Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do ppl understand many of us dont think it’s murdering a baby?
From that standpoint, do you get why we therefore have no issue with abortion?

NP. No, some of us can’t see how (apparently) intelligent people think that an abortion the day before you give birth is not murdering a baby but waiting a day and someone murdering it when it’s born is actually murder. That’s just completely anti-science. Do people like yourself understand that doctors can now do operations on babies before they’re born? Because the babies are actually babies even when they’re in there.

And I’m fairly moderate on abortion btw - I think it should be legal until around the point of viability.

I wonder how you’d feel if you were stabbed in the stomach the day before you were due to give birth to your much wanted baby, killing him/her. Would you consider it murder then? Or just nothing different than if you’d been stabbed when you weren’t pregnant?

I like how you call yourself intelligent, and then in the same sentence mention abortion the day before the babies due. An intelligent person would know that that does not happen. Yes, there is something called a late term abortion but that is very, very difficult to obtain. Cost a lot of money and needs a strong reason to be approved. I know of one woman who did it. This was a wanted, baby. Very wanted. And yes, while it was a "late term" abortion, it was certainly not the day before the baby was due.

Abortion won’t be an issue if all men age 16-66 are sterilized. If Kamala can propose this instead of planned parenthood, I will vote for her.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do ppl understand many of us dont think it’s murdering a baby?
From that standpoint, do you get why we therefore have no issue with abortion?

NP. No, some of us can’t see how (apparently) intelligent people think that an abortion the day before you give birth is not murdering a baby but waiting a day and someone murdering it when it’s born is actually murder. That’s just completely anti-science. Do people like yourself understand that doctors can now do operations on babies before they’re born? Because the babies are actually babies even when they’re in there.

And I’m fairly moderate on abortion btw - I think it should be legal until around the point of viability.

I wonder how you’d feel if you were stabbed in the stomach the day before you were due to give birth to your much wanted baby, killing him/her. Would you consider it murder then? Or just nothing different than if you’d been stabbed when you weren’t pregnant?

Literally no one gets an “abortion” the day before their due date. You are stupid.
Stop repeating this idiotic Maga fiction point.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abortion - grew up thinking there was nothing wrong with having one, but now I think it's morally wrong except in the most extreme circumstances like incest rape. I think in many circumstances an abortion is one of the most cruel and selfish things a woman can do.

Public health care - I think all people should have access to medical care and used to think we needed a UK-style NHS, but working with the VA made me seriously rethink the US government's role ability to run a single payer system.

Gay rights - even in my liberal 80s home growing up my parents (like most I knew in the era) didn't think very highly about gay people and I was very late to the game to support gay marriage and adoption. I'm now very grateful we have national marriage equality.

Wow, this is the only abortion position I DONT understand! How is it so bad to force a raped woman to gestate that you would murder a baby to keep it from happening, but it’s okay to do it if she just got pregnant by accident and doesn’t want to gestate? And why is incest in there at all? The fetus doesn’t know or care about rape or incest? I just don’t get this. Like if the incest is consensual, why does that woman get to have an elective abortion but not other women?

I’m pro choice and this viewpoint is always the one I’ve held too. If you think abortion is murder of an innocent baby, why is it suddenly ok to murder an innocent baby because the baby is a product of incest or rape? The innocent baby didn’t rape anyone! You couldn’t murder the born baby just because his father was a rapist so why can you murder the unborn baby for that reason?

I think abortions should be legal for any reason before the age of viability. And I think the “no abortions except if rape” is hypocritical to the extreme.

Have you ever considered that there might be a shade or two of grey between "totally cool" and "murder"?

And what exactly is considered viability? That’s a bit of a moving target.

I changed my mind thanks to DCUM.

I used to think it was stupid and selfish to order bulky things like paper towels and dog food and have the poor delivery people delivering just pallets of stuff every day all day.

Then somebody pointed out that if everyone coordinated it's much more efficient to have one truck go through all the hoods and drop our stuff at our houses rather than all the drivers going all over to the different stores.

I don't think we have reached that ideal coordination but I do see the logic now.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Homelessness. Working in a field where the issue was adjacent to what we did, I learned a lot about them. The majority of them don't want "help" and "services" which means giving up their freedom and agency or means having to do something in return for shelter. They don't want job training or drug treatment. They don't want to live in a shelter. We should just give people housing and have some rules with it but there is a certain subset of people who are never going to function in society and there is no cure for it and they need to have a bathroom and bed and be able to sit inside during the day (shelters are only a place to sleep so they spend the day outdoors or prefer their tents). We also need to bring back mental institutions and allow families the ability to commit family members. It is a broken, useless system for most people. For those who do want a leg up and the help provided, more power to them! But it's a minority who do.

I agree about mental institutions but I can't imagine how they would be funded and where the work force would come from.

Commitment is done by a court, not by family members. And it used to be far too easy. In college I worked part time in a group home that existed because of a federal lawsuit regarding institutions in my state. We had clients who never needed to be locked up somewhere at all. PEople with EPILEPSY used to be locked up for their entire lives. People with cerebral palsy.
Because there was a federal lawsuit against the state, deinstitutionalization happened with funding, support, and resources. People would move to group homes, then often to independent living with or without high levels of supervision. Later in life, I was involved in disability advocacy. I met a woman whose first 50 years were spent in one of the institutions that was shuttered over time. She had an apartment and a fulltime job in food service at a state university. Before that, during the lawsuit, film footage taken surreptitiously by someone who had toured the facility showed things rooms with a dozen naked people in them at one time eating from trays on the floor. In the early 1970s.
"Mental institutions" as in public psychiatric hospitals have never disappeared. There are 195 of them in the US.
Permanent or very long-term residence in institutions inevitably leads to abuses of at least some of the people in them, whether in a nursing home, a correctional facility, or a state hospital. The more restricted the institution, the less likely people are to be protected from abuses. But more importantly, it does not equip them to live in society.
People are still committed, but the problem is the lack of resources when they get out. I know someone who was committed 1-2 times a year for close to twenty years. She repeatedly lost housing as a result. At very long last, because the legislature FINALLY appropriate some (far from enough) money, she spent a year in a transitional group living residence with a dozen other people after a short time in an immediate crisis facility able to house 20 people for up to a month at a time. She got help getting a public housing apartment (a pretty hideous building/apt but livable) and for the past several years has had medications brought to her twice daily and has a caseworker to set up help shopping for groceries and personal items and get to appointments. She's had one short term hospitalization in the last 4 years. She's now checking into a program that will help find her work for 20 hrs/week at a non-profit, like stocking shelves at a thrift store.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do ppl understand many of us dont think it’s murdering a baby?
From that standpoint, do you get why we therefore have no issue with abortion?

NP. No, some of us can’t see how (apparently) intelligent people think that an abortion the day before you give birth is not murdering a baby but waiting a day and someone murdering it when it’s born is actually murder. That’s just completely anti-science. Do people like yourself understand that doctors can now do operations on babies before they’re born? Because the babies are actually babies even when they’re in there.

And I’m fairly moderate on abortion btw - I think it should be legal until around the point of viability.

I wonder how you’d feel if you were stabbed in the stomach the day before you were due to give birth to your much wanted baby, killing him/her. Would you consider it murder then? Or just nothing different than if you’d been stabbed when you weren’t pregnant?

There was an article not long ago about a particular woman who went through a lot of hoops and expense to terminate a wanted pregnancy where there was a possibility of serious fetal defects but was not confirmed until late in the pregnancy, maybe 30 weeks, maybe a little more than that. At the clinic where she had the procedure done finally, there was a very young girl, maybe young as 12, near term. I forget the circumstances that resulted in her pregnancy, but she was 12. The doctor, who had absolutely compassion for her, would not terminate that pregnancy, which was healthy, and he is one of the few doctors who even do the procedure.

I hope that is your answer.

Googling people and online snooping for their homes/articles about them/employment... Years ago I thought it was awful to do, like violating privacy. Recently I found myself being more lax about reasons to do a search about someone. I still haven't searched 95% of my friends and acquaintances but I do online snooping about people I don't know much about so I feel informed. The tide turned for me when my kids started making friends with kids whose families I never met aside from brief texts and I want to know who and where they are.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abortion - grew up thinking there was nothing wrong with having one, but now I think it's morally wrong except in the most extreme circumstances like incest rape. I think in many circumstances an abortion is one of the most cruel and selfish things a woman can do.

Public health care - I think all people should have access to medical care and used to think we needed a UK-style NHS, but working with the VA made me seriously rethink the US government's role ability to run a single payer system.

Gay rights - even in my liberal 80s home growing up my parents (like most I knew in the era) didn't think very highly about gay people and I was very late to the game to support gay marriage and adoption. I'm now very grateful we have national marriage equality.

Wow, this is the only abortion position I DONT understand! How is it so bad to force a raped woman to gestate that you would murder a baby to keep it from happening, but it’s okay to do it if she just got pregnant by accident and doesn’t want to gestate? And why is incest in there at all? The fetus doesn’t know or care about rape or incest? I just don’t get this. Like if the incest is consensual, why does that woman get to have an elective abortion but not other women?

I’m pro choice and this viewpoint is always the one I’ve held too. If you think abortion is murder of an innocent baby, why is it suddenly ok to murder an innocent baby because the baby is a product of incest or rape? The innocent baby didn’t rape anyone! You couldn’t murder the born baby just because his father was a rapist so why can you murder the unborn baby for that reason?

I think abortions should be legal for any reason before the age of viability. And I think the “no abortions except if rape” is hypocritical to the extreme.

Have you ever considered that there might be a shade or two of grey between "totally cool" and "murder"?

Anonymous wrote:Jewish people are perpetual victims in society... sure look the perps to me in Israel these days...

Find a friend, borrow a pair of brain cells, rub them together for a while, and think about what you wrote.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do ppl understand many of us dont think it’s murdering a baby?
From that standpoint, do you get why we therefore have no issue with abortion?

NP. No, some of us can’t see how (apparently) intelligent people think that an abortion the day before you give birth is not murdering a baby but waiting a day and someone murdering it when it’s born is actually murder. That’s just completely anti-science. Do people like yourself understand that doctors can now do operations on babies before they’re born? Because the babies are actually babies even when they’re in there.

And I’m fairly moderate on abortion btw - I think it should be legal until around the point of viability.

I wonder how you’d feel if you were stabbed in the stomach the day before you were due to give birth to your much wanted baby, killing him/her. Would you consider it murder then? Or just nothing different than if you’d been stabbed when you weren’t pregnant?

Nobody is getting abortions the day before they are due to give birth. Third trimester abortions are always because there are extreme medical circumstances and require an OB to sign off on it. You can’t waltz down to an abortion clinic at 39 weeks and get one, they wouldn’t even have the right equipment for it.

This is where you realize how propaganda has strangled the brains of some people

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do ppl understand many of us dont think it’s murdering a baby?
From that standpoint, do you get why we therefore have no issue with abortion?

NP. No, some of us can’t see how (apparently) intelligent people think that an abortion the day before you give birth is not murdering a baby but waiting a day and someone murdering it when it’s born is actually murder. That’s just completely anti-science. Do people like yourself understand that doctors can now do operations on babies before they’re born? Because the babies are actually babies even when they’re in there.

And I’m fairly moderate on abortion btw - I think it should be legal until around the point of viability.

I wonder how you’d feel if you were stabbed in the stomach the day before you were due to give birth to your much wanted baby, killing him/her. Would you consider it murder then? Or just nothing different than if you’d been stabbed when you weren’t pregnant?

Nobody is getting abortions the day before they are due to give birth. Third trimester abortions are always because there are extreme medical circumstances and require an OB to sign off on it. You can’t waltz down to an abortion clinic at 39 weeks and get one, they wouldn’t even have the right equipment for it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do ppl understand many of us dont think it’s murdering a baby?
From that standpoint, do you get why we therefore have no issue with abortion?

NP. No, some of us can’t see how (apparently) intelligent people think that an abortion the day before you give birth is not murdering a baby but waiting a day and someone murdering it when it’s born is actually murder. That’s just completely anti-science. Do people like yourself understand that doctors can now do operations on babies before they’re born? Because the babies are actually babies even when they’re in there.

And I’m fairly moderate on abortion btw - I think it should be legal until around the point of viability.

I wonder how you’d feel if you were stabbed in the stomach the day before you were due to give birth to your much wanted baby, killing him/her. Would you consider it murder then? Or just nothing different than if you’d been stabbed when you weren’t pregnant?

Who exactly is demanding the right to have abortions at 9 months?

Anonymous wrote:Do ppl understand many of us dont think it’s murdering a baby?
From that standpoint, do you get why we therefore have no issue with abortion?

NP. No, some of us can’t see how (apparently) intelligent people think that an abortion the day before you give birth is not murdering a baby but waiting a day and someone murdering it when it’s born is actually murder. That’s just completely anti-science. Do people like yourself understand that doctors can now do operations on babies before they’re born? Because the babies are actually babies even when they’re in there.

And I’m fairly moderate on abortion btw - I think it should be legal until around the point of viability.

I wonder how you’d feel if you were stabbed in the stomach the day before you were due to give birth to your much wanted baby, killing him/her. Would you consider it murder then? Or just nothing different than if you’d been stabbed when you weren’t pregnant?