Anonymous
Post 01/27/2020 07:44     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Anonymous wrote:There has been at least one poster claiming that a child who is able to take and pass Algebra I in 5th grade is rare or an outlier.

Aops is hugely popular. Loads of 5th graders taking algebra in 5th grade. If you talk to homeschooling circles (where aops is used as a curriculum by itself) it’s by no means weird for above average kids to take algebra I in 5th.

Also there are whole countries where algebra is taught in 5th grade, right? This is a huge argument made on this forum.

So while it’s advanced for a student to study this on the side I don’t think it’s really a sign of needing radical acceleration. It’s merely a sign that the student is receiving outside tutoring.

Having worked with the aops curriculum I don’t think it stands as a complete substitution for an honors Algebra I course that is taught at the high school level. It’s different. The concepts are introduced through self discovery which can mean a student learns at a deeper level. But not always. And I don’t think it is as rigorous. There is far less drilling and practice. Which isn’t needed if the student gets it the first time. But on the flip side a student can easily skip over problem sections and there isn’t much review.

Math competitions in elementary school are purely extra curricular. Doing well on the AMC 8 is only a sign that the student does well on that competition because they are accelerated or because they have studied the test. Not until
The AMC 12 is it really meaningful of anything more.

You see, a child who can fully understand Algebra I at 10 but have trouble with higher level and more abstract problems at 18. There’s no predicting this.


A kid who takes the aops curriculum is not fully understanding Algebra 1 honors level math. They may understand concepts or pockets of material but not the breadth of material for the whole course.
Anonymous
Post 01/27/2020 06:43     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
There has been at least one poster claiming that a child who is able to take and pass Algebra I in 5th grade is rare or an outlier.

Aops is hugely popular. Loads of 5th graders taking algebra in 5th grade. If you talk to homeschooling circles (where aops is used as a curriculum by itself) it’s by no means weird for above average kids to take algebra I in 5th.

Also there are whole countries where algebra is taught in 5th grade, right? This is a huge argument made on this forum.

So while it’s advanced for a student to study this on the side I don’t think it’s really a sign of needing radical acceleration. It’s merely a sign that the student is receiving outside tutoring.

Having worked with the aops curriculum I don’t think it stands as a complete substitution for an honors Algebra I course that is taught at the high school level. It’s different. The concepts are introduced through self discovery which can mean a student learns at a deeper level. But not always. And I don’t think it is as rigorous. There is far less drilling and practice. Which isn’t needed if the student gets it the first time. But on the flip side a student can easily skip over problem sections and there isn’t much review.

Math competitions in elementary school are purely extra curricular. Doing well on the AMC 8 is only a sign that the student does well on that competition because they are accelerated or because they have studied the test. Not until
The AMC 12 is it really meaningful of anything more.

You see, a child who can fully understand Algebra I at 10 but have trouble with higher level and more abstract problems at 18. There’s no predicting this.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 20:27     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Your children are so young. The only question should be is if they want to because they think it will be fun.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 19:32     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
There are 4th and 5th graders on the AMC8 honor roll, meaning that they scored among the top 5% of 8th graders in honors math. The entire state of VA had 4 kids like this. These are the types of kids who mastered Algebra by 5th and need radical acceleration in school.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 13:12     Subject: Re:Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Algebra at a place like this will def not be the same as algebra honors.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 12:42     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I know truly gifted kids ( kids in Magnet and go to math competitions) don’t do things like kumon and mathnasium

Of course not. They do RSM or AoPS.


That could be the case, but definitely not kumon, those are for kids struggling with math
pettifogger
Post 01/26/2020 12:34     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Yes it is, and it isn't something I'm not breathing about. But since it sounded so implausible for others to think that someone would consider having their kid sit through algebra at AoPS and then FCPS a few years later, I was just noting that I would make the same exact decision. That's all! To each their own. Doesn't mean someone else is lying about their kid.


It's implausible for a kid within FCPS AAP to complete AoPS Algebra in 5th, but then wait all the way until 8th grade to take FCPS Algebra, which is what the PP originally implied. The top kids in FCPS take Algebra in 6th. The top half of the kids in AAP take it in 7th (probably around 10% of FCPS kids..?) It would be really weird to take a kid who is ready for (and completed) a rigorous Algebra program in 5th and then refuse to let your kid skip ahead for 6th grade algebra, have your kid crush the IAAT in 6th AAP math, but refuse to let him or her join his high performing peers in 7th grade Algebra, and instead make your kid wait until 8th, which is when the AAP kids who failed the IAAT or aren't particularly good in math take Algebra.

If your kid continues absorbing math concepts and is allowed to skip to 6th grade Algebra, I bet you and your DD will leap at the chance. It unlikely that you will make her wait all the way until 8th.


I think you are the one who needs to take a deep breath. Read what the tutor posted above. Some parents are considering math outside school as enrichment and want to keep their kids on a normal math track. There are many experts in math education advising this route. Nobody is talking about math geniuses who are intuiting calculus in 4th grade. We are talking about normal smart kids who will probably not even major in math. They are highly gifted and their parents just want some outside stimulus for them without having to commit to calculus in 10th grade. These parents are not trying to build a trajectory into MIT. And these parents understand if their kid is so inclined they can always accelerate down the line.


I’m the one who told you to breathe. Not the follow up posters. What you’re suggesting is unwise. You’ll be complaining your kid is soooo bored. You also go from says the kids aren’t math geniuses but they are highly gifted. Come again?


You do realize that there are a lot of highly gifted kids and the vast majority are not figuring out calculus in 4th grade? I get that those few may need acceleration. But a kid understanding algebra I in 5th? These are normal smart kids who are able to comprehend math years above their grade but are also interested in other academic areas beyond math. And there is no reason to push these kids so far ahead in school just because of outside enrichment. If reviewing the math learned outside school in school a few years later is too much for a child I would not recommend this route for that kid.


Maybe they can understand the ideas in 5th grade, and while that's great, it doesn't necessarily mean they'll be able to do well or even pass an Algebra 1 exam. Obviously in that case they need to take a full year algebra class in school to master the concepts. On the other hand, if the kids have already shown mastery by succeeding in an AoPS algebra course or equivalent, then it would be a big waste of time to repeat algebra 1 in school years later. In any case you likely needn't worry about this scenario; it's relatively rare to have 5th graders master algebra. If you have that type of kid, they are probably highly interested in mathematics and would definitely need a lot of acceleration to keep them challenged.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 11:07     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Yes it is, and it isn't something I'm not breathing about. But since it sounded so implausible for others to think that someone would consider having their kid sit through algebra at AoPS and then FCPS a few years later, I was just noting that I would make the same exact decision. That's all! To each their own. Doesn't mean someone else is lying about their kid.


It's implausible for a kid within FCPS AAP to complete AoPS Algebra in 5th, but then wait all the way until 8th grade to take FCPS Algebra, which is what the PP originally implied. The top kids in FCPS take Algebra in 6th. The top half of the kids in AAP take it in 7th (probably around 10% of FCPS kids..?) It would be really weird to take a kid who is ready for (and completed) a rigorous Algebra program in 5th and then refuse to let your kid skip ahead for 6th grade algebra, have your kid crush the IAAT in 6th AAP math, but refuse to let him or her join his high performing peers in 7th grade Algebra, and instead make your kid wait until 8th, which is when the AAP kids who failed the IAAT or aren't particularly good in math take Algebra.

If your kid continues absorbing math concepts and is allowed to skip to 6th grade Algebra, I bet you and your DD will leap at the chance. It unlikely that you will make her wait all the way until 8th.


I think you are the one who needs to take a deep breath. Read what the tutor posted above. Some parents are considering math outside school as enrichment and want to keep their kids on a normal math track. There are many experts in math education advising this route. Nobody is talking about math geniuses who are intuiting calculus in 4th grade. We are talking about normal smart kids who will probably not even major in math. They are highly gifted and their parents just want some outside stimulus for them without having to commit to calculus in 10th grade. These parents are not trying to build a trajectory into MIT. And these parents understand if their kid is so inclined they can always accelerate down the line.


I’m the one who told you to breathe. Not the follow up posters. What you’re suggesting is unwise. You’ll be complaining your kid is soooo bored. You also go from says the kids aren’t math geniuses but they are highly gifted. Come again?


You do realize that there are a lot of highly gifted kids and the vast majority are not figuring out calculus in 4th grade? I get that those few may need acceleration. But a kid understanding algebra I in 5th? These are normal smart kids who are able to comprehend math years above their grade but are also interested in other academic areas beyond math. And there is no reason to push these kids so far ahead in school just because of outside enrichment. If reviewing the math learned outside school in school a few years later is too much for a child I would not recommend this route for that kid.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 10:50     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I know truly gifted kids ( kids in Magnet and go to math competitions) don’t do things like kumon and mathnasium

Of course not. They do RSM or AoPS.


You are crazy. There are def kids who have a natural talent.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 10:35     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Anonymous wrote:I know truly gifted kids ( kids in Magnet and go to math competitions) don’t do things like kumon and mathnasium

Of course not. They do RSM or AoPS.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 10:32     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
I know truly gifted kids ( kids in Magnet and go to math competitions) don’t do things like kumon and mathnasium
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 10:09     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
I find all of this discussion hilarious, since the parents are declaring when their kids will take algebra and acting as if the kids, themselves, won't have an opinion. If your kid qualifies for Algebra earlier than 8th and wants to take it, but you don't let them, you're just going to end up with a resentful kid.

In FCPS, 7th grade algebra IS a normal track. Around 10% of the FCPS kids take it then. 6th grade Algebra is even somewhat normal in some AAP centers.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 09:38     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Yes it is, and it isn't something I'm not breathing about. But since it sounded so implausible for others to think that someone would consider having their kid sit through algebra at AoPS and then FCPS a few years later, I was just noting that I would make the same exact decision. That's all! To each their own. Doesn't mean someone else is lying about their kid.


It's implausible for a kid within FCPS AAP to complete AoPS Algebra in 5th, but then wait all the way until 8th grade to take FCPS Algebra, which is what the PP originally implied. The top kids in FCPS take Algebra in 6th. The top half of the kids in AAP take it in 7th (probably around 10% of FCPS kids..?) It would be really weird to take a kid who is ready for (and completed) a rigorous Algebra program in 5th and then refuse to let your kid skip ahead for 6th grade algebra, have your kid crush the IAAT in 6th AAP math, but refuse to let him or her join his high performing peers in 7th grade Algebra, and instead make your kid wait until 8th, which is when the AAP kids who failed the IAAT or aren't particularly good in math take Algebra.

If your kid continues absorbing math concepts and is allowed to skip to 6th grade Algebra, I bet you and your DD will leap at the chance. It unlikely that you will make her wait all the way until 8th.


I think you are the one who needs to take a deep breath. Read what the tutor posted above. Some parents are considering math outside school as enrichment and want to keep their kids on a normal math track. There are many experts in math education advising this route. Nobody is talking about math geniuses who are intuiting calculus in 4th grade. We are talking about normal smart kids who will probably not even major in math. They are highly gifted and their parents just want some outside stimulus for them without having to commit to calculus in 10th grade. These parents are not trying to build a trajectory into MIT. And these parents understand if their kid is so inclined they can always accelerate down the line.


I’m the one who told you to breathe. Not the follow up posters. What you’re suggesting is unwise. You’ll be complaining your kid is soooo bored. You also go from says the kids aren’t math geniuses but they are highly gifted. Come again?
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 08:52     Subject: Re:Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
To the issue at hand—yes, send the kids there. The prizes are cool.
Anonymous
Post 01/26/2020 08:49     Subject: Should I send my kids to mathnasium?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Yes it is, and it isn't something I'm not breathing about. But since it sounded so implausible for others to think that someone would consider having their kid sit through algebra at AoPS and then FCPS a few years later, I was just noting that I would make the same exact decision. That's all! To each their own. Doesn't mean someone else is lying about their kid.


It's implausible for a kid within FCPS AAP to complete AoPS Algebra in 5th, but then wait all the way until 8th grade to take FCPS Algebra, which is what the PP originally implied. The top kids in FCPS take Algebra in 6th. The top half of the kids in AAP take it in 7th (probably around 10% of FCPS kids..?) It would be really weird to take a kid who is ready for (and completed) a rigorous Algebra program in 5th and then refuse to let your kid skip ahead for 6th grade algebra, have your kid crush the IAAT in 6th AAP math, but refuse to let him or her join his high performing peers in 7th grade Algebra, and instead make your kid wait until 8th, which is when the AAP kids who failed the IAAT or aren't particularly good in math take Algebra.

If your kid continues absorbing math concepts and is allowed to skip to 6th grade Algebra, I bet you and your DD will leap at the chance. It unlikely that you will make her wait all the way until 8th.


I think you are the one who needs to take a deep breath. Read what the tutor posted above. Some parents are considering math outside school as enrichment and want to keep their kids on a normal math track. There are many experts in math education advising this route. Nobody is talking about math geniuses who are intuiting calculus in 4th grade. We are talking about normal smart kids who will probably not even major in math. They are highly gifted and their parents just want some outside stimulus for them without having to commit to calculus in 10th grade. These parents are not trying to build a trajectory into MIT. And these parents understand if their kid is so inclined they can always accelerate down the line.