It appears that the difference in many of the discrepancies in high test scores not eligible, vs comparatively low scores and eligible, is GBRS. I had no idea this was such a weighted factor as it is seemingly such a subjective assessment. If a child's test scores identify a gifted mind, it would stand to reason that that child would be a good candidate for a more challenging curriculum regardless of the teachers experience in a normal classroom environment. I certainly don't want to trivialize the educators assessment but a subjective factor should not outweigh otherwise qualifying test scores (in my opinion).

NNAT 136
cogat 128
GBRS ?

Not eligible

Anonymous wrote:There's a huge difference between making paper airplanes or doing math with your kids vs. sending them to a test prep factory camp. I mean, those aren't even in the same category.

There is not that big difference. We invented math games with addition and subtraction, which seemed just that to my child, games. The child however, scored on the 99th% in the county on the math portion of the CogAT. I was intentional about the math games we played, in that I wanted him to be fluent with arithmetic problems, whereas the child was merely playing.

The only difference is the setting, and whether the child knows it or not. Some parents are not as creative, bc they can't, don't want to, or don't know how, or the child's preference in learning is such that they like the structured environment better. I could not make my kid do more than a page of a workbook in 4 hours, so I needed alternatives.

Going to an advanced program is very important if you have a bright child, bc they spend 8 hours a day at school. They might as well spend those hours productively and not waste time. What's the point in doing hw when they get home, when they can go out and play instead? Playing is health, and health is a priority. You can live well without an excellent gpa, but not so well in poor health.

There's a huge difference between making paper airplanes or doing math with your kids vs. sending them to a test prep factory camp. I mean, those aren't even in the same category.

Anonymous wrote:I'm the poster you quoted. My kids would kill me too. ?

I honestly have no idea about these centers, what they do, or where to find them. I was merely giving them the benefit of the doubt.

For us playing in the sun and in the mud is a priority, but mind growing activities are extremely important too.

Asian-American parent here. In our family, we do prioritize academics. We just spent the past 6 days looking for shells, fishing and playing in the sun. I would not send my kids to some test prep center but there is plenty of time to have fun and study. We are not as sports obsessed but our kids do play baseball, soccer, tennis, golf and also on swim team. They are just average athletes but very strong in academics. I know I plan to take the kids to the library today and have my 2nd grader practice some multiplication. Sure, I may make him study for an hour today but he will have the other 12 hours to play.

Anonymous wrote:We were out of town and just opened the letter this morning.

NNAT: 111
CogAT
Verbal 118
Quantitative 121
Nonverbal 126
Composite 124
GBRS- Don't know

We did a parent referral and he got in.

Thank you for bringing the thread back to its original purpose. We also just got back from vacation.

NNAT: 118
Cogat: 136-138 Can't remember breakout
GBRS: 13
Filled out parent questionnaire and sent in a few awards DS received.
Zip: 22310

Child admitted.

We were out of town and just opened the letter this morning.

NNAT: 111
CogAT
Verbal 118
Quantitative 121
Nonverbal 126
Composite 124
GBRS- Don't know

We did a parent referral and he got in.

I'm the poster you quoted. My kids would kill me too. ?

I honestly have no idea about these centers, what they do, or where to find them. I was merely giving them the benefit of the doubt.

For us playing in the sun and in the mud is a priority, but mind growing activities are extremely important too.

Anonymous wrote:The testing information is all online. Just a simple Google search on "FX county Level IV timeline" would bring out all the dates, type of tests, etc. Our elementary school introduced some students in some classes about the test questions, a few days before the test. My child was not part of this group, and I did not inquire. My older child had been part of the group that would see types of questions beforehand.

I think it is fair that all kids are familiar with the test, but regardless some kids have a disadvantage. Ex. We play a game with geometric shapes. The kids build mosaics, patterns, etc. this helps develop their thinking. Another $7on sale paper airplane making kit, helps them with folding exercises. My kids love these games. Is this preping? Indirectly it is. It is not on test format, but achieves the same result.

So if you ask me if I preped my kids, I'd technically say no, but practically yes. This preping helps them overall appart from the test. Should I now feel guilty that other parents didn't prep, or left their kids in front of the x-box instead? I don't think so!!

Everything we do with our kids needs to be intentional, bc we are their most important teachers.

I don't know, but maybe at those prep centers kids do play and learn.

I checked out their camp schedule. Fun is permitted from 2:15-2:30 on Wednesdays.
My kids would kill me if I told them they were going to "camp" and they got that instead.

Anonymous wrote:The test prep workbooks are sold at Lotte Plaza, not Wegmans. Could be a coincidence I guess.

And if you scroll down, you will see the diverse students whose parents paid monthly tuition for Fairfax test prep at one school that promises

http://academy4enrichment.com/

This place actually has a page listing how the third graders they "prepped" scored on the Cogat tests, with their names and schools. I'm surprised they publish that online and I'm not going to link to it.

So I bit and looked at your list. Firstly, it doesn't seem to be *that* many kids. Secondly, most of these names don't even look like south-east Asian last names!

That said, given that there are no limit of students into the AAP, I am not sure why people are so upset that others prep. That is not to imply that I am for or against prepping.

You folks in Fairfax would have a field day if you were in the MCPS school district where kids are competing for a limited and small number of seats at the Highly Gifted Center. Fairfax seems like such a better system given that 12-15% of kids seem to get the chance for proper enrichment/acceleration, whereas MCPS only takes in the top 1-2% or so.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only effect a cheater has on kids taking the test as intended is that inflated scores as a pp termed them skew the Fairfax-only percentiles.

The NNAT2 is nation wide, not county wide. I doubt that some "cheaters" in fx county would be able to skew national results. And as you see, not all children accepted are at the 99th percentile.

But the CogAt is a Fairfax-specific test. The test results have lines for a kid's percentile in Fairfax, and percentile nationwide and there is a huge difference. I don't know if it matters for decision-making.

Anonymous wrote:The only effect a cheater has on kids taking the test as intended is that inflated scores as a pp termed them skew the Fairfax-only percentiles.

The NNAT2 is nation wide, not county wide. I doubt that some "cheaters" in fx county would be able to skew national results. And as you see, not all children accepted are at the 99th percentile.

Anonymous wrote:Whites are too lazy to go to test prep mommy is too drunk on wine by 7pm

Troll

The testing information is all online. Just a simple Google search on "FX county Level IV timeline" would bring out all the dates, type of tests, etc. Our elementary school introduced some students in some classes about the test questions, a few days before the test. My child was not part of this group, and I did not inquire. My older child had been part of the group that would see types of questions beforehand.

I think it is fair that all kids are familiar with the test, but regardless some kids have a disadvantage. Ex. We play a game with geometric shapes. The kids build mosaics, patterns, etc. this helps develop their thinking. Another $7on sale paper airplane making kit, helps them with folding exercises. My kids love these games. Is this preping? Indirectly it is. It is not on test format, but achieves the same result.

So if you ask me if I preped my kids, I'd technically say no, but practically yes. This preping helps them overall appart from the test. Should I now feel guilty that other parents didn't prep, or left their kids in front of the x-box instead? I don't think so!!

Everything we do with our kids needs to be intentional, bc we are their most important teachers.

I don't know, but maybe at those prep centers kids do play and learn.

The only effect a cheater has on kids taking the test as intended is that inflated scores as a pp termed them skew the Fairfax-only percentiles.

Somehow this stat thread turned into test prep discussion, but I'll bite. The reason some people are upset about NNAT/COGAT prep but not SAT, is because the former are supposed to measure child "natural ability to think" while the latter measures skills, mastered abilities to read and knowledge of obscure vocabulary.

However prep from videly available materials (e.g. Books) is not cheating. Cheating is writing to Pearson's that you homeschool your kid, getting the actual test and using that to prep (and yes there was a thread here discussing ethics around it). I don't think there is ANY evidence that going through one book with your child in the evening has impact to scores... there might be. No one has measured it. Test prep classes? I'm sad for the kids, but no, not cheating.

there is a conversation right here in this thread that there is no limit on spaces in AAP. So why do you care if some kid got 133 instead of 129 because their mom showed them a similar problem in a book? We don't even know if it made a difference in decision.

We all are trying to get education for our kids that we think is the best for them. If some parents believe that going through a book or signing up their kids for hours of obscure classes is a way to go, let it be.

Signed: a non-Asian mom who would never think of sending kids to prep classes.