Anonymous wrote:^^ Yes, we all know it's illegal, the question is why and what, if anything, can be done about it while our children are of public school age. All that can be done is wait for a new, larger generation of high-SES parents in PS to lobby for selective admissions?

There are a good number of other US cities with high minority populations running G/T programs city-wide, and selective admission charters, including the language immersion variant. Even Baltimore and Atlanta do this. I'm only in the research stage on the issues. But I like your insightful list, thanks for that. I'm inclined to agree with the not-so-inspiring sequencing you lay out.

What we're talking about are new gray areas. If DCI supports the extensive ability grouping, and language proficiency grouping, pps predict, many middle-class families will be attracted, strenghtening the school. But then the core, tacit DC charter mission of primarily serving low-SES AA children at almost every charter will have been watered down. Will a political backlash result, like the one in Fairfax emanating from TJ's decision to allow a larger than normal size group of low-SES kids to enter several years ago, leading to a dramatic increase in the percentage of students doing remedial work (8% to nearly 20%)? Almost certainly so. The lengths the Cantonese-speaking poster is willing to go to ensure that his or her kid learns Chinese, YY or no YY, is telling. Stay tuned.

We are at one of the Spanish Immersion charters and I have read the charter for our school-- the mission is to serve all children focusing on low-SES kids, but this does not necessary mean AA for our school, the primary target would be the Hispanic population.

13:13 here. I'm afraid I don't care enough about the issue to seriously agitate--there are other issues that have much more direct bearing on my family's health & happiness. But if you have a petition, I'd sign it. I might even stuff envelopes for your cause. Keep us posted.

^^ Yes, we all know it's illegal, the question is why and what, if anything, can be done about it while our children are of public school age. All that can be done is wait for a new, larger generation of high-SES parents in PS to lobby for selective admissions?

There are a good number of other US cities with high minority populations running G/T programs city-wide, and selective admission charters, including the language immersion variant. Even Baltimore and Atlanta do this. I'm only in the research stage on the issues. But I like your insightful list, thanks for that. I'm inclined to agree with the not-so-inspiring sequencing you lay out.

What we're talking about are new gray areas. If DCI supports the extensive ability grouping, and language proficiency grouping, pps predict, many middle-class families will be attracted, strenghtening the school. But then the core, tacit DC charter mission of primarily serving low-SES AA children at almost every charter will have been watered down. Will a political backlash result, like the one in Fairfax emanating from TJ's decision to allow a larger than normal size group of low-SES kids to enter several years ago, leading to a dramatic increase in the percentage of students doing remedial work (8% to nearly 20%)? Almost certainly so. The lengths the Cantonese-speaking poster is willing to go to ensure that his or her kid learns Chinese, YY or no YY, is telling. Stay tuned.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no reason for DCI to not allow bilingual kids to take advanced language classes once they lottery in. The non-existence of a screening process for the language charters exists because 1) the charter board requires schools to either a) accept everyone or b) choose a cut off grade to not accept new students and consequently 2) the charters have to choose between possible attrition in the upper grades or making sure that all of the students enrolled have a similar foundation in the target language by the time the get to the upper grades and therefore meet their chartered goal of bilingualism for all students enrolled.

Now this could be controversial if kids that lottery in have no prior language instruction but for the low-SES kids that may already speak for example Spanish (maybe French) or were already enrolled at one of the 4 DCI schools, that wouldn't be an issue. The question is how many low-SES kids without adequate language skills in the target language enroll through a lottery will they be able to catch up and enroll in advanced language classes?

I'd like to think there is no reason, but there always seems to be a reason with DC Charter. The chaters don't seem to be making sure that all the students enrolled have a similar foundation in the target language as much as they're making sure that native speakers and high-SES families providing the necessary inputs don't crowd out low-SES AA kids. What other reason is there for a kid speaking and reading/writing appropriate level Spanish, Mandarin or French to be kept out of one these schools past around 2nd grade when spots go empty in the upper grades? I see no way for low-SES kids to catch up, other than maybe those education hungry DC Chinese, because their parents can't afford the inputs (particularly literacy skills for bilingual Spanish kids). The matter of bilingual kids from outside the feeders enrolling in advanced language classes may or may not net out in a positive way with high-SES white families potentially accruing almost all the benefit. There will be hiccups and possibly road blocks.

New students are excluded from the upper grades because any kind of admission test is illegal under DC law. The only admission tests allowed at any school receiving DC taxpayer money are those administered by Walls, Banneker and Ellington (and maybe McKinley? I'm always confused by that). It's not just a charter thing, it's true for DCPS as well.

And I predict that any change will take place in the following order:
* selective admission DCPS middle school programs,
* new selective DCPS high schools,
* selective DCPS elementary programs,
* selective charter high schools (but only ones that can't compete with existing DCPS selective high schools),
* selective charter middle schools,
* selective charter elementary schools

And for what it's worth, I actually don't think that these last three will EVER happen.

I don't like it any more than you do, but DC as a city is allergic to special programs for gifted kids ("gifted" including kids who are bilingual). They will NOT be given any resources that any other kid can't get. If you don't like it, run for Council.

Anonymous wrote:There is no reason for DCI to not allow bilingual kids to take advanced language classes once they lottery in. The non-existence of a screening process for the language charters exists because 1) the charter board requires schools to either a) accept everyone or b) choose a cut off grade to not accept new students and consequently 2) the charters have to choose between possible attrition in the upper grades or making sure that all of the students enrolled have a similar foundation in the target language by the time the get to the upper grades and therefore meet their chartered goal of bilingualism for all students enrolled.

Now this could be controversial if kids that lottery in have no prior language instruction but for the low-SES kids that may already speak for example Spanish (maybe French) or were already enrolled at one of the 4 DCI schools, that wouldn't be an issue. The question is how many low-SES kids without adequate language skills in the target language enroll through a lottery will they be able to catch up and enroll in advanced language classes?

I'd like to think there is no reason, but there always seems to be a reason with DC Charter. The chaters don't seem to be making sure that all the students enrolled have a similar foundation in the target language as much as they're making sure that native speakers and high-SES families providing the necessary inputs don't crowd out low-SES AA kids. What other reason is there for a kid speaking and reading/writing appropriate level Spanish, Mandarin or French to be kept out of one these schools past around 2nd grade when spots go empty in the upper grades? I see no way for low-SES kids to catch up, other than maybe those education hungry DC Chinese, because their parents can't afford the inputs (particularly literacy skills for bilingual Spanish kids). The matter of bilingual kids from outside the feeders enrolling in advanced language classes may or may not net out in a positive way with high-SES white families potentially accruing almost all the benefit. There will be hiccups and possibly road blocks.