Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women make more hours to make the same salaries as men. With same skill set. This is already proved to be true in the US and confirmed by multiple research. Thus, if she’s earning less plus also has to pull off all the household work she ends up doing 2 work shifts vs husband . Until men and women are absolutely equalized on corporate ladder there may be no equality in marriage.

Not sure how it’s even hard to understand!

Precisely.

The people who don't understand are SAHMs who have no idea how hard it is to work AND be the primary parent. They have a cushy existence compared to most WOHMs.

I’m a single dad who works and is the primary parent and the alleged difficulty of this is vastly exaggerated.

Because you probably suck as a dad compared to what single/working moms are doing. Sorry.

Signed,

SAHM with a cushy existence

I dated single dads with 2-3 kids who are actual, involved parents. They literally never have time for themselves or serious dating !

Right. They were better dads than the PP who thinks that moms are vastly exaggerating how hard it is to work full-time and be the primary parent.

Or maybe he's just a harder worker and not as used to complaining. Or maybe he doesn't see parenting as a hassle. Or maybe he's more efficient at accomplishing what needs to be done at work and home. Or maybe he doesn't spend a lot of time shopping for leggings and watching Tik Tok dances while "working" at his cushy middle management fed job.

Hmm, no, I think it's that he isn't as good of a dad as women who report their experience with the well-documented phenomenon of the difficulties of being a primary parent while working full-time.

“Well documented” = women who complained a lot on DCUM lol.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women make more hours to make the same salaries as men. With same skill set. This is already proved to be true in the US and confirmed by multiple research. Thus, if she’s earning less plus also has to pull off all the household work she ends up doing 2 work shifts vs husband . Until men and women are absolutely equalized on corporate ladder there may be no equality in marriage.

Not sure how it’s even hard to understand!

Precisely.

The people who don't understand are SAHMs who have no idea how hard it is to work AND be the primary parent. They have a cushy existence compared to most WOHMs.

I’m a single dad who works and is the primary parent and the alleged difficulty of this is vastly exaggerated.

Because you probably suck as a dad compared to what single/working moms are doing. Sorry.

Signed,

SAHM with a cushy existence

I dated single dads with 2-3 kids who are actual, involved parents. They literally never have time for themselves or serious dating !

I didn’t say I was dating.

Not as much “me time” as I’d like but I didn’t have a lot of it when I was married either so 🤷🏻

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women make more hours to make the same salaries as men. With same skill set. This is already proved to be true in the US and confirmed by multiple research. Thus, if she’s earning less plus also has to pull off all the household work she ends up doing 2 work shifts vs husband . Until men and women are absolutely equalized on corporate ladder there may be no equality in marriage.

Not sure how it’s even hard to understand!

Precisely.

The people who don't understand are SAHMs who have no idea how hard it is to work AND be the primary parent. They have a cushy existence compared to most WOHMs.

I’m a single dad who works and is the primary parent and the alleged difficulty of this is vastly exaggerated.

Because you probably suck as a dad compared to what single/working moms are doing. Sorry.

Signed,

SAHM with a cushy existence

Nope. My kids are healthy, getting straight As, doing travel sports and music, and have every need taken care of.

Actually, it’s YOU who sucks at parenting if it’s super-hard for you. Sorry.

I agree. I'm the rich one. I only married because I wanted children in wedlock.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It's not the lack of ambition, but often lack of skills and women having kids in their 20s that's holding them back on the corporate ladder. Without being in a highly paid field, she's stuck with very slow growing corporate salaries beginning from 60K a year, and everyone knows about salaries deflation. Men marry on average 2 years later, and start having kids later (closer to 30s), while facing less discrimination at work. There is no single research that proves women lack ambition en masse vs men. It's actually the opposite.

Not everyone is ambitious. Not everyone wants a high-powered job. Men OR women. Let's not pretend everyone is headed for the C-suite. Let's not pretend every man is, either!

Anonymous wrote:And why is HE not pick up his crap at home, so that the wife doesn't need to run 2 shifts?

He definitely should do that, and your considerable energies would be much better used figuring out a fair division of labor in your household rather than arguing about imaginary house managers.

Anonymous wrote:On your suggestion, I know 2 families where an high paying exW in fact took off with a lover and left kids with a much lower paid exH. She paid him alimony but his career never recovered after the divorce. He ended up stuck in mid 150K in his profession after being de-facto single dad for 10 years.

A fine model to follow then. Do that.

Anonymous wrote:Professional women line up for IVF because they don't need dads on board, more trouble than actual contribution in most cases.

Women, professional and not, line up for IVF because they want children. They want them to the point of spending money, undergoing procedures and doing it again and again. They want children that much.

All ok except that it’s nearly impossible to negotiate a fair division of labor when testosterone rich partner doesn’t want to. Thus women got divorced..

Anonymous wrote:
It's not the lack of ambition, but often lack of skills and women having kids in their 20s that's holding them back on the corporate ladder. Without being in a highly paid field, she's stuck with very slow growing corporate salaries beginning from 60K a year, and everyone knows about salaries deflation. Men marry on average 2 years later, and start having kids later (closer to 30s), while facing less discrimination at work. There is no single research that proves women lack ambition en masse vs men. It's actually the opposite.

Not everyone is ambitious. Not everyone wants a high-powered job. Men OR women. Let's not pretend everyone is headed for the C-suite. Let's not pretend every man is, either!

Anonymous wrote:And why is HE not pick up his crap at home, so that the wife doesn't need to run 2 shifts?

He definitely should do that, and your considerable energies would be much better used figuring out a fair division of labor in your household rather than arguing about imaginary house managers.

Anonymous wrote:On your suggestion, I know 2 families where an high paying exW in fact took off with a lover and left kids with a much lower paid exH. She paid him alimony but his career never recovered after the divorce. He ended up stuck in mid 150K in his profession after being de-facto single dad for 10 years.

A fine model to follow then. Do that.

Anonymous wrote:Professional women line up for IVF because they don't need dads on board, more trouble than actual contribution in most cases.

Women, professional and not, line up for IVF because they want children. They want them to the point of spending money, undergoing procedures and doing it again and again. They want children that much.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The math is very simple in fact easy to show how working women are at the short end of the stick. As we see from another thread, services of a full time house manager at the current market rate are $100K/year. Let's imagine we have 2 equal earners, each making 200K in the family, but only woman pulls off after school duties, running errands etc. She de-facto works 2 shifts contributing 300K into household, while husband commutes less and contributes 200K.

Half of the house manager job is on her, so even with this very flawed premise, it would be 250K, not 300K.

Anonymous wrote:With lower paid women, the math is even worse: she would have to commute for example, to make extra $70k/year, while also doing a "second shift" with kids contributing 100K. So she contributed 170K working 2 shifts, where he contributed 200K working one. She also now has less time left for example, to grow professionallly and get certifications, attend a grad program to even out the income gap. She is also mommy tracked a her work for always being late, stressed, they argue at home etc.

No one at that income level needs or hires house managers, and she isn't doing that, either.

Also: there are tons of single women in low-paid, dead-end, low-ambition, "mommy track" work. Who's holding them down? Lack of ambition is evenly spread in the population, and a married woman, just like a single one, may be perfectly content (or unable to achieve anything other than) a low-wattage job.

Anonymous wrote:The government doesn't offer her or kids an insurance, good free schools, good parental leave to remain healthy and succeed. She has no way out.

This is how marriage becomes a low paid hard labor and servitude for many working moms. Women have figured it out, and DINK movement is huge in DMV area.

Of course she has a way out: divorce and leave the children to the husband. I mean didn't you say she should be paid for the 100% of pregnancy, childbirth and child-rearing? That's what you do with the service you provide to others; so wrap up your services and depart like a chef who has cooked a week's worth of meals without eating them, or a cleaning crew that spit-and-polished the house without living in it. Leave the kids. Let's see if they are all his.

You know what else is huge in the DMV area? Fertility clinics, where women are lining up to perform a "service" you think they should be paid for.

It's not the lack of ambition, but often lack of skills and women having kids in their 20s that's holding them back on the corporate ladder. Without being in a highly paid field, she's stuck with very slow growing corporate salaries beginning from 60K a year, and everyone knows about salaries deflation. Men marry on average 2 years later, and start having kids later (closer to 30s), while facing less discrimination at work. There is no single research that proves women lack ambition en masse vs men. It's actually the opposite.

And why is HE not pick up his crap at home, so that the wife doesn't need to run 2 shifts?

On your suggestion, I know 2 families where an high paying exW in fact took off with a lover and left kids with a much lower paid exH. She paid him alimony but his career never recovered after the divorce. He ended up stuck in mid 150K in his profession after being de-facto single dad for 10 years.

Professional women line up for IVF because they don't need dads on board, more trouble than actual contribution in most cases.

Anonymous wrote:

The math is very simple in fact easy to show how working women are at the short end of the stick. As we see from another thread, services of a full time house manager at the current market rate are $100K/year. Let's imagine we have 2 equal earners, each making 200K in the family, but only woman pulls off after school duties, running errands etc. She de-facto works 2 shifts contributing 300K into household, while husband commutes less and contributes 200K.

Half of the house manager job is on her, so even with this very flawed premise, it would be 250K, not 300K.

Anonymous wrote:With lower paid women, the math is even worse: she would have to commute for example, to make extra $70k/year, while also doing a "second shift" with kids contributing 100K. So she contributed 170K working 2 shifts, where he contributed 200K working one. She also now has less time left for example, to grow professionallly and get certifications, attend a grad program to even out the income gap. She is also mommy tracked a her work for always being late, stressed, they argue at home etc.

No one at that income level needs or hires house managers, and she isn't doing that, either.

Also: there are tons of single women in low-paid, dead-end, low-ambition, "mommy track" work. Who's holding them down? Lack of ambition is evenly spread in the population, and a married woman, just like a single one, may be perfectly content (or unable to achieve anything other than) a low-wattage job.

Anonymous wrote:The government doesn't offer her or kids an insurance, good free schools, good parental leave to remain healthy and succeed. She has no way out.

This is how marriage becomes a low paid hard labor and servitude for many working moms. Women have figured it out, and DINK movement is huge in DMV area.

Of course she has a way out: divorce and leave the children to the husband. I mean didn't you say she should be paid for the 100% of pregnancy, childbirth and child-rearing? That's what you do with the service you provide to others; so wrap up your services and depart like a chef who has cooked a week's worth of meals without eating them, or a cleaning crew that spit-and-polished the house without living in it. Leave the kids. Let's see if they are all his.

You know what else is huge in the DMV area? Fertility clinics, where women are lining up to perform a "service" you think they should be paid for.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women make more hours to make the same salaries as men. With same skill set. This is already proved to be true in the US and confirmed by multiple research. Thus, if she’s earning less plus also has to pull off all the household work she ends up doing 2 work shifts vs husband . Until men and women are absolutely equalized on corporate ladder there may be no equality in marriage.

Not sure how it’s even hard to understand!

Precisely.

The people who don't understand are SAHMs who have no idea how hard it is to work AND be the primary parent. They have a cushy existence compared to most WOHMs.

I’m a single dad who works and is the primary parent and the alleged difficulty of this is vastly exaggerated.

Untrue/ I was working like a dog. All day at work and until the kids went to bed. He could afford me to stay at home. I was working two jobs and he was working one at work. That is what people are talking about. I was commuting 1.5 hours each way because of his insistence his commute be 15 min. Many working women are doing first and second shifts while the man enjoys a second income but do not do household or childcare duties. Yes, then marriage absolutely sucks for the woman and is a terrible deal.

That’s pretty extreme. Why didn’t you get a new job?

Or, why didn't her husband get a new job closer to hers?
Why didn't her husband have them move?

She seemed to acquiesce to this insistence of his though. I mean just because two individual people are bad at negotiating and compromise doesn’t mean that the institution as a whole sucks and is a terrible deal. That’s an extreme conclusion to come to.

Usually it's harder for a woman to find a well paid job nearby than for a man

Anonymous wrote:Unless the husband is rich.

Women do most of the unpaid and unnoticed domestic labor in the home. They use their body to create babies and then do most of the childcare.

If the husband isn’t rich, what does he bring to the table?

It sounds as if you wrote this in 1962.

My husband and all of the other husbands I know do a lot around the house.

I grew up in an UMC area and most women with kids, especially young ones, stay home. My college friends “married well” and seem pretty happy. At least as happy as the women working two shifts. They are married to men who make more money than they could in the workforce. The husbands wanted kids and are content with family life. The women enjoy doing all of the planning, driving kids around etc. Seems like a good deal for both parties.

I’m convinced most people in this area are so stressed, unhappy and don’t have any fun because of more families being dual income. It’s all work and no fun.

Agree with everyone that it’s terrible for women if you’re working AND doing everything at home.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women make more hours to make the same salaries as men. With same skill set. This is already proved to be true in the US and confirmed by multiple research. Thus, if she’s earning less plus also has to pull off all the household work she ends up doing 2 work shifts vs husband . Until men and women are absolutely equalized on corporate ladder there may be no equality in marriage.

Not sure how it’s even hard to understand!

Precisely.

The people who don't understand are SAHMs who have no idea how hard it is to work AND be the primary parent. They have a cushy existence compared to most WOHMs.

I’m a single dad who works and is the primary parent and the alleged difficulty of this is vastly exaggerated.

Untrue/ I was working like a dog. All day at work and until the kids went to bed. He could afford me to stay at home. I was working two jobs and he was working one at work. That is what people are talking about. I was commuting 1.5 hours each way because of his insistence his commute be 15 min. Many working women are doing first and second shifts while the man enjoys a second income but do not do household or childcare duties. Yes, then marriage absolutely sucks for the woman and is a terrible deal.

That’s pretty extreme. Why didn’t you get a new job?

Or, why didn't her husband get a new job closer to hers?
Why didn't her husband have them move?

She seemed to acquiesce to this insistence of his though. I mean just because two individual people are bad at negotiating and compromise doesn’t mean that the institution as a whole sucks and is a terrible deal. That’s an extreme conclusion to come to.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women make more hours to make the same salaries as men. With same skill set. This is already proved to be true in the US and confirmed by multiple research. Thus, if she’s earning less plus also has to pull off all the household work she ends up doing 2 work shifts vs husband . Until men and women are absolutely equalized on corporate ladder there may be no equality in marriage.

Not sure how it’s even hard to understand!

Precisely.

The people who don't understand are SAHMs who have no idea how hard it is to work AND be the primary parent. They have a cushy existence compared to most WOHMs.

I’m a single dad who works and is the primary parent and the alleged difficulty of this is vastly exaggerated.

Because you probably suck as a dad compared to what single/working moms are doing. Sorry.

Signed,

SAHM with a cushy existence

I dated single dads with 2-3 kids who are actual, involved parents. They literally never have time for themselves or serious dating !

Right. They were better dads than the PP who thinks that moms are vastly exaggerating how hard it is to work full-time and be the primary parent.

Or maybe he's just a harder worker and not as used to complaining. Or maybe he doesn't see parenting as a hassle. Or maybe he's more efficient at accomplishing what needs to be done at work and home. Or maybe he doesn't spend a lot of time shopping for leggings and watching Tik Tok dances while "working" at his cushy middle management fed job.

Hmm, no, I think it's that he isn't as good of a dad as women who report their experience with the well-documented phenomenon of the difficulties of being a primary parent while working full-time.

Maybe he’s doing something fun while you’re shopping for perfect goody bags and I dunno, inventing better hiding places for Christmas paper on sale in July.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women make more hours to make the same salaries as men. With same skill set. This is already proved to be true in the US and confirmed by multiple research. Thus, if she’s earning less plus also has to pull off all the household work she ends up doing 2 work shifts vs husband . Until men and women are absolutely equalized on corporate ladder there may be no equality in marriage.

Not sure how it’s even hard to understand!

Precisely.

The people who don't understand are SAHMs who have no idea how hard it is to work AND be the primary parent. They have a cushy existence compared to most WOHMs.

I’m a single dad who works and is the primary parent and the alleged difficulty of this is vastly exaggerated.

Untrue/ I was working like a dog. All day at work and until the kids went to bed. He could afford me to stay at home. I was working two jobs and he was working one at work. That is what people are talking about. I was commuting 1.5 hours each way because of his insistence his commute be 15 min. Many working women are doing first and second shifts while the man enjoys a second income but do not do household or childcare duties. Yes, then marriage absolutely sucks for the woman and is a terrible deal.

The math is very simple in fact easy to show how working women are at the short end of the stick. As we see from another thread, services of a full time house manager at the current market rate are $100K/year. Let's imagine we have 2 equal earners, each making 200K in the family, but only woman pulls off after school duties, running errands etc. She de-facto works 2 shifts contributing 300K into household, while husband commutes less and contributes 200K.

With lower paid women, the math is even worse: she would have to commute for example, to make extra $70k/year, while also doing a "second shift" with kids contributing 100K. So she contributed 170K working 2 shifts, where he contributed 200K working one. She also now has less time left for example, to grow professionallly and get certifications, attend a grad program to even out the income gap. She is also mommy tracked a her work for always being late, stressed, they argue at home etc.

The government doesn't offer her or kids an insurance, good free schools, good parental leave to remain healthy and succeed. She has no way out.

This is how marriage becomes a low paid hard labor and servitude for many working moms. Women have figured it out, and DINK movement is huge in DMV area.

Men, if you want your wife to work full time during main child bearing years you are not equal contribotors ! Women literally should have kids only when they climbed up to executive level in their career and can afford house aid.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women make more hours to make the same salaries as men. With same skill set. This is already proved to be true in the US and confirmed by multiple research. Thus, if she’s earning less plus also has to pull off all the household work she ends up doing 2 work shifts vs husband . Until men and women are absolutely equalized on corporate ladder there may be no equality in marriage.

Not sure how it’s even hard to understand!

Precisely.

The people who don't understand are SAHMs who have no idea how hard it is to work AND be the primary parent. They have a cushy existence compared to most WOHMs.

I’m a single dad who works and is the primary parent and the alleged difficulty of this is vastly exaggerated.

Untrue/ I was working like a dog. All day at work and until the kids went to bed. He could afford me to stay at home. I was working two jobs and he was working one at work. That is what people are talking about. I was commuting 1.5 hours each way because of his insistence his commute be 15 min. Many working women are doing first and second shifts while the man enjoys a second income but do not do household or childcare duties. Yes, then marriage absolutely sucks for the woman and is a terrible deal.

That’s pretty extreme. Why didn’t you get a new job?

Or, why didn't her husband get a new job closer to hers?
Why didn't her husband have them move?