are about the journey. Are there any major roads or busy intersections nearby?
Do you think that a six-year-old and a ten-year-old are inherently incapable of crossing a major road by themselves, or do you think it depends on the specific six-year-old and ten-year-old and the specific major road?
Studies suggest this is not until about 8 years old to be reliable.
Which studies?
If you google Blair High School walk project, their brilliant students did a "walk safe" campaign that showed that crossing the street at a young age is dangerous and leads to fatalities and injury.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:37
Subject: Re:Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Which park were the children in when the police picked them up this time? I apologize if this is buried somewhere in the thread.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:37
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Downtown Silver Spring has some very busy streets, and a few pedestrian fatalities in the past few years. Sometimes kids don't pay enough attention or take stupid risks because they don't truly understand they could get hit by a car or whatever. A good number of adults and teens run across Colesville, Georgia, etc. against the light. If you're not paying attention, that serves as a cue that it's your turn to cross too.
Yep - not to mention that the Downtown Silver Spring outdoor mall area, with was just 2-3 blocks away from the park these kids were picked up in, has been the site of epic gang battles in the recent past -- http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/concerns-about-silver-spring-spur-consideration-of-curfew/2011/07/26/gIQAXiYobI_story.html. I think a lot of the people supporting these parents don't quite have a sense of the geography and situation here. We're not talking about some quiet suburban neighborhood filled with kids and SAHMs. It's a major, traffic-filled urban center full of strangers.
And I say this as one who also had one of those 70s/80s free range childhoods and benefitted from it, and am sad that my kid won't get the same thing. But hanging out in a park in the late afternoon as a 6 and 10 year old in Downtown Silver Spring is a FAR cry from my free range childhood, which took place in practically car-free cul de sac with dozens of kids out at any one time, and neighborhood parents who knew all of us.
The page you link to doesn't work.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/co...1/07/26/gIQAXiYobI_story.html
The incident referenced in the article started at 10:30 pm on a Friday night. If there are 10- and 6-year-old kids out in a park then, CPS is free to take them away.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:36
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
I was going to say something similar. Lots of people are running with this story saying "but I let my kids go to the park all the time and it's fine." If you're not familiar with this particular area, it doesn't mean much. There really are some awful intersections and it's not an overblown fear of child abduction that has some people saying it's not wise to let these kids wander this particular area unsupervised. I have no opinion as to whether CPS has overstepped the line, but can we stop pretending that this is just big government vs. sensible parents. There are legitimate threats to a child's safety in that area and pretending that this is just a case of nosy neighbors turning in parents who let their kids go to the park unsupervised misses the point. If we didn't have so many danagerous drivers in the area maybe these kids could have more freedom. But welcome to Silver
I'm familiar with this particular area. The "awful" intersections have wide sidewalks, clearly marked crosswalks, lots and lots of pedestrians, pedestrian signals, and low-speed (25-30 mph) roads. Are the intersections as safe as they could be? Absolutely not. Do you take your life into your hands when you cross Colesville Road and Georgia Avenue? Nope.
I've seen some really scary near-misses at the intersection of Wayne and Georgia. Is that one of the intersections we're talking about? There's a lot of confusion between drivers and pedestrians about who has the right of way. I've also heard the "pedestrian down" reports for that intersection more than once during my morning commute. This is an intersection where pedestrians have to be prepared for the driver to break the rules and react quickly if that happens. That's why having an adult present is a no-brainer. But maybe I'm not thinking of the right area?
A good number of drivers run lights, especially while turning that endangers pedestrians when they have walk signals in that area. A lot of drivers speed around there too.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:36
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Yep - not to mention that the Downtown Silver Spring outdoor mall area, with was just 2-3 blocks away from the park these kids were picked up in, has been the site of epic gang battles in the recent past -- http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/concerns-about-silver-spring-spur-consideration-of-curfew/2011/07/26/gIQAXiYobI_story.html. I think a lot of the people supporting these parents don't quite have a sense of the geography and situation here. We're not talking about some quiet suburban neighborhood filled with kids and SAHMs. It's a major, traffic-filled urban center full of strangers.
And I say this as one who also had one of those 70s/80s free range childhoods and benefitted from it, and am sad that my kid won't get the same thing. But hanging out in a park in the late afternoon as a 6 and 10 year old in Downtown Silver Spring is a FAR cry from my free range childhood, which took place in practically car-free cul de sac with dozens of kids out at any one time, and neighborhood parents who knew all of us.
Epic gang battles on a lovely weekend afternoon? Really?
I'm also impressed by the assumption that Downtown Silver Spring is practically Manhattan. Not to mention that kids actually do routinely walk around the real actual Manhattan without getting taken into custody by CPS.
JaJaJaJa
You actually compared SS to Manhattan.
Downtown Silver Spring is probably actually less safe than some areas of Manhattan.
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:36
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
It's a well-known gang area. THAT is why CPS was probably concerned. Are you so naive to think that this is only an issue during the night?
"Gang experts say commercial hubs, like Downtown Silver Spring, Gallery Place in D.C. and Metro stations across the region have become meeting areas for gangs."
Read more: http://www.wjla.com/articles/2012/09/gang-prevention-conference-held-in-silver-spring-80290.html#ixzz3XCRLHHW7
Really, you're going to let your six year old play alone in a park three blocks from a well-known "meeting area for gangs"? And if the parents did not know this, that is further evidence of their lack of discretion and judgment. If they are so dead set on being free range parents, then they need to do it in a place that make sense. Not downtown Silver Spring.
Gosh, I was walking around there just the other day, and it looked like such a nice, pleasant area. Little did I know how narrowly I escaped being gunned down by a stray bullet!
Right, shows what you actually don't know.
You guys are like the Silver Spring anti-chamber of commerce.
Gangs at metro stations across the region? So avoid Metro?
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:35
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Downtown Silver Spring has some very busy streets, and a few pedestrian fatalities in the past few years. Sometimes kids don't pay enough attention or take stupid risks because they don't truly understand they could get hit by a car or whatever. A good number of adults and teens run across Colesville, Georgia, etc. against the light. If you're not paying attention, that serves as a cue that it's your turn to cross too.
Yep - not to mention that the Downtown Silver Spring outdoor mall area, with was just 2-3 blocks away from the park these kids were picked up in, has been the site of epic gang battles in the recent past -- http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/concerns-about-silver-spring-spur-consideration-of-curfew/2011/07/26/gIQAXiYobI_story.html. I think a lot of the people supporting these parents don't quite have a sense of the geography and situation here. We're not talking about some quiet suburban neighborhood filled with kids and SAHMs. It's a major, traffic-filled urban center full of strangers.
And I say this as one who also had one of those 70s/80s free range childhoods and benefitted from it, and am sad that my kid won't get the same thing. But hanging out in a park in the late afternoon as a 6 and 10 year old in Downtown Silver Spring is a FAR cry from my free range childhood, which took place in practically car-free cul de sac with dozens of kids out at any one time, and neighborhood parents who knew all of us.
The page you link to doesn't work.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/co...1/07/26/gIQAXiYobI_story.html
Thanks. I would point out that the story is from nearly 4 years ago, and the area has changed quite a bit during that time. No one now would say "downtown Silver Spring is on the brink of failing."
Are you by any chance the former Silver Spring resident who moved to Olney?
Anonymous
04/13/2015 10:34
Subject: Free-range kids picked up AGAIN by police
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I'd be willing to bet it's the parents themselves who call. Their cause - and their 15 minutes of fame - seems to be their highest priority.
We don't live too far from there, and I see kids at parks all the time without parents hovering over them. Go to Candy Cane City or Norwood Park near downtown Bethesda - there are tons of parents w/little kids, but also plenty of bigger kids on their own. I live on a very busy street in Chevy Chase and lots of kids roam about on foot or on bike without parental supervision. Dozens of kids walk back and forth to school every day without parents. Never once seen any concern or pushback or police involvement.
So why do these 2 kids keep attracting so much attention? Either the parents leave them alone for an unreasonable amount of time (all day at the park on their own?) or they are doing something that prompts concern by strangers.
The point is, the police and CPS aren't conspiring to force all parents to be helicopter parents. But somehow there seems to be some repeated concerns about this particular family. Maybe, just maybe it's actually justified?
I completely agree. There is something else going on here. The fact that so many other kids are doing just this and not getting picked up means there is more to the story that we don't know.
or they are calling CPS themselves. Lunatics!