Anonymous
08/09/2020 08:39
Subject: Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:Here is a real world example of how socioeconomic creates different opinions on education and why the gap:
School supplies.
A middle income parent makes sure they have $20 so they can buy the school supplies needed. Because education is important. And having the right tools is important. So to support their child's education, they buy the supplies. Even if that means they don't buy themselves something. Because education is important. They tell their child to keep track, to take care of the supplies because replacing them costs money.
But for FARMS parents is that the case? Or is that they expect the school to provide the school supplies? At this point, yes, I think that's very often the case. I think school supplies drives are so big at this point that they don't even realize that parents are actually supposed to buy the items. If these parents valued education, why not save up? Put the money aside, buy the necessary items. Support their child's education. Be invested.
So it's not PC but I think PTAs in high FARMS schools need to stop supply drives, reduce the supply list and tell parents they need to provide the supplies. Because that is supporting their child's education. That it's the first step to being invested. And the truth is whether people want to admit or hear it, that yes, sometimes people just need to be told. And that goes for all socioeconomic levels.
You sound like a person who has never met a poor person much less been poor. You hurt other people with your ignorance. Please, just shut up.
Anonymous
08/08/2020 20:49
Subject: Re:Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:None of that was meant to be addressed.
But that’s the whole point, is that it? I wanted to know whether ALL the kids were better off. Did they get the new microscopes and gym clothes that were mentioned at the start? Are the original kids doing the IB program, maybe with Spanish instead of French, and is that degree helping them?
Instead we get just TWO parents who don’t get along. A dad who can’t coordinate with anybody else and a pta president who is sulking so badly about being knocked off her cozy perch (even if she was doing nothing when the school was at 35% occupancy) that she refuses to attend a funding meeting she was definitely invited to.
I wanted to hear from more/different parents and more kids about how this actually affected them. Not an hour about these two feuding bozos.
Well the school got enough children to continue to operate, so there’s that.
Anonymous
08/08/2020 19:38
Subject: Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Listening to the podcast and I find it interesting. One of our kids goes to a high FARMs focus school that is ripped on DCUM as a bad school. But, our advanced kid is doing really well there and loves it. I've asked her if there are fights or disruptive behavior and she said not often. There's also a mix of races in her classes so it isn't like the white kids take up all, or even a majority, of the seats in the gifted/advanced classes.
I read here that poorer parents aren't involved. But that's not my experience. The black and Hispanic parents go to all the events and contribute. I doubt they are able to afford to contribute in all the same ways as the higher income parents but that's how society works.
I did have to adapt to the fact that things do, like the podcast says, seem more chaotic and loud. There's always a dull roar from the crowd at, say, back to school night, that just doesn't exist in the whiter schools. Part of that is that immigrant and minority families bring the whole family to these events rather than just the mom or dad. Also, there's a main speaker in English at the front of the room and a translator for spanish in the back. It turns out that integration doesn't mean conformity. We don't just take students from different cultures and countries and integrate them into our culture. We have to integrate WITH them and it's a bit of a culture shock at first. I can see why it scares some parents away. But I'm glad we stuck it out because our kid is happy and doing well.
I don’t know why we can’t just let people be happy with something even if we think it wouldn’t work for us.
Wait until college before you talk up a crummy high school. Or the first couple of boyfriends.
All kids are benchmarked using the same tests so I am able to compare my child's performance against the district and national performance. She's doing well above average. Also, it's not a crummy school. It's a school with lower SES children.
Anonymous
08/08/2020 18:52
Subject: Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Listening to the podcast and I find it interesting. One of our kids goes to a high FARMs focus school that is ripped on DCUM as a bad school. But, our advanced kid is doing really well there and loves it. I've asked her if there are fights or disruptive behavior and she said not often. There's also a mix of races in her classes so it isn't like the white kids take up all, or even a majority, of the seats in the gifted/advanced classes.
I read here that poorer parents aren't involved. But that's not my experience. The black and Hispanic parents go to all the events and contribute. I doubt they are able to afford to contribute in all the same ways as the higher income parents but that's how society works.
I did have to adapt to the fact that things do, like the podcast says, seem more chaotic and loud. There's always a dull roar from the crowd at, say, back to school night, that just doesn't exist in the whiter schools. Part of that is that immigrant and minority families bring the whole family to these events rather than just the mom or dad. Also, there's a main speaker in English at the front of the room and a translator for spanish in the back. It turns out that integration doesn't mean conformity. We don't just take students from different cultures and countries and integrate them into our culture. We have to integrate WITH them and it's a bit of a culture shock at first. I can see why it scares some parents away. But I'm glad we stuck it out because our kid is happy and doing well.
Wait until college before you talk up a crummy high school. Or the first couple of boyfriends.
All kids are benchmarked using the same tests so I am able to compare my child's performance against the district and national performance. She's doing well above average. Also, it's not a crummy school. It's a school with lower SES children.
Anonymous
08/08/2020 18:41
Subject: Re:Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:None of that was meant to be addressed.
But that’s the whole point, is that it? I wanted to know whether ALL the kids were better off. Did they get the new microscopes and gym clothes that were mentioned at the start? Are the original kids doing the IB program, maybe with Spanish instead of French, and is that degree helping them?
Instead we get just TWO parents who don’t get along. A dad who can’t coordinate with anybody else and a pta president who is sulking so badly about being knocked off her cozy perch (even if she was doing nothing when the school was at 35% occupancy) that she refuses to attend a funding meeting she was definitely invited to.
I wanted to hear from more/different parents and more kids about how this actually affected them. Not an hour about these two feuding bozos.
Anonymous
08/08/2020 14:11
Subject: Nice White Parents
I’m very grateful that I can live in my bubble and not think about any of this stuff.g
Anonymous
08/08/2020 13:41
Subject: Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:Listening to the podcast and I find it interesting. One of our kids goes to a high FARMs focus school that is ripped on DCUM as a bad school. But, our advanced kid is doing really well there and loves it. I've asked her if there are fights or disruptive behavior and she said not often. There's also a mix of races in her classes so it isn't like the white kids take up all, or even a majority, of the seats in the gifted/advanced classes.
I read here that poorer parents aren't involved. But that's not my experience. The black and Hispanic parents go to all the events and contribute. I doubt they are able to afford to contribute in all the same ways as the higher income parents but that's how society works.
I did have to adapt to the fact that things do, like the podcast says, seem more chaotic and loud. There's always a dull roar from the crowd at, say, back to school night, that just doesn't exist in the whiter schools. Part of that is that immigrant and minority families bring the whole family to these events rather than just the mom or dad. Also, there's a main speaker in English at the front of the room and a translator for spanish in the back. It turns out that integration doesn't mean conformity. We don't just take students from different cultures and countries and integrate them into our culture. We have to integrate WITH them and it's a bit of a culture shock at first. I can see why it scares some parents away. But I'm glad we stuck it out because our kid is happy and doing well.
Wait until college before you talk up a crummy high school. Or the first couple of boyfriends.
Anonymous
08/08/2020 12:40
Subject: Nice White Parents
Listening to the podcast and I find it interesting. One of our kids goes to a high FARMs focus school that is ripped on DCUM as a bad school. But, our advanced kid is doing really well there and loves it. I've asked her if there are fights or disruptive behavior and she said not often. There's also a mix of races in her classes so it isn't like the white kids take up all, or even a majority, of the seats in the gifted/advanced classes.
I read here that poorer parents aren't involved. But that's not my experience. The black and Hispanic parents go to all the events and contribute. I doubt they are able to afford to contribute in all the same ways as the higher income parents but that's how society works.
I did have to adapt to the fact that things do, like the podcast says, seem more chaotic and loud. There's always a dull roar from the crowd at, say, back to school night, that just doesn't exist in the whiter schools. Part of that is that immigrant and minority families bring the whole family to these events rather than just the mom or dad. Also, there's a main speaker in English at the front of the room and a translator for spanish in the back. It turns out that integration doesn't mean conformity. We don't just take students from different cultures and countries and integrate them into our culture. We have to integrate WITH them and it's a bit of a culture shock at first. I can see why it scares some parents away. But I'm glad we stuck it out because our kid is happy and doing well.
I read here that poorer parents aren't involved. But that's not my experience. The black and Hispanic parents go to all the events and contribute. I doubt they are able to afford to contribute in all the same ways as the higher income parents but that's how society works.
I did have to adapt to the fact that things do, like the podcast says, seem more chaotic and loud. There's always a dull roar from the crowd at, say, back to school night, that just doesn't exist in the whiter schools. Part of that is that immigrant and minority families bring the whole family to these events rather than just the mom or dad. Also, there's a main speaker in English at the front of the room and a translator for spanish in the back. It turns out that integration doesn't mean conformity. We don't just take students from different cultures and countries and integrate them into our culture. We have to integrate WITH them and it's a bit of a culture shock at first. I can see why it scares some parents away. But I'm glad we stuck it out because our kid is happy and doing well.
Anonymous
08/08/2020 12:02
Subject: Nice White Parents
Crummy schools have had trillions dumped into them over the last 40 years. People do not change. Whether it’s culture or genetics, I don’t know. What I do know is that the needle NEVER moves. All the so called improvements are fake, the result of cheating, data juking and other manipulating schemes. And we need stop painting inner city teachers and admins as selfless saints. The most unqualified POS six-figure admins I’ve ever dealt with were inner city admins.
Anonymous
08/07/2020 23:04
Subject: Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:Here is a real world example of how socioeconomic creates different opinions on education and why the gap:
School supplies.
A middle income parent makes sure they have $20 so they can buy the school supplies needed. Because education is important. And having the right tools is important. So to support their child's education, they buy the supplies. Even if that means they don't buy themselves something. Because education is important. They tell their child to keep track, to take care of the supplies because replacing them costs money.
But for FARMS parents is that the case? Or is that they expect the school to provide the school supplies? At this point, yes, I think that's very often the case. I think school supplies drives are so big at this point that they don't even realize that parents are actually supposed to buy the items. If these parents valued education, why not save up? Put the money aside, buy the necessary items. Support their child's education. Be invested.
So it's not PC but I think PTAs in high FARMS schools need to stop supply drives, reduce the supply list and tell parents they need to provide the supplies. Because that is supporting their child's education. That it's the first step to being invested. And the truth is whether people want to admit or hear it, that yes, sometimes people just need to be told. And that goes for all socioeconomic levels.
Hispanic community doesn't get that they have to participate in schools, if you explain it to them they can adapt. Poor whites and blacks are just incompetent.
Anonymous
08/07/2020 20:40
Subject: Re:Nice White Parents
None of that was meant to be addressed.
Anonymous
08/07/2020 20:10
Subject: Nice White Parents
NP. Agree that the PTA president should have been looped in to ensure all kids benefited from the new funding. That’s the principal’s job, although the dad could have been more inclusive. There seemed to be blame enough to go around.
Because the dad is getting some well-deserved blame, I’ll give equal time to the PTA president. TBH the PTA president seemed a bit whiny and sulky, not even showing up to a key funding meeting. It seemed like she had this comfy thing going, but the school was failing and would have probably disappeared in a few years—there were only 35 kids in a class meant for 100, for Pete’s sake. I get that the PTA president didn’t think she’d like the funding arrangements. But that’s no excuse to stay home sulking. As PTA president it was her JOB to attend meetings like this, precisely to make sure all kids benefitted from the funding.
Spanish immersion instead? Could be. But as the author mentions at the start, Cobble Hill residents have 11-12 local schools to choose from, and I’d bet one of them is Spanish immersion. My cousins live on Cobble Hill and I believe there’s also an Arabic immersion program somewhere in Brooklyn, although I don’t know if Cobble Hill is eligible (my cousins went private).
What I really wanted to know—and which the show never said—was whether all kids benefited in some way from the new funding, even if they didn’t do French. Did the science teacher get the new microscopes, did the gym teacher get the new uniforms, that were mentioned at the beginning of the program? Did kids who didn’t do the French part still benefit from the introduction of the IB program, which could be done with Spanish if the school just kept on the Spanish teacher? The show mentions one kid who doesn’t fit into a French after school play, but were there other acting opportunities? We don’t get ANY of these answers from the broadcast.
Because the dad is getting some well-deserved blame, I’ll give equal time to the PTA president. TBH the PTA president seemed a bit whiny and sulky, not even showing up to a key funding meeting. It seemed like she had this comfy thing going, but the school was failing and would have probably disappeared in a few years—there were only 35 kids in a class meant for 100, for Pete’s sake. I get that the PTA president didn’t think she’d like the funding arrangements. But that’s no excuse to stay home sulking. As PTA president it was her JOB to attend meetings like this, precisely to make sure all kids benefitted from the funding.
Spanish immersion instead? Could be. But as the author mentions at the start, Cobble Hill residents have 11-12 local schools to choose from, and I’d bet one of them is Spanish immersion. My cousins live on Cobble Hill and I believe there’s also an Arabic immersion program somewhere in Brooklyn, although I don’t know if Cobble Hill is eligible (my cousins went private).
What I really wanted to know—and which the show never said—was whether all kids benefited in some way from the new funding, even if they didn’t do French. Did the science teacher get the new microscopes, did the gym teacher get the new uniforms, that were mentioned at the beginning of the program? Did kids who didn’t do the French part still benefit from the introduction of the IB program, which could be done with Spanish if the school just kept on the Spanish teacher? The show mentions one kid who doesn’t fit into a French after school play, but were there other acting opportunities? We don’t get ANY of these answers from the broadcast.
Anonymous
08/07/2020 12:17
Subject: Nice White Parents
Here is a real world example of how socioeconomic creates different opinions on education and why the gap:
School supplies.
A middle income parent makes sure they have $20 so they can buy the school supplies needed. Because education is important. And having the right tools is important. So to support their child's education, they buy the supplies. Even if that means they don't buy themselves something. Because education is important. They tell their child to keep track, to take care of the supplies because replacing them costs money.
But for FARMS parents is that the case? Or is that they expect the school to provide the school supplies? At this point, yes, I think that's very often the case. I think school supplies drives are so big at this point that they don't even realize that parents are actually supposed to buy the items. If these parents valued education, why not save up? Put the money aside, buy the necessary items. Support their child's education. Be invested.
So it's not PC but I think PTAs in high FARMS schools need to stop supply drives, reduce the supply list and tell parents they need to provide the supplies. Because that is supporting their child's education. That it's the first step to being invested. And the truth is whether people want to admit or hear it, that yes, sometimes people just need to be told. And that goes for all socioeconomic levels.
School supplies.
A middle income parent makes sure they have $20 so they can buy the school supplies needed. Because education is important. And having the right tools is important. So to support their child's education, they buy the supplies. Even if that means they don't buy themselves something. Because education is important. They tell their child to keep track, to take care of the supplies because replacing them costs money.
But for FARMS parents is that the case? Or is that they expect the school to provide the school supplies? At this point, yes, I think that's very often the case. I think school supplies drives are so big at this point that they don't even realize that parents are actually supposed to buy the items. If these parents valued education, why not save up? Put the money aside, buy the necessary items. Support their child's education. Be invested.
So it's not PC but I think PTAs in high FARMS schools need to stop supply drives, reduce the supply list and tell parents they need to provide the supplies. Because that is supporting their child's education. That it's the first step to being invested. And the truth is whether people want to admit or hear it, that yes, sometimes people just need to be told. And that goes for all socioeconomic levels.
Anonymous
08/07/2020 11:59
Subject: Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Can someone summarize why it's "racist" to avoid sending your white (or Asian?) child to a crummy school, that happens to be majority minority? And dovetailing, how does a lack of white (and Asian?) students make a minority majority school disadvantaged?
I honestly don't get this argument.
From what I see, Asians aren't blamed. Only whites.
I haven’t listened to the podcast so I’m not addressing that situation. What is racist, is assuming that a majority minority school is “crummy” without other evidence. Test scores are inherently a measure of the student socioeconomic demographic, in no way a measure of the quality of a school, and yet are used without question, by many white families in choosing where to live. That’s what’s racist. It doesn’t mean that every majority minority school is a good fit for your child or that it’s racist to do actually do the research and make the decision that’s best for your family.
Oy vey, test scores are about the most reliable way to assess a building's caliber. Let me guess, crime statistics, homicide rate, and 9-1-1 response time are no way to measure public safety, either?
Of course the most reliable way to measure a high school's quality would be to accurately track both what college 12th graders land at, then after 4 years note if they graduated (on time) and the degree earned. But that would probably be too revealing for you and you'd claim all the kids from a low achieving high school ran out of money and had to drop out of college after working 3 jobs to make ends meet.
...and that rich kids all coast through their bachelor's degrees because mommy and daddy pay for everything.
Anonymous
08/07/2020 11:58
Subject: Nice White Parents
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Can someone summarize why it's "racist" to avoid sending your white (or Asian?) child to a crummy school, that happens to be majority minority? And dovetailing, how does a lack of white (and Asian?) students make a minority majority school disadvantaged?
I honestly don't get this argument.
From what I see, Asians aren't blamed. Only whites.
I haven’t listened to the podcast so I’m not addressing that situation. What is racist, is assuming that a majority minority school is “crummy” without other evidence. Test scores are inherently a measure of the student socioeconomic demographic, in no way a measure of the quality of a school, and yet are used without question, by many white families in choosing where to live. That’s what’s racist. It doesn’t mean that every majority minority school is a good fit for your child or that it’s racist to do actually do the research and make the decision that’s best for your family.
Oy vey, test scores are about the most reliable way to assess a building's caliber. Let me guess, crime statistics, homicide rate, and 9-1-1 response time are no way to measure public safety, either?
Of course the most reliable way to measure a high school's quality would be to accurately track both what college 12th graders land at, then after 4 years note if they graduated (on time) and the degree earned. But that would probably be too revealing for you and you'd claim all the kids from a low achieving high school ran out of money and had to drop out of college after working 3 jobs to make ends meet.