Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are some teachers and a small group of parents who are VERY VERY angry at DCPS. Then there are others who see things that could be improved. The V.V. Angry people place all blame on the mayor, but don't really have any comprehension of how changing mayoral control would solve any of the problems. They are just mad. It's like the people that were so mad that there was a Black president that they voted for Trump. It's not like he solved any problem at all, but that vote satisfied their need to "stick it to authority" or something.

? The mayor framed mayoral control as important bc “schools weren’t getting textbooks on time.”

This year alone:
Many schools don’t have functioning hvac
Many schools don’t have water
Many schools have staffing shortages
Teachers can’t get access to their contractual supply funds bc OCTO can’t figure out how to distribute without getting hacked

These are four major problems that could probably be satisfied if it wasn’t one big circle of people being appointed into patronage jobs by a mayor, and instead a system of checks and balances.

Much prefer patronage jobs as opposed to a union-controlled OSSE and/or DCPS. In case you missed it the union shut down the schools. That’s kinda a bigger deal than anything else.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. OSSE is NOT controlled by teachers, where do you get your info from??
2. Mayoral control of schools needs better balances. Why can we not have mayoral control and a school board?
3. Please stop trying to paint teachers as villains, most of us work really hard and dcps is not the best working environment, there are still 60+ teacher vacancies and I’m sure some of your children have had to deal with the repercussions of this.

You only see part of the story. Tell me how you can do your job if you and your ‘clients,’ patients, or whomever are sweating buckets, or freezing?
If your clients have sensory issues and the lights won’t turn off or dim, even though you are supposed to serve them according to their needs?
If there’s a gas leak.
A hole in the roof?
Sewage leaks?
You don’t have all the materials necessary for your job?

I could go on. Teachers are by far not the only voices that should be heard but people who are on the frontlines have ideas about how to make things better.

I want evaluations, from someone knowledgeable about my program. Someone who knows how to make me a stronger teacher. I like the school rating system if only it wasn’t just about standardized testing, those scores only give you a small picture.

Sigh, my point is that mayoral control has not improved outcomes in this city as much as I think our students deserve. We have to invest in teachers, paras, school infrastructure, and appropriate materials. Not just what we think looks good.

You have no idea what happens at some of these schools do you? I’m actually a school counselor, not a teacher. We often don’t have a math teacher for an entire year and the kids miss that entire year of math. Impact is partly but not entirely responsible for driving some decent teachers away. I don’t think most of you have any clue what happens within schools especially ward 8 schools. Impact is based on one 30 minute evaluation and it is supposed to be a snapshot of the whole year. Is that how your evaluations are done? What if the teacher has one bad day but surprise - that is the day the administrator walks in to do their 20-30 minute evaluation. Often, the administrator has no content level knowledge of the subject the teacher is teaching. So it could be an administrator who used to be a PE or music teacher who is now doing the Impact evaluation of a physics teacher. Is that fair? And plenty of crappy teachers get a good impact score because they are friends with the principal. I am so thankful I am not a teacher. And again, most other districts don’t have an Impact type evaluation but end up with overall stronger performance even in their poorest schools. It makes you wonder what Impact is achieving. Punitive systems tend to be less effective than setups where they genuinely try to support you to help you improve

Um you read my message incorrectly. Also I’ll do you one better, I am a self contained teacher. I’m so sick of JUST hearing about ward 8 when there are title 1 schools in other locations and yes I work at a title 1 school. Please stop with this ‘only my students matter BS, they ALL matter.

Not sure why you are getting on your soapbox to a teacher who just stated that the infrastructure, school environment, and materials provided impacts a teacher’s ability to teach.

oh, it’s Self Contained Teacher. Where’s that Twitter thread you promised?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. OSSE is NOT controlled by teachers, where do you get your info from??
2. Mayoral control of schools needs better balances. Why can we not have mayoral control and a school board?
3. Please stop trying to paint teachers as villains, most of us work really hard and dcps is not the best working environment, there are still 60+ teacher vacancies and I’m sure some of your children have had to deal with the repercussions of this.

You only see part of the story. Tell me how you can do your job if you and your ‘clients,’ patients, or whomever are sweating buckets, or freezing?
If your clients have sensory issues and the lights won’t turn off or dim, even though you are supposed to serve them according to their needs?
If there’s a gas leak.
A hole in the roof?
Sewage leaks?
You don’t have all the materials necessary for your job?

I could go on. Teachers are by far not the only voices that should be heard but people who are on the frontlines have ideas about how to make things better.

I want evaluations, from someone knowledgeable about my program. Someone who knows how to make me a stronger teacher. I like the school rating system if only it wasn’t just about standardized testing, those scores only give you a small picture.

Sigh, my point is that mayoral control has not improved outcomes in this city as much as I think our students deserve. We have to invest in teachers, paras, school infrastructure, and appropriate materials. Not just what we think looks good.

You have no idea what happens at some of these schools do you? I’m actually a school counselor, not a teacher. We often don’t have a math teacher for an entire year and the kids miss that entire year of math. Impact is partly but not entirely responsible for driving some decent teachers away. I don’t think most of you have any clue what happens within schools especially ward 8 schools. Impact is based on one 30 minute evaluation and it is supposed to be a snapshot of the whole year. Is that how your evaluations are done? What if the teacher has one bad day but surprise - that is the day the administrator walks in to do their 20-30 minute evaluation. Often, the administrator has no content level knowledge of the subject the teacher is teaching. So it could be an administrator who used to be a PE or music teacher who is now doing the Impact evaluation of a physics teacher. Is that fair? And plenty of crappy teachers get a good impact score because they are friends with the principal. I am so thankful I am not a teacher. And again, most other districts don’t have an Impact type evaluation but end up with overall stronger performance even in their poorest schools. It makes you wonder what Impact is achieving. Punitive systems tend to be less effective than setups where they genuinely try to support you to help you improve

Um you read my message incorrectly. Also I’ll do you one better, I am a self contained teacher. I’m so sick of JUST hearing about ward 8 when there are title 1 schools in other locations and yes I work at a title 1 school. Please stop with this ‘only my students matter BS, they ALL matter.

Not sure why you are getting on your soapbox to a teacher who just stated that the infrastructure, school environment, and materials provided impacts a teacher’s ability to teach.

Gotta say that I am also not understanding why social worker is picking on the teacher who is basically agreeing with her.

Also, IMPACT isn't just a single 30 minute evaluation. Your points take into account a bunch of other things: For example, here's one guidebook: see page 44. https://dcps.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/dcps/publication/attachments/1.Teachers_Grades_4plus_with%20Individual_Value-Added_Student_Achievement_and_Student_Survey_Data.pdf

For many teachers it is 75% of the score

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. OSSE is NOT controlled by teachers, where do you get your info from??
2. Mayoral control of schools needs better balances. Why can we not have mayoral control and a school board?
3. Please stop trying to paint teachers as villains, most of us work really hard and dcps is not the best working environment, there are still 60+ teacher vacancies and I’m sure some of your children have had to deal with the repercussions of this.

You only see part of the story. Tell me how you can do your job if you and your ‘clients,’ patients, or whomever are sweating buckets, or freezing?
If your clients have sensory issues and the lights won’t turn off or dim, even though you are supposed to serve them according to their needs?
If there’s a gas leak.
A hole in the roof?
Sewage leaks?
You don’t have all the materials necessary for your job?

I could go on. Teachers are by far not the only voices that should be heard but people who are on the frontlines have ideas about how to make things better.

I want evaluations, from someone knowledgeable about my program. Someone who knows how to make me a stronger teacher. I like the school rating system if only it wasn’t just about standardized testing, those scores only give you a small picture.

Sigh, my point is that mayoral control has not improved outcomes in this city as much as I think our students deserve. We have to invest in teachers, paras, school infrastructure, and appropriate materials. Not just what we think looks good.

You have no idea what happens at some of these schools do you? I’m actually a school counselor, not a teacher. We often don’t have a math teacher for an entire year and the kids miss that entire year of math. Impact is partly but not entirely responsible for driving some decent teachers away. I don’t think most of you have any clue what happens within schools especially ward 8 schools. Impact is based on one 30 minute evaluation and it is supposed to be a snapshot of the whole year. Is that how your evaluations are done? What if the teacher has one bad day but surprise - that is the day the administrator walks in to do their 20-30 minute evaluation. Often, the administrator has no content level knowledge of the subject the teacher is teaching. So it could be an administrator who used to be a PE or music teacher who is now doing the Impact evaluation of a physics teacher. Is that fair? And plenty of crappy teachers get a good impact score because they are friends with the principal. I am so thankful I am not a teacher. And again, most other districts don’t have an Impact type evaluation but end up with overall stronger performance even in their poorest schools. It makes you wonder what Impact is achieving. Punitive systems tend to be less effective than setups where they genuinely try to support you to help you improve

Um you read my message incorrectly. Also I’ll do you one better, I am a self contained teacher. I’m so sick of JUST hearing about ward 8 when there are title 1 schools in other locations and yes I work at a title 1 school. Please stop with this ‘only my students matter BS, they ALL matter.

Not sure why you are getting on your soapbox to a teacher who just stated that the infrastructure, school environment, and materials provided impacts a teacher’s ability to teach.

Gotta say that I am also not understanding why social worker is picking on the teacher who is basically agreeing with her.

Also, IMPACT isn't just a single 30 minute evaluation. Your points take into account a bunch of other things: For example, here's one guidebook: see page 44. https://dcps.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/dcps/publication/attachments/1.Teachers_Grades_4plus_with%20Individual_Value-Added_Student_Achievement_and_Student_Survey_Data.pdf

Anonymous wrote:Also it appears as though if on the day the 30-min evaluation took place everything in the classroom went to hell (resulting in a low score), you get a second opportunity for evaluation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. OSSE is NOT controlled by teachers, where do you get your info from??
2. Mayoral control of schools needs better balances. Why can we not have mayoral control and a school board?
3. Please stop trying to paint teachers as villains, most of us work really hard and dcps is not the best working environment, there are still 60+ teacher vacancies and I’m sure some of your children have had to deal with the repercussions of this.

You only see part of the story. Tell me how you can do your job if you and your ‘clients,’ patients, or whomever are sweating buckets, or freezing?
If your clients have sensory issues and the lights won’t turn off or dim, even though you are supposed to serve them according to their needs?
If there’s a gas leak.
A hole in the roof?
Sewage leaks?
You don’t have all the materials necessary for your job?

I could go on. Teachers are by far not the only voices that should be heard but people who are on the frontlines have ideas about how to make things better.

I want evaluations, from someone knowledgeable about my program. Someone who knows how to make me a stronger teacher. I like the school rating system if only it wasn’t just about standardized testing, those scores only give you a small picture.

Sigh, my point is that mayoral control has not improved outcomes in this city as much as I think our students deserve. We have to invest in teachers, paras, school infrastructure, and appropriate materials. Not just what we think looks good.

You have no idea what happens at some of these schools do you? I’m actually a school counselor, not a teacher. We often don’t have a math teacher for an entire year and the kids miss that entire year of math. Impact is partly but not entirely responsible for driving some decent teachers away. I don’t think most of you have any clue what happens within schools especially ward 8 schools. Impact is based on one 30 minute evaluation and it is supposed to be a snapshot of the whole year. Is that how your evaluations are done? What if the teacher has one bad day but surprise - that is the day the administrator walks in to do their 20-30 minute evaluation. Often, the administrator has no content level knowledge of the subject the teacher is teaching. So it could be an administrator who used to be a PE or music teacher who is now doing the Impact evaluation of a physics teacher. Is that fair? And plenty of crappy teachers get a good impact score because they are friends with the principal. I am so thankful I am not a teacher. And again, most other districts don’t have an Impact type evaluation but end up with overall stronger performance even in their poorest schools. It makes you wonder what Impact is achieving. Punitive systems tend to be less effective than setups where they genuinely try to support you to help you improve

Um you read my message incorrectly. Also I’ll do you one better, I am a self contained teacher. I’m so sick of JUST hearing about ward 8 when there are title 1 schools in other locations and yes I work at a title 1 school. Please stop with this ‘only my students matter BS, they ALL matter.

Not sure why you are getting on your soapbox to a teacher who just stated that the infrastructure, school environment, and materials provided impacts a teacher’s ability to teach.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. OSSE is NOT controlled by teachers, where do you get your info from??
2. Mayoral control of schools needs better balances. Why can we not have mayoral control and a school board?
3. Please stop trying to paint teachers as villains, most of us work really hard and dcps is not the best working environment, there are still 60+ teacher vacancies and I’m sure some of your children have had to deal with the repercussions of this.

You only see part of the story. Tell me how you can do your job if you and your ‘clients,’ patients, or whomever are sweating buckets, or freezing?
If your clients have sensory issues and the lights won’t turn off or dim, even though you are supposed to serve them according to their needs?
If there’s a gas leak.
A hole in the roof?
Sewage leaks?
You don’t have all the materials necessary for your job?

I could go on. Teachers are by far not the only voices that should be heard but people who are on the frontlines have ideas about how to make things better.

I want evaluations, from someone knowledgeable about my program. Someone who knows how to make me a stronger teacher. I like the school rating system if only it wasn’t just about standardized testing, those scores only give you a small picture.

Sigh, my point is that mayoral control has not improved outcomes in this city as much as I think our students deserve. We have to invest in teachers, paras, school infrastructure, and appropriate materials. Not just what we think looks good.

You have no idea what happens at some of these schools do you? I’m actually a school counselor, not a teacher. We often don’t have a math teacher for an entire year and the kids miss that entire year of math. Impact is partly but not entirely responsible for driving some decent teachers away. I don’t think most of you have any clue what happens within schools especially ward 8 schools. Impact is based on one 30 minute evaluation and it is supposed to be a snapshot of the whole year. Is that how your evaluations are done? What if the teacher has one bad day but surprise - that is the day the administrator walks in to do their 20-30 minute evaluation. Often, the administrator has no content level knowledge of the subject the teacher is teaching. So it could be an administrator who used to be a PE or music teacher who is now doing the Impact evaluation of a physics teacher. Is that fair? And plenty of crappy teachers get a good impact score because they are friends with the principal. I am so thankful I am not a teacher. And again, most other districts don’t have an Impact type evaluation but end up with overall stronger performance even in their poorest schools. It makes you wonder what Impact is achieving. Punitive systems tend to be less effective than setups where they genuinely try to support you to help you improve

Um you read my message incorrectly. Also I’ll do you one better, I am a self contained teacher. I’m so sick of JUST hearing about ward 8 when there are title 1 schools in other locations and yes I work at a title 1 school. Please stop with this ‘only my students matter BS, they ALL matter.

Not sure why you are getting on your soapbox to a teacher who just stated that the infrastructure, school environment, and materials provided impacts a teacher’s ability to teach.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. OSSE is NOT controlled by teachers, where do you get your info from??
2. Mayoral control of schools needs better balances. Why can we not have mayoral control and a school board?
3. Please stop trying to paint teachers as villains, most of us work really hard and dcps is not the best working environment, there are still 60+ teacher vacancies and I’m sure some of your children have had to deal with the repercussions of this.

You only see part of the story. Tell me how you can do your job if you and your ‘clients,’ patients, or whomever are sweating buckets, or freezing?
If your clients have sensory issues and the lights won’t turn off or dim, even though you are supposed to serve them according to their needs?
If there’s a gas leak.
A hole in the roof?
Sewage leaks?
You don’t have all the materials necessary for your job?

I could go on. Teachers are by far not the only voices that should be heard but people who are on the frontlines have ideas about how to make things better.

I want evaluations, from someone knowledgeable about my program. Someone who knows how to make me a stronger teacher. I like the school rating system if only it wasn’t just about standardized testing, those scores only give you a small picture.

Sigh, my point is that mayoral control has not improved outcomes in this city as much as I think our students deserve. We have to invest in teachers, paras, school infrastructure, and appropriate materials. Not just what we think looks good.

You have no idea what happens at some of these schools do you? I’m actually a school counselor, not a teacher. We often don’t have a math teacher for an entire year and the kids miss that entire year of math. Impact is partly but not entirely responsible for driving some decent teachers away. I don’t think most of you have any clue what happens within schools especially ward 8 schools. Impact is based on one 30 minute evaluation and it is supposed to be a snapshot of the whole year. Is that how your evaluations are done? What if the teacher has one bad day but surprise - that is the day the administrator walks in to do their 20-30 minute evaluation. Often, the administrator has no content level knowledge of the subject the teacher is teaching. So it could be an administrator who used to be a PE or music teacher who is now doing the Impact evaluation of a physics teacher. Is that fair? And plenty of crappy teachers get a good impact score because they are friends with the principal. I am so thankful I am not a teacher. And again, most other districts don’t have an Impact type evaluation but end up with overall stronger performance even in their poorest schools. It makes you wonder what Impact is achieving. Punitive systems tend to be less effective than setups where they genuinely try to support you to help you improve

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. OSSE is NOT controlled by teachers, where do you get your info from??
2. Mayoral control of schools needs better balances. Why can we not have mayoral control and a school board?
3. Please stop trying to paint teachers as villains, most of us work really hard and dcps is not the best working environment, there are still 60+ teacher vacancies and I’m sure some of your children have had to deal with the repercussions of this.

You only see part of the story. Tell me how you can do your job if you and your ‘clients,’ patients, or whomever are sweating buckets, or freezing?
If your clients have sensory issues and the lights won’t turn off or dim, even though you are supposed to serve them according to their needs?
If there’s a gas leak.
A hole in the roof?
Sewage leaks?
You don’t have all the materials necessary for your job?

I could go on. Teachers are by far not the only voices that should be heard but people who are on the frontlines have ideas about how to make things better.

I want evaluations, from someone knowledgeable about my program. Someone who knows how to make me a stronger teacher. I like the school rating system if only it wasn’t just about standardized testing, those scores only give you a small picture.

Sigh, my point is that mayoral control has not improved outcomes in this city as much as I think our students deserve. We have to invest in teachers, paras, school infrastructure, and appropriate materials. Not just what we think looks good.

You have no idea what happens at some of these schools do you? I’m actually a school counselor, not a teacher. We often don’t have a math teacher for an entire year and the kids miss that entire year of math. Impact is partly but not entirely responsible for driving some decent teachers away. I don’t think most of you have any clue what happens within schools especially ward 8 schools. Impact is based on one 30 minute evaluation and it is supposed to be a snapshot of the whole year. Is that how your evaluations are done? What if the teacher has one bad day but surprise - that is the day the administrator walks in to do their 20-30 minute evaluation. Often, the administrator has no content level knowledge of the subject the teacher is teaching. So it could be an administrator who used to be a PE or music teacher who is now doing the Impact evaluation of a physics teacher. Is that fair? And plenty of crappy teachers get a good impact score because they are friends with the principal. I am so thankful I am not a teacher. And again, most other districts don’t have an Impact type evaluation but end up with overall stronger performance even in their poorest schools. It makes you wonder what Impact is achieving. Punitive systems tend to be less effective than setups where they genuinely try to support you to help you improve

Anonymous wrote:1. OSSE is NOT controlled by teachers, where do you get your info from??
2. Mayoral control of schools needs better balances. Why can we not have mayoral control and a school board?
3. Please stop trying to paint teachers as villains, most of us work really hard and dcps is not the best working environment, there are still 60+ teacher vacancies and I’m sure some of your children have had to deal with the repercussions of this.

You only see part of the story. Tell me how you can do your job if you and your ‘clients,’ patients, or whomever are sweating buckets, or freezing?
If your clients have sensory issues and the lights won’t turn off or dim, even though you are supposed to serve them according to their needs?
If there’s a gas leak.
A hole in the roof?
Sewage leaks?
You don’t have all the materials necessary for your job?

I could go on. Teachers are by far not the only voices that should be heard but people who are on the frontlines have ideas about how to make things better.

I want evaluations, from someone knowledgeable about my program. Someone who knows how to make me a stronger teacher. I like the school rating system if only it wasn’t just about standardized testing, those scores only give you a small picture.

Sigh, my point is that mayoral control has not improved outcomes in this city as much as I think our students deserve. We have to invest in teachers, paras, school infrastructure, and appropriate materials. Not just what we think looks good.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are some teachers and a small group of parents who are VERY VERY angry at DCPS. Then there are others who see things that could be improved. The V.V. Angry people place all blame on the mayor, but don't really have any comprehension of how changing mayoral control would solve any of the problems. They are just mad. It's like the people that were so mad that there was a Black president that they voted for Trump. It's not like he solved any problem at all, but that vote satisfied their need to "stick it to authority" or something.

You’re missing some key parts of the puzzle. The people behind “End Mayoral Control” are the ones who are very unhappy about educational reforms that allowed for charters in DC and accountability for DC teachers, in the form of standardized assessments (PARCC) and IMPACT, which rates teachers on their effectiveness. These are seen as outgrowths of mayoral control and other reforms accelerated by Fenty/Rhee. One big unhappy group is the WTU.

The other piece of the puzzle is the mayor race. CM Robert White is running against Bowser and is using “end mayoral control” as a way to gain points against her by hand-waving about what a terrible job she is doing.

So yeah - If you want to go back to the days when we had no charter options, no way to measure the effectiveness of instruction, and no way to fire bad teachers … end mayoral control!

Ma’am sir are you an educator or in education? If not, then you have no platform to stand on in regards to Impact and PARCC

Do you have an actual argument?

Sure. You can read the 50+ page American university study on Impact, or any literature on PARCC.

Or you could spend six months in any DCPS school and see how biased IMPACT is depending on the admin.

Or you could continue to bury your head in the sand and think teachers are idiots who should be told what to do by a mayoral system that dehumanizes them.

But thanks for checking. I don’t really know why I bothered responding the DCUM tea leaves make it very clear where you all stand

I get rated every year at my job. almost everyone does.

Do you get rated on stuff that you have absolutely no control over? Why do you think Ballou, Woodson and Anacostia HS keep losing math teachers? One reason is that they get rated on impact for how well they are teaching grade level math (9th, 10th, or whatever grade level they teach) when the reality is that kids often come into HS at a 4th or 5th grade math level.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are some teachers and a small group of parents who are VERY VERY angry at DCPS. Then there are others who see things that could be improved. The V.V. Angry people place all blame on the mayor, but don't really have any comprehension of how changing mayoral control would solve any of the problems. They are just mad. It's like the people that were so mad that there was a Black president that they voted for Trump. It's not like he solved any problem at all, but that vote satisfied their need to "stick it to authority" or something.

You’re missing some key parts of the puzzle. The people behind “End Mayoral Control” are the ones who are very unhappy about educational reforms that allowed for charters in DC and accountability for DC teachers, in the form of standardized assessments (PARCC) and IMPACT, which rates teachers on their effectiveness. These are seen as outgrowths of mayoral control and other reforms accelerated by Fenty/Rhee. One big unhappy group is the WTU.

The other piece of the puzzle is the mayor race. CM Robert White is running against Bowser and is using “end mayoral control” as a way to gain points against her by hand-waving about what a terrible job she is doing.

So yeah - If you want to go back to the days when we had no charter options, no way to measure the effectiveness of instruction, and no way to fire bad teachers … end mayoral control!

Ma’am sir are you an educator or in education? If not, then you have no platform to stand on in regards to Impact and PARCC

Do you have an actual argument?

Sure. You can read the 50+ page American university study on Impact, or any literature on PARCC.

Or you could spend six months in any DCPS school and see how biased IMPACT is depending on the admin.

Or you could continue to bury your head in the sand and think teachers are idiots who should be told what to do by a mayoral system that dehumanizes them.

But thanks for checking. I don’t really know why I bothered responding the DCUM tea leaves make it very clear where you all stand

I get rated every year at my job. almost everyone does.

Do you get rated on stuff that you have absolutely no control over? Why do you think Ballou, Woodson and Anacostia HS keep losing math teachers? One reason is that they get rated on impact for how well they are teaching grade level math (9th, 10th, or whatever grade level they teach) when the reality is that kids often come into HS at a 4th or 5th grade math level.