Anonymous wrote:$250k probably puts you in the top 10% in just about any hood, except maybe parts of Georgetown and Great Falls. But even there, I suspect you're above the median.

Or is this another, "poor suffering rich people" thread, so we can justify squashing the workplace rights of teachers making $60k a year?

Of course, no one's trying to "squash the workplace rights of teachers". We're trying to get shitty teachers out of the professions so that we can compensate the good ones better. Thanks for playing into the stereotype that our school systems are basically welfare schemes for a few folks with education degrees--with the added side benefit of keeping a few kids off the streets during the day.

Anonymous wrote:So, I'm right then? My paltry $250K/year is only considered rich in bumbleF*ck USA, but in DC I'm middle class?

IMO yes, see my "generic american dream" post

if you want the generic "american dream" in the DC area 250K isn't enough let alone be "rich". Rich in IMO is exceeding the american dream and having money to spend on extra things like a vacation house, extravagent international family vacations, first class airplane tickets for your whole family and still exceed the "american dream" standard.

The generic american dream IMO is the following:

3000 SQRFT Newer House (less than 10 years old) In a Good neighborhood (Mclean, Vienna, Bethesda etc...), WITHOUT previous housing appreciation as a downpayment (starting fresh)

NOT private school (because you are in the above neighborhood)

Pay for Health Insurance, Utilities / Gas / Food, going out to eat on the weekends, weekend activities

Save and later pay for your 2.5 kid's 4 year colleges

2 $40K cars (payment meaning 2-3 years old)

Someone to cut lawn

Someone to clean your house

If you are younger, childcare for your 2.5 kids

After school activities

Car for your teenagers

Retain your same lifestyle in retirement minus a house payment (assuming you pay your house off)

people who work hard -- however they define that -- for their money are less likely to feel "rich". we have great HHI but i feel a lot less rich than the family i know who has one kid in FT daycare, one with a sitter so the wife can go to a job three times a week that doesn't even cover the costs of childcare. that seems indulgent and extravangent to me, so if feels like they are richer, though they probably have lower HHI than we do.

the bottom line for me is that we all make choices, whether you think you (or the people who are sticking up for) do or not. yes, i chose to go into a lucrative career and i choose to stay in a job that i hate most days because the money is better than what I would get anywhere else. others choose to have a parent at home and live on one income, or choose less lucrative jobs/careers or don't work as hard to make more money or whatever. while it isn't fair that important jobs pay less (teachers, fire fighters, etc), and i would and do support them making more, you knew that when you went into it. choices -- we all have to live with them.

Wow, that is so judgmental! How do you know what their situation is, financial or otherwise? I have done a very similar thing to what you describe in the past - I work 3 days a week, and we have had long periods (for years!) where my salary was not covering the cost of childcare + an expensive preschool. I guess I was being extravagant by not going back to work full-time?? We decided, as a family, that we wanted to send our kids to this preschool, so we would have been paying for that either way, so it didn't matter that my salary couldn't cover it. And we also decided that while, at times, I was not quite covering or just breaking even on the cost of our childcare (aside from preschool tuition), it was still worth it for me to keep working so I could continue to maximize my 401(k) contributions, maintain my other benefits (I do not have our primary health insurance but I do have some other insurance that our whole family is on), and more importantly, to hold onto my job because eventually we would be done with childcare and then I'd finally be keeping more of my take-home pay. I chose not to go back full-time because we decided that we would take a little bit of a financial hit in order for me to be home more with the kids; that works better for the whole family. We didn't do it because we think we're so rich that I can just work "for fun" even though it's costing us (believe me, I would stop working in a heartbeat if it made sense to do that; I don't find it "fun" in the least). We did it because over the long term there is a financial benefit to our family, even though there are years in which my working has been a slight net loss (not accounting for my retirement contributions and insurance).

So, I'm right then? My paltry $250K/year is only considered rich in bumbleF*ck USA, but in DC I'm middle class?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Again, upper-middle class incomes can buy an expanded range of life choices that still fall short of extravagance.

Wealthy incomes can buy solid gold toilet seats for private jets-- or at least occasionally charter private jets with gold plated toilet seats. There are lots of people in America who can do this.

get real- using private jet use for a 'rich' threshold is absurd in any context....

Not in cities where such people are well represented.

I would say private jet hire is a privilage of upper classes. Upper middle class would be satisfied with first class on a normal flight. It is still pretty good in the end... Interesting discussion btw. Wealth is so relative...

what a profound insight- you should ruminate on such matters more regularly....

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Again, upper-middle class incomes can buy an expanded range of life choices that still fall short of extravagance.

Wealthy incomes can buy solid gold toilet seats for private jets-- or at least occasionally charter private jets with gold plated toilet seats. There are lots of people in America who can do this.

get real- using private jet use for a 'rich' threshold is absurd in any context....

Not in cities where such people are well represented.

I would say private jet hire is a privilage of upper classes. Upper middle class would be satisfied with first class on a normal flight. It is still pretty good in the end... Interesting discussion btw. Wealth is so relative...

I <3 DCUM

What really amazes me in this area is all the high salaries but not much net worth. According to Kiplinger, only 7% of American households ever have $1 million or more in net investable assets. How foolish to make $300K a year and have nothing but "stuff" to show for it.

people who work hard -- however they define that -- for their money are less likely to feel "rich". we have great HHI but i feel a lot less rich than the family i know who has one kid in FT daycare, one with a sitter so the wife can go to a job three times a week that doesn't even cover the costs of childcare. that seems indulgent and extravangent to me, so if feels like they are richer, though they probably have lower HHI than we do.

the bottom line for me is that we all make choices, whether you think you (or the people who are sticking up for) do or not. yes, i chose to go into a lucrative career and i choose to stay in a job that i hate most days because the money is better than what I would get anywhere else. others choose to have a parent at home and live on one income, or choose less lucrative jobs/careers or don't work as hard to make more money or whatever. while it isn't fair that important jobs pay less (teachers, fire fighters, etc), and i would and do support them making more, you knew that when you went into it. choices -- we all have to live with them.

Aw heck, I can't even tag images properly.

Truly the didactic has been subverted here when many among the petty bourgeoisie count themselves among the proletariat.

Sorry, you are just part of the established capitalist power structure that must fall apart when the state withers away. The true proletariat does not recognize you.

[img]http://www.iwise.com/authorIcons/482/Karl_Marx_128x128.png[/img

I've always found Finnish/Estonian girls to be attractive

Finland sucks. it is friggin cold, the people are ugly and most are alcoholics. not to mention it gets dark at noon.

In addition to effort vs reward, there's common sense. If you love teaching so much that you're willing to pay for a master's degree without discernible financial reward, then you have your reward. You knew teaching pay sux rox when you went into it.
Maybe us

Wow! If we all felt like you did we would all be wall street leeches I mean bankers. Where would our kids be then? Maybe us teachers should just move Finland where teaching is actually a highly respected and highly paid career choice. You can go home school your brats!