Anonymous wrote:These threads are so stupid, why do I keep reading them. I guess I enjoy telling some people to f*ck off. Like you, stupid Holland lady. It's just none of your business how many abortions I have. Unless you want me to skype you in. Brace yourself, the last one took three days. Cavalier is not how I would describe it.

Good luck with YOUR pregnancy sweetie. Sure hope the folic acid absorbtion thing isn't hereditary.

Anonymous wrote:Maybe we should just go ahead and make sure our society practices Eugenics. That way none of the less desirable will be born or allowed to reproduce. You all do know who thought that was a good idea, don't you?

Yeah, that's right..........................

Yeah, but I'm saying part of the reason people resent SN children and there is a social stigma is reflected in this attitude that SN kids aren't even worth their life. They should be aborted. And when somehow people haven't managed to get rid of them before they are born, then they resent them. So the same attitude that has been expressed here is the very same attitude that makes it harder for SN parents. "Look I don't think my tax money should go to help your SN kid because you should have taken care of that before they were born." Or just simply the callousness expressed here comes out. If we had a culture that valued the lives of kids with special needs, starting at the beginning, instead of viewing them as disposable, maybe society would also offer more support to parents of kids with SN.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From today's Washington Post http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/fairfax-county-wrestles-with-budgetary-trade-offs/2012/04/23/gIQAcwV7cT_story.html more bashing of special needs kids and special education services. Yeah, people are REAL supportive of stuggling SN familes.

And is abortion going to help improve that?

Have you read the comments? There are plenty of posters there that don't think public funds should be used to help families with SN kids. "Take responsibility" is frequently used and some are clearly fed up that their tax dollars are used to fund services and that special needs kids "take away" from typical kids. There's a lot of resentment there. All this adds to your burden when you're struggling to raise your SN kids. On top of all the financial and emotional burdens, you're subjected to social stigma and resentment. Who was that saying raising SN kids isn't much different than typical kids?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From today's Washington Post http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/fairfax-county-wrestles-with-budgetary-trade-offs/2012/04/23/gIQAcwV7cT_story.html more bashing of special needs kids and special education services. Yeah, people are REAL supportive of stuggling SN familes.

And is abortion going to help improve that?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From today's Washington Post http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/fairfax-county-wrestles-with-budgetary-trade-offs/2012/04/23/gIQAcwV7cT_story.html more bashing of special needs kids and special education services. Yeah, people are REAL supportive of stuggling SN familes.

And is abortion going to help improve that?

Anonymous wrote:From today's Washington Post http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/fairfax-county-wrestles-with-budgetary-trade-offs/2012/04/23/gIQAcwV7cT_story.html more bashing of special needs kids and special education services. Yeah, people are REAL supportive of stuggling SN familes.

Anonymous wrote:"Welcome to Holland" is so stupid, because no matter how much delight a child with serious SN brings to your life (just like all children can), dealing with those SN is no vacation. Particularly not to Holland, which is a place that is just as lovely as Italy. That's more like, I thought I was having a boy but instead I got a girl. Because there's nothing like the pain of watching your child struggle, the worry that you experience about your child's health, his future, etc. That is no vacation. THAT -- for any parent -- is a misery. As wonderful as the child may be, the SN, depending on their severity, are HARD LABOR.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And let me just add that while you are sitting on your ass crying crocodile tears about the abortion of Special Needs kids, some idiot has gone on for 14 pages in Schools General Discussion about why her children have to go to school with Special Needs kids. This is the real problem for Special Needs kids -- not abortion -- REAL LIFE -- so why not join reality, toots, and dry those crocodile tears. Phantom special needs babies don't need your help. Real special needs kids do.

Wow, PP. That's really troubling and you are absolutely correct!

That's right!!!!

Anonymous wrote:As the mom of a child w/ a now-repaired cleft lip and cleft palate, your post moved me to tears. I couldn't have said it better myself. I totally agree with it. Parents, it really is true: "If you ever find yourself in that position of discovering that your child is not going to be who you thought: relax. It's not going to be that bad. You are strong enough, you are amazing enough, you will do just fine. There's no need to panic. Remember that people with disabilities are people. They love, they laugh, they play, they communicate, they live. If you can get over yourself, you will do just fine."

Another really thoughful thing about this same topic is: "Welcome to Holland"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welcome_to_Holland

When you’re going to have a baby, it’s like planning a fabulous vacation trip to Italy. You buy a bunch of guide books and make your wonderful plans. The Coliseum, the Sistine Chapel, Gondolas. You may learn some handy phrases in Italian. It’s all very exciting. After several months of eager anticipation, the day finally arrives. You pack your bags and off you go. Several hours later, the plane lands. The stewardess comes in and says, “Welcome to Holland!” “Holland?” you say. “What do you mean, Holland? I signed up for Italy. I’m supposed to be in Italy. All my life I’ve dreamed of going to Italy.” But there’s been a change in the flight plan. They’ve landed in Holland and there you must stay. The important thing is that they haven’t taken you to a horrible, disgusting, filthy place full of pestilence, famine, and disease. It’s just a different place. So, you must go out and buy new guidebooks. And you must learn a whole new language. And you will meet a whole new group of people you would never have met. It’s just a different place. It’s slower paced than Italy, less flashy than Italy. But after you’ve been there for a while and you catch your breath, you look around. You begin to notice that Holland has windmills. Holland has tulips. And Holland even has Rembrandts. But everyone you know is busy coming and going from Italy, and they’re all bragging about what a wonderful time they had there. And for the rest of your life you will say, “Yes, that’s where I was supposed to go. That’s what I had planned.” And the pain of that experience will never, ever, ever, go away. The loss of that dream is a very significant loss. But if you spend your life mourning the fact that you didn’t get to Italy, you may never be free to enjoy the very special, the very lovely things about Holland.

Anonymous wrote:

Unfortunately this is just not true. It is quite rare for an adult with DS to live completely independently. I used to teach elementary special education and was really delighted to see how well my students with special needs (including students with DS) could be included and supported. Then I transferred to the high school level and it was a whole other world. While in elementary school it was easy to get typically developing kids to interact with my students with severe needs, in high school the only students who would willingly interact were students who wanted to put the experience on their college applications. Inclusion was really challenging. Parents were really worried about how to make sure their kids were supported when they were adults and the parents were retired or deceased. Based on my experience in secondary schools I had an amnio with one pregnancy and CVS with the other. I didn't have to make the tough decision of what to do if I were pregnant with a child with a severe disability, but I am pretty sure I wouldn't have continued the pregnancy. I would never post this on the SN boards, but because this is the OFF topic boards I think parents who are faced with the decision should speak to parents with older children with disabilities not just parents with toddlers or elementary school students.

Are you seriously trying to refute the referenced poster - a MOM of a DS child - with your limited experineces as a teacher and broad, sweeping generalizations about a limited group of people that you happened to be exposed to? The previous poster was not citing statistics, she was saying that many, many DS children grow to live independently or in group homes. Many do. How does what you post negate that statement? I'm sure many others also have parents who are concerned about thier future, etc. Re-read your post and you will see how unhelpful it is - - particularly after 15 pages of this thread. Get a grip and just self-edit next time.