Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Where's the evidence that traffic cameras reduce accidents? DC has increasing ticketing by almost 10 times. Where's the corresponding reduction in traffic deaths?

The evidence was provided to you several pages back. But you reject it because it destroys your thesis. You are this website’s most boring broken record.

No one has provided any evidence. That's the issue.

If there were evidence, it would be obvious by now. The city has increased ticketing by nearly 1000 percent over the past decade, and issues enough tickets each year to hit every driver in the city multiple times, and yet accident rates are no better than they were 10 years ago.

it's not just that handing out a billion traffic tickets isn't making a difference, it's literally everything dot is doing isn't making a difference.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Where's the evidence that traffic cameras reduce accidents? DC has increasing ticketing by almost 10 times. Where's the corresponding reduction in traffic deaths?

The evidence was provided to you several pages back. But you reject it because it destroys your thesis. You are this website’s most boring broken record.

No one has provided any evidence. That's the issue.

If there were evidence, it would be obvious by now. The city has increased ticketing by nearly 1000 percent over the past decade, and issues enough tickets each year to hit every driver in the city multiple times, and yet accident rates are no better than they were 10 years ago.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You folks have yet to figure out that the traffic ticket business isn’t about your safety but more about raising more tax revenue.

If anyone truly cared about safety they’d revoke the licenses of the dangerous drivers. Instead they allow them to remain on the roads. In the mean time they’ll charge you $100 for 4 mph over an artificially low speed limit knowing you’re stupid enough to pay.

For educated folks you ain’t too bright.

If you were capable of reading you would know that tickets start at 11+

But rather than blaming drivers we should blame automakers. Every car is just too big, fast and insulated from the environment. It takes no effort on the drivers part to reach extra legal speeds, while there is essentially no sensation of speed.

You should drive an MG Sprite around for a bit and the speed limits would suddenly seem fine.

Anonymous wrote:You folks have yet to figure out that the traffic ticket business isn’t about your safety but more about raising more tax revenue.

If anyone truly cared about safety they’d revoke the licenses of the dangerous drivers. Instead they allow them to remain on the roads. In the mean time they’ll charge you $100 for 4 mph over an artificially low speed limit knowing you’re stupid enough to pay.

For educated folks you ain’t too bright.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it

A lot of the tickets are for trivial offenses. For example you stopped at a stop sign, but the nose of your car was beyond the stop sign pole when you stopped, so they say you didnt stop at the stop sign.

The stop sign cameras record your speed going over the line and will automatically cancel the ticket if it's under a certain speed, specifically to avoid this situation. If the automatic cancellation doesn't happen for some reason you can appeal and presuming you were actually just inching over the line your ticket will be dismissed because they have not only your speed recorded but a video of the infraction that a human can review for an appeal.

People love to say "oh I was just doing this reasonable thing and the mean old speed camera punished me!" But in reality it's usually either a straight up lie or they have an utter lack of self-awareness of what they are doing in their vehicle, rolling through the stop sign at 8mph but in their mind they "barely inched over."

It would be great if it actually worked like this, but that hasn't been my experience at all. Most of the traffic camera tickets I have ever gotten (and there's been a few) are penny ante complaints about how I stopped but not in precisely the right place because my bumper was over the crosswalk or something.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it

A lot of the tickets are for trivial offenses. For example you stopped at a stop sign, but the nose of your car was beyond the stop sign pole when you stopped, so they say you didnt stop at the stop sign.

The stop sign cameras record your speed going over the line and will automatically cancel the ticket if it's under a certain speed, specifically to avoid this situation. If the automatic cancellation doesn't happen for some reason you can appeal and presuming you were actually just inching over the line your ticket will be dismissed because they have not only your speed recorded but a video of the infraction that a human can review for an appeal.

People love to say "oh I was just doing this reasonable thing and the mean old speed camera punished me!" But in reality it's usually either a straight up lie or they have an utter lack of self-awareness of what they are doing in their vehicle, rolling through the stop sign at 8mph but in their mind they "barely inched over."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it

A lot of the tickets are for trivial offenses. For example you stopped at a stop sign, but the nose of your car was beyond the stop sign pole when you stopped, so they say you didnt stop at the stop sign.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

Wealthiest neighborhoods in DC have little to no traffic cameras. For instance, you will never catch a traffic camera on Chain Bridge Road.

Drivers in black neighborhoods are 17 times more likely to be ticketed in DC than drivers in white neighborhoods.

OK. How many times are drivers, pedestrians, and cyclists in black neighborhoods more likely to be killed or injured by traffic violence than drivers, pedestrians, and cyclists in white neighborhoods?

You don’t know, do you?

If only you cared as much about those whose lives are shattered by reckless drivers as much as those reckless drivers who get ticketed.

It's extremely rate for anyone of any color in Washington D.C. to be killed by a speeding driver.

I knew someone who was killed in DC - on a crosswalk - by a speeding driver who had amassed thousands of dollars in unpaid fines. You can her death “rate” (sic) and advocate against policies that make our streets safer. I will call her death her preventable and advocate for policies that will prevent DC residents from being frightened, injured, maimed, and killed by reckless drivers.

The driver in this scenario is an extreme outlier. Most people in this city are perfectly safe drivers. The question is why DDOT is burying the city in 3 million tickets when the problem is a tiny number of reckless drivers. It's the traffic equivalent of stationing National Guard troops on every corner in the city because some guy somewhere stabbed someone.

Are you really so dense that you believe those 3 million tickets are uniformly distributed across the population? No, a relatively small number of extremely careless drivers get the tickets. They are outliers and that’s the point. Were their dangerous behavior being appropriately sanctioned victims like Patricia Bullinger would still be alive.

Aside from there being zero evidence that's the case, it's clear you don't drive and also that your math skills are nonexistent. I dont know what you mean by a "tiny" number of drivers but do the math. Do you think those 3.3 million tickets went to, like, 100 people? They'd have to get 90 tickets a day, every single day of the year, for the math to work. Oh you meant 500 people? Doesn't really seem "tiny" but the math is still silly. They'd have to get 18 tickets every single day. 1000 people? 1000 extremely careless drivers seems like a major problem, but I'm pretty sure there's not a single person who gets 9 tickets every single day.

The DC lab study identified 100,000 high risk drivers.

Seems a little ridiculous, no? How do so many supposedly high risk drivers produce so few traffic fatalities? Also, exactly how many drivers do you think there are in DC?

There are a lot of non-fatal accidents, roughly 40 per day that merit a police report. Plus evasive maneuvers by everyone else on foot/biking/driving. Some roads like 295 get too congested to get fatal accidents very often, even with bad driving. Additionally some people just flat out avoid certain roads at certain times a day.

Not to mention that all of us who own vehicles pay for these accidents through elevated insurance premiums. People complain about equity and cameras, but the reality is that the truly awful behavior of some drivers in DC - and the failure of the DC government to take those drivers off the road - pushes the cost of owning a legally-insured car out of the reach of many poor families.

Give me a break. The rates DC charges for tickets is nothing short of predatory. You can owe $1200 for a single traffic ticket.

You're making stuff up again. Here's the fine schedule:

18-2200.1 SPEED 11-15 OVR LIMT $100
18-2200.1 SPEED 16-20 OVR LIMT $150
18-2200.1 SPEED 21-25 OVR LIMT $200
18-2200 OVER 25 MPH CONTROLLED $400
18-2200 OVER 25 MPH NON-CONTROLLED $500

The fines can be cut in half if you qualify for SNAP benefits (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAdIRBjCS2I).

So in DC, you can do 100mph in a 25mph zone and the fine can be as little as $200. That's absurd. Try speeding in a rural county in the south and see what happens. It's going to cost you a hell of a lot more than $200, I can guarantee you.

Heck, even Virginia routinely sends drivers to jail - including one Nats outfielder and an automotive journalist - for doing over 80mph on open roads.

If you really think DC fines are "predatory", about the best thing I can say about you is that you lack context.

The fees double after 30 days, and there's a 20 percent surcharge on top of that. You can read more here:

Predatory Penalties: How Late Fees on DC Traffic Tickets Punish the Poor

https://www.dcfpi.org/all/predatory-penalties-late-fees-dc-traffic-tickets-punish-poor/

So pay your ticket. You have control over late fees.

Or don't speed in the first place. Drivers have control over that as well.

Take responsibility for your behavior! Sheesh!

Let me remind everyone how traffic laws work in DC:

12 year old driving an ATV down the middle of Connecticut Avenue during rush hour: no penalty

Moped driver blowing stop sign at 40 mph: no penalty

Motorcyclist blowing stop sign at 40 mph: no penalty

Cyclist with infant placed in basket in front of bike: no penalty

Cyclist with two small children on back with no helmets: no penalty

Man on e-bike going 35mph with child in lap with no helmet: no penalty

Car driver going 50 mph in a 25 mph zone with no traffic cameras: no penalty

Car driver doesnt stop at stop sign for full three seconds at empty intersection with camera: $100, doubled after 30 days

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it

A lot of the tickets are for trivial offenses. For example you stopped at a stop sign, but the nose of your car was beyond the stop sign pole when you stopped, so they say you didnt stop at the stop sign.

That's still you not stopping at the stop sign, by the letter of the law.

Says who? A camera? That's hearsay. Put that camera on the stand so I can cross examine it and present questions to it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.

Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it

A lot of the tickets are for trivial offenses. For example you stopped at a stop sign, but the nose of your car was beyond the stop sign pole when you stopped, so they say you didnt stop at the stop sign.

That's still you not stopping at the stop sign, by the letter of the law.

For safety reasons it is quite normal to pull forward to a point where one can see.

You're just another example proving that none of this has anything to do with safety and it's nothing but an exercise in punishing people you don't like + revenue generation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it

A lot of the tickets are for trivial offenses. For example you stopped at a stop sign, but the nose of your car was beyond the stop sign pole when you stopped, so they say you didnt stop at the stop sign.

That's still you not stopping at the stop sign, by the letter of the law.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.

Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it

A lot of the tickets are for trivial offenses. For example you stopped at a stop sign, but the nose of your car was beyond the stop sign pole when you stopped, so they say you didnt stop at the stop sign.

That's still you not stopping at the stop sign, by the letter of the law.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it

A lot of the tickets are for trivial offenses. For example you stopped at a stop sign, but the nose of your car was beyond the stop sign pole when you stopped, so they say you didnt stop at the stop sign.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did you know there's almost no stop sign cameras west of the park? I wonder how that happens....

There's 17 speed cameras in Ward 3. In Ward 7, there's almost 60.

Listing this without listing data on accidents or fatalities isn’t that useful.
Traffic accidents, injuries, and fatalities are FAR higher in ward 7 than 3. This isn’t the racist “gotcha” that you think it is.

Actually it is.

https://www.propublica.org/article/chicagos-race-neutral-traffic-cameras-ticket-black-and-latino-drivers-the-most

Accidents and fatalities are much higher in majority black zip codes. Should city officials defer to those who break the law or those who are victimized by law breakers?

The underlying problem is that road infrastructure is generally much more conducive to speeding in black majority zip codes. The solution is more traffic calming etc..

Accidents and fatalities are rare in every section of the city. The city should not bombard people with tickets that cost them lots of money and make no difference to accident rates.

No one is bombarding you. You are actively breaking the law. You can choose to stop.

It would make more sense if we just had the cops give out the tickets. So many of the camera tickets are bullshit-y foot fault tickets. It's just harassment.

The cops do not give a crap. They never did.

And what the is a foot fault ticket?? Did you follow the law or not? Sounds like no, but you want to whine about it