Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Carolyn was a very pretty woman but I never understood the hype behind her personal style.

I did. She looked like someone who was effortlessly beautiful. A total it girl. Granted, I was 10 years old when she passed away so I’m sure what appeared effortless to me actually required a lot of maintenance.

Except her face was far from beautiful. I’m actually shocked JFK jr dated her.

I think she was very striking. Gorgeous eyes, hair, and figure.

Anonymous wrote:They were ridiculously beautiful and charismatic, but I can't believe anyone is romanticizing their relationship. She was his sidepiece while he had an official GF for years, and she was completely miserable within a year of the marriage. They both cheated. I mean, ick.

Who cares if they cheated? They were the “it” couple. Beautiful, charismatic, dashing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Carolyn was a very pretty woman but I never understood the hype behind her personal style.

I did. She looked like someone who was effortlessly beautiful. A total it girl. Granted, I was 10 years old when she passed away so I’m sure what appeared effortless to me actually required a lot of maintenance.

Except her face was far from beautiful. I’m actually shocked JFK jr dated her.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Was Naomi Watts going for a parody of Jackie O? She gave one of the worst performances I’ve seen. I wanted to fast forward all the scenes with her as she was so awful. Meryl’s daughter is a plank of wood as well.

She’s just playing Babe Paley all over again

Agreed that this just feels like her Babe Paley performance but with Jackie's voice layered on top. I actually thought she was good as Babe Paley. But that performance felt more natural because she was focused on just playing the scenes -- responding to the other actors and expressing emotion in a natural way though her physical embodiment of Babe.

But in these scenes with Jackie, her performance feels totally divorced from what anyone else is doing. She's just "doing Jackie" and it's like her mannerisms and vocal tics are planned out in advance independent of what is happening in the scene.

It probably doesn't help that in Swans, Watts was doing most of her scenes with similarly experienced actresses turning in mostly strong performances. And in this show, almost all of her scenes are with a kind of novice actor playing John. The one scene she had with just Grace Gummer where they talk about John's relationship issues and then also how Jackie responded to Ed Schlossberger and then later accepted him into the family, was probably the best Jackie scene in the show. Gummer is not a virtuoso like her mom, but my sense is she's just a better scene partner and was probably giving Watts more to work with, so that scene felt more natural and real.

Anonymous wrote:Was Naomi Watts going for a parody of Jackie O? She gave one of the worst performances I’ve seen. I wanted to fast forward all the scenes with her as she was so awful. Meryl’s daughter is a plank of wood as well.

She’s just playing Babe Paley all over again

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone else feel like the actor playing JFK jr is not doing a great job portraying him?

He comes across as too meek and nice. Whereas interviews I have seen of JFK jr show him as being really confident and slightly cocky.

Agree. He is not capturing his essence. The actors who I think did a great job are the people playing-
Ethel
Daryl Hannah
Caroline

The actors playing John and Carolyn missed it. And Naomi Watts did the worst job.

Agreed. JFK jr was anything but meek. He was super confident and cocky with a hint of mischief

I wouldn't describe this portrayal as meek. I think they are trying to recast his worst behavior in a positive light, which in some cases doesn't make sense. To me the biggest issue is that they are working hard to portray his entitlement and lack of accountability as him just being a little oblivious or almost childlike. I'm sure some of it was that, and I do think he had an issue with arrested development (which is not uncommon for someone who loses a parent so young).

But he was also deeply entitled. He was the youngest child in a very wealthy and famous family, and his older sibling was hyper-competent and independent. John got mothered by multiple women (not just Jackie and Caroline but also his nanny Maud Shaw and, from a more distant angle, Rose and Ethel). But people let him off the hook constantly because they felt bad for him, and the result was that he grew up very full of himself and convinced he could do no wrong. It was a form of narcissism and all of his worst behavior, including his rampant cheating, is part of that.

But on the show they seem to just want to portray him as sort of dumb? When he does stuff that is very selfish almost to the point of cruelty (like the way he introduces Carolyn to his sister and BIL, or to Ethel and the rest of the family) the show acts like he's just too oblivious to realize he should be more thoughtful, and skips over the fact that part of his personality was to just do whatever he wanted in the moment and assume everyone around him will adjust and make it okay for him. And people enable him, including Carolyn, because he is handsome and rich and famous and also because people never really forget in the back of their heads that he suffered a great tragedy. The show is told from the perspective of an enabler because it's more interested in portraying the tragedy of his death than in really giving an accurate portrayal of his life.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not denying that he wasn't a perfect high school student, but he chose Brown in part because his cousin Kerry had gone to college there and really loved it.

That's the cover story to try to cover that even for a Kennedy he wasn't very bright.

Had he wanted to go to Harvard, not being very bright would not have stopped him. They would have happily admitted JFK's not very bright son. In a heartbeat.

If he had the self-awareness to realize that he might not fit in well at Harvard specifically because he's just not that academic of a person, good for him. I see how Brown was a better fit for his personality and the professional goals he wound up pursuing. Also by the time he went to college, his corner of the family was always leaning way more towards the arts and humanities (as opposed to law and politics) and Brown has more of a rep in those areas. His mom was a book editor, his sister a writer who married and artist. His aunt Lee was in fashion and interior design. His cousin Anthony (Lee's son, who he was close to), made films. These were rich people enjoying their lives by pursuing artistic passions, and Brown is a better fit for someone like that.

I think he got pushed into law by his dad's end of the family, and by the weight of his dad's and uncle's legacy. I don't think he actually wanted to go to law school or be a lawyer, but people viewed his acting ambitions as a joke and there was immense pressure on him to carry on a legacy. I think way less from his mom and sister (who just wanted him to get his act together) than from the rest of the Kennedy clan.

No - Jackie wanted him to be a lawyer. Jackie also kept him and Caroline away from some of the more problematic Kennedy cousins like RFK's brood.

Sorry, not to pick, but as Catholics, the Kennedy family would have made the Sign of the Cross both before and after the dinner prayer.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone else feel like the actor playing JFK jr is not doing a great job portraying him?

He comes across as too meek and nice. Whereas interviews I have seen of JFK jr show him as being really confident and slightly cocky.

Agree. He is not capturing his essence. The actors who I think did a great job are the people playing-
Ethel
Daryl Hannah
Caroline

The actors playing John and Carolyn missed it. And Naomi Watts did the worst job.

Agreed. JFK jr was anything but meek. He was super confident and cocky with a hint of mischief

They were ridiculously beautiful and charismatic, but I can't believe anyone is romanticizing their relationship. She was his sidepiece while he had an official GF for years, and she was completely miserable within a year of the marriage. They both cheated. I mean, ick.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not denying that he wasn't a perfect high school student, but he chose Brown in part because his cousin Kerry had gone to college there and really loved it.

That's the cover story to try to cover that even for a Kennedy he wasn't very bright.

Had he wanted to go to Harvard, not being very bright would not have stopped him. They would have happily admitted JFK's not very bright son. In a heartbeat.

If he had the self-awareness to realize that he might not fit in well at Harvard specifically because he's just not that academic of a person, good for him. I see how Brown was a better fit for his personality and the professional goals he wound up pursuing. Also by the time he went to college, his corner of the family was always leaning way more towards the arts and humanities (as opposed to law and politics) and Brown has more of a rep in those areas. His mom was a book editor, his sister a writer who married and artist. His aunt Lee was in fashion and interior design. His cousin Anthony (Lee's son, who he was close to), made films. These were rich people enjoying their lives by pursuing artistic passions, and Brown is a better fit for someone like that.

I think he got pushed into law by his dad's end of the family, and by the weight of his dad's and uncle's legacy. I don't think he actually wanted to go to law school or be a lawyer, but people viewed his acting ambitions as a joke and there was immense pressure on him to carry on a legacy. I think way less from his mom and sister (who just wanted him to get his act together) than from the rest of the Kennedy clan.

Anonymous wrote:I am not denying that he wasn't a perfect high school student, but he chose Brown in part because his cousin Kerry had gone to college there and really loved it.

That's the cover story to try to cover that even for a Kennedy he wasn't very bright.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My understanding is that she was extremely late to the airstrip because she spent a couple of hours at the nail salon having the paint color redone several times to match her outfit for the rehearsal dinner.
By the time she finally arrived, it was dark already. They should have just skipped the dinner and waited until the next day to fly to the wedding but he thought they could still arrive in time for dinner even though he had not yet achieved the level of flying by instrument panel. There is no horizon in the darkness. They probably had no idea that they were heading into the water.
Both parties were daft. This is why his mother prohibited him from pursuing flying small aircrafts while she was alive. She understood something about his lack of judgement.

I don’t ever think I’ve seen a photo of her even wearing any nail polish (she barely wore recognizable make up). She certainly wouldn’t be getting matchy-matchy manicure with her dress color. Come on. Do you believe everything you read?

I’m pretty skeptical of her, but yeah this sounds like something a middle-aged man would make up.

Also *#{*% was Jr really not instrument-rated??!?

He promised CBK that his instructor would be on that flight, and I guess the instructor didn't show up, and somehow he talked CBK into getting on the plane against her judgment. She repeatedly refused to fly with him because he was careless and she knew it. This was an exception for a wedding. He was just so entitled that he believed rules didn't apply to him, including flight rules.

Typical Kennedy. I don't know why do many people put them on a pedestal.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Was Naomi Watts going for a parody of Jackie O? She gave one of the worst performances I’ve seen. I wanted to fast forward all the scenes with her as she was so awful. Meryl’s daughter is a plank of wood as well.

People are criticizing Naomi's performance because it comes off as weird, but Jackie really was that stilted and affected. Go watch the Jackie O White House tour. Naomi is doing a slightly less affected version of that, which makes sense, since she probably wouldn't be that stiff in private. But she had that very affected accent and breathy voice.

Yes, we all know. Regardless, Watts was terribly miscast. Not every actor can play a character. Her Jackie was nothing like Jackie O - her physicality was so different, her face, her movement, even her version of “breathy” wasn’t accurate. It was a big miss. Since she is only in the early episodes, it doesn’t sink the show.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If I hear one more, "John was the epitome of 1990's NY, I am going to scream". We know nothing about the inner workings of these two except what someone at work or who met them at a gala said. Yes, he was unusually good looking and from a famous family, but was he any smarter or kinder than an anonymous guy sitting in a cube at EY?

Wasn't he kind of a himbo?

So many of the Kennedys had gone to Harvard. With his fame & connections, at the time it was surprising, but not alarming, that he ended up at Brown.

But in light of his subsequent performance (going to NYU law instead of an Ivy, twice failing the bar exam, foolishly flying in bad weather), the fact that he went to Brown should have been a red flag on his intelligence.

Yeah, yeah, yeah I know Brown & NYU law are wonderful, but we’re talking about a national, historical, & romantic icon here…who you’d think could have gone wherever he wanted, like his sister did.

DP. Pedantic lawyer NYU is a good law school and better than some “Ivy” law schools like Cornell Law. Also a lot of the Kennedy men went to non-Ivy law schools. I think RFK and RFK jr both went to UVA for law school for example.