Anonymous wrote:

So instead there should be variable standards? Aren't standards by definition uniform?

Bingo! Kids are not uniform.

There has to be a minimum standard. Kids were being passed to the next grade without being able to read. Heck, they were graduating without being able to read. They should have a baseline standard.

So instead there should be variable standards? Aren't standards by definition uniform?

Bingo! Kids are not uniform.

Anonymous wrote:

This is not a grade level standard. It may have been your personal teaching goal, but that is not the same thing as a state standards for say 3rd grade.

State standards do not now, and never did, say:

"By the end of third grade, in writing, students will have improved in writing however their teacher determined they should improve, in whatever areas their teacher deemed useful and appropriate"

I know that. Believe me, I wrote plenty of objectives--however, those were not standards. When you set uniform standards, you will get mediocrity. Period.

So instead there should be variable standards? Aren't standards by definition uniform?

CC standards will not improve education. It will hold back successful students while teachers give all their time to those who are borderline. The rest will fall out.

This is not a grade level standard. It may have been your personal teaching goal, but that is not the same thing as a state standards for say 3rd grade.

State standards do not now, and never did, say:

"By the end of third grade, in writing, students will have improved in writing however their teacher determined they should improve, in whatever areas their teacher deemed useful and appropriate"

I know that. Believe me, I wrote plenty of objectives--however, those were not standards. When you set uniform standards, you will get mediocrity. Period.

PP again -- or draw in the journals... or dictate/draw/copy/write. It's a part of Kindergarten writing time called "responding to literature".

Anonymous wrote:

NOT SCARY AT ALL IT TURNS OUT!!!

The procedure you described for testing the standard is time consuming. For a teacher with a lot of kids--and many standards to reach--this may be unrealistic.

What procedure? Journal writing? Kindergarten children write in their journals all the time, and teachers assess their writing.

Anonymous wrote:When I taught, I had a simple standard:
Figure out where the kid is, and take him, by pushing and pulling, as far as possible. Period.

This is not a grade level standard. It may have been your personal teaching goal, but that is not the same thing as a state standards for say 3rd grade.

State standards do not now, and never did, say:

"By the end of third grade, in writing, students will have improved in writing however their teacher determined they should improve, in whatever areas their teacher deemed useful and appropriate"

Anonymous wrote:

And yes, students will not all meet the same standards no matter what you do. Does this mean that therefore there should be no such thing as standards? I don't think so.

As long as these standards are being used to evaluate teachers you will have a problem. Think about this, too. You have a student who already meets the standards. Where is the teacher going to spend his/her time?

You (or somebody) keeps saying that there should be no such thing as standards.

When I taught, I had a simple standard:
Figure out where the kid is, and take him, by pushing and pulling, as far as possible. Period.

And yes, students will not all meet the same standards no matter what you do. Does this mean that therefore there should be no such thing as standards? I don't think so.

As long as these standards are being used to evaluate teachers you will have a problem. Think about this, too. You have a student who already meets the standards. Where is the teacher going to spend his/her time?

Anonymous wrote:

Again, this is not an argument against standards. It is an argument in favor of good teaching.

The standards assume that kids have the same baseline. Why limit those who are already meeting standards? They need higher standards. Students are not all the same. They will not meet the same standards no matter how much you do. They are not cookies.

No, they don't. All the standards do is say, "A student should be able to do x by the end of x grade." They don't say, "Students better not be able to do more than x by the end of x grade, or we'll whack them on the head until they forget." They also don't say, "Students all start out at the same place.

And yes, students will not all meet the same standards no matter what you do. Does this mean that therefore there should be no such thing as standards? I don't think so.

Again, this is not an argument against standards. It is an argument in favor of good teaching.

The standards assume that kids have the same baseline. Why limit those who are already meeting standards? They need higher standards. Students are not all the same. They will not meet the same standards no matter how much you do. They are not cookies.

Anonymous wrote:

Yes. You find out where the kids are and teach them so that they can reach the standard.

Problem is that teachers may skip many steps because of requirement to meet the standard. This can be quite detrimental to the student.

Again, this is not an argument against standards. It is an argument in favor of good teaching.

Yes. You find out where the kids are and teach them so that they can reach the standard.

Problem is that teachers may skip many steps because of requirement to meet the standard. This can be quite detrimental to the student.