Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Montessori does not raise revenue, it allows higher income students ages 3 and 4 to enroll (not otherwise available to higher income Arlington children through APS) and pay tuition. Its not like it is adding money into the system--the tuition just offsets the cost of those students. The Montessori planning factor also has an aide for every elementary classroom, which regular elementary classrooms do not, so it actually costs more per student than regular school models. Not sure about lately, but a few years ago breakout score reports showed Montessori having much worse test scores than ATS....?

Not true. APS Montessori raises more than 1m for APS every year. No other standalone option does, not ATS not immersion. That money goes into general coffer, not Montessori. As for the fallacy that Montessori must cost more, it doesn't and that's a fact. There was a FOiA before pandemic and it showed MPsA in middle of ELS and... get this...below coveted neighborhood ELS for cost per pupil than like Jamestown. Reasons are several, starting with tenured teachers self-select to nice white ELS where population is easier ( including parents). But the fact remains. Your high fallutin Narl school costs more to provide services to students and that is before you include revenue generation from Montessori community, which is far more disadvantaged and what I'd call "leaves a bad taste in your mouth" about who gets charged money and why. As fo scores, wait for latest SOLs. You might be surprised. Now that Montessori has been settled finally in new school for a few years, word on the street is scores are all right. Question is how much tuition should be charged for ATS students, and will they reserve two-thirds slots for underprivileged every year. Why not?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Um, so what is the boundary issue? "Boundaries" for ATS are the same as they are for Montessori: countywide. ATS is an option program, not a neighborhood school.

The obvious and simple answer is to conduct all the neighborhood schools like ATS is conducted. Doesn't cost any more and cheaper than Montessori and lower transportation costs. But nobody wants to do that....

Not PP, but I'm guessing the boundary issue is that if they convert an existing neighborhood school to an option school, then they have to redraw the boundaries for where those kids who went to that neighborhood school will now go, as they no longer have a neighborhood school.

The other option would be to find a new property, but that's incredibly difficult, as the last 10 years of APS history have shown...

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Montessori does not raise revenue, it allows higher income students ages 3 and 4 to enroll (not otherwise available to higher income Arlington children through APS) and pay tuition. Its not like it is adding money into the system--the tuition just offsets the cost of those students. The Montessori planning factor also has an aide for every elementary classroom, which regular elementary classrooms do not, so it actually costs more per student than regular school models. Not sure about lately, but a few years ago breakout score reports showed Montessori having much worse test scores than ATS....?

Not true. APS Montessori raises more than 1m for APS every year. No other standalone option does, not ATS not immersion. That money goes into general coffer, not Montessori. As for the fallacy that Montessori must cost more, it doesn't and that's a fact. There was a FOiA before pandemic and it showed MPsA in middle of ELS and... get this...below coveted neighborhood ELS for cost per pupil than like Jamestown. Reasons are several, starting with tenured teachers self-select to nice white ELS where population is easier ( including parents). But the fact remains. Your high fallutin Narl school costs more to provide services to students and that is before you include revenue generation from Montessori community, which is far more disadvantaged and what I'd call "leaves a bad taste in your mouth" about who gets charged money and why. As fo scores, wait for latest SOLs. You might be surprised. Now that Montessori has been settled finally in new school for a few years, word on the street is scores are all right. Question is how much tuition should be charged for ATS students, and will they reserve two-thirds slots for underprivileged every year. Why not?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Montessori does not raise revenue, it allows higher income students ages 3 and 4 to enroll (not otherwise available to higher income Arlington children through APS) and pay tuition. Its not like it is adding money into the system--the tuition just offsets the cost of those students. The Montessori planning factor also has an aide for every elementary classroom, which regular elementary classrooms do not, so it actually costs more per student than regular school models. Not sure about lately, but a few years ago breakout score reports showed Montessori having much worse test scores than ATS....?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Um, so what is the boundary issue? "Boundaries" for ATS are the same as they are for Montessori: countywide. ATS is an option program, not a neighborhood school.

The obvious and simple answer is to conduct all the neighborhood schools like ATS is conducted. Doesn't cost any more and cheaper than Montessori and lower transportation costs. But nobody wants to do that....

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Um, so what is the boundary issue? "Boundaries" for ATS are the same as they are for Montessori: countywide. ATS is an option program, not a neighborhood school.

The obvious and simple answer is to conduct all the neighborhood schools like ATS is conducted. Doesn't cost any more and cheaper than Montessori and lower transportation costs. But nobody wants to do that....

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Love Montessori for the reason of my kids teachers knowing them for years. Also why we should have more Montessori in APS. Waitlist similar to ATS, and it reserves more spots for underprivileged, and even raises revenue for coffers. I'm not against ATS existing - let it be. But disagree with trying to grow it: too much pain (boundaries) for too little ROI (secret sauce loses power has population grows p, kind of like how flying in airplanes went from luxury to ghetto as mainstream America started doing it regularly).

Anonymous wrote:Old APS parent here. Knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have applied to send my kids to ATS (we did not even lottery, though I did learn about it at kindergarten info night).

How I think of it is, ATS runs like schools ran when I was a kid. Traditional. Other APS schools are trying new models that generally are not proven and not as effective.

We switched to Catholic during Covid which also runs a more traditional model, but which you pay for out of pocket.

I do think we should add another ATS. The question is where to put it, because you have to take offline an existing ES, and that's a nightmare like all boundary stuff is.

But as an Arlington taxpayer, I would love to see all our schools swinging back toward a more traditional learning model.

I also completely agree on the importance of having one teacher who really gets to know your kid and be invested in them. I hated when our APS elem started rotating kids in 4th grade and all those connections got broken.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Disagree w having more option schools. The answer is to follow the ATS model in neighborhood schools. We seem to be moving in opposite direction though w equity grading.

I guess I could never get a good feel for what "traditional" meant. I realize there's a heavy emphasis on reading and homework every day. And tucking in shirts (maybe that went away).

But I asked the principal at an info session (this was in 2018) and she gave me this line about the school having walls with doors. I was SO confused. My kid's neighborhood school has walls and doors?

I know the school culture is most likely a bit part of what makes kids successful. But if the ideas there are so well done, why aren't we doing it APS wide? What is the main difference between the way ATS does teaching and the rest of the county? I don't' want to hear it's kindergarten kids reading for 30 minutes a night. That's not a curriculum.

ATS holds all their students to a high standard of reading and reading is a true part of their culture. That's the difference.

Right, which it can ONLY do because it's an option school. So if it DOES NOT WORK for some children (say, those who struggle with reading!) they will not attend ATS, or they will be asked to leave.

That's EXACTLY why it can not be moved into every elementary school. The population self selects into children with certain skills and abilities very quickly.

Say what? Am I understanding your post correctly: ATS will kick students out if they are not performing on grade level?

Every poster here who said ATS holds its students to higher standards... I assumed on an attitude level? Kids literally get asked to leave if they struggle with reading? This is documented?

People like making stuff up. These people tend to not have any experience with ATS and harbor this really strong hatred for the school. My daughter’s classmate came from to ATS mid-year. She was behind in every metric. A teacher worked with her every day after school to make sure she was reading and writing on grade level. ATS works with students who are behind and very few students leave ATS.

How does ATS do their staffing to have a dedicated teacher to work 1 on 1 with a student who is behind? I ask this as someone in a neighborhood school where this would NEVER happen. Is this work outside of contract hours? Is this a classroom teacher?

I’m the PP you responded to. I actually have no idea. But now that you brought it up I’m curious as well. The next time I see the parents I will ask.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just want to state my personal desire to not turn APS into a lottery of ATS, specialized school options. Neighborhood schools have tremendous value and having your children be able to wander the streets with their friends and knowing the families in each house is worth a lot more to me than these specialized options and knowing that MY school is the BEST scoring elementary school in Arlington is so stupid to me I can’t even tell you.

You do realize that some neighborhoods are split up and not everyone is assigned to a school full of SFHs where the kids can just wander the streets, right?

I don’t obviously. Logically, we should tear apart neighborhood schools as a result. And it was wrong of me to suggest they have value. Sigh.

I value play over scores and I value my child’s independence over the “top elementary environment.” But, my values are less important in APS/public school where testing gods reign and we should all have access to the best of everything.

Also adding that the option schools are a way to provide a better education for families who can’t afford to buy into YOUR neighborhood. You bought your way into a school you’re happy with; you don’t get to judge people who don’t have that option, or who have kids with more at stake with respect to their educational opportunities. You don’t get to come on here and call them “stupid.”

DP. WOW. I guess your resentment was triggered! Enjoy your option school.

DP, I felt that same way about that post, and it's not resentment, its annoyance at the people who are like "neighborhood schools have tremendous value." I live in Green Valley and sent my kids to Drew, because we walk the walk. If you live north of Lee Highway, you paid three times as much as me for the same size house and lot in the same school system and basically the same commute to DC but a much different "neighborhood school." Other things I'm tired of hearing: "I don't care about test scores"--generally only said by highly educated upper middle class people who have lots of privileges, including the privilege of not having to worry about things like the quality of their neighborhood school because exclusionary zoning and small neighborhood boundary zones mean only the children of other highly educated upper middle class people will be there, and test scores don't signify anything.

Thanks for pointing out the exclusionary zoning issue. Many (but of course not all) of the people adamant that the schools must be neighborhood schools don’t want a million dollar duplex let alone an affordable housing building in their neighborhood. These things are all connected.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just want to state my personal desire to not turn APS into a lottery of ATS, specialized school options. Neighborhood schools have tremendous value and having your children be able to wander the streets with their friends and knowing the families in each house is worth a lot more to me than these specialized options and knowing that MY school is the BEST scoring elementary school in Arlington is so stupid to me I can’t even tell you.

You do realize that some neighborhoods are split up and not everyone is assigned to a school full of SFHs where the kids can just wander the streets, right?

I don’t obviously. Logically, we should tear apart neighborhood schools as a result. And it was wrong of me to suggest they have value. Sigh.

I value play over scores and I value my child’s independence over the “top elementary environment.” But, my values are less important in APS/public school where testing gods reign and we should all have access to the best of everything.

Also adding that the option schools are a way to provide a better education for families who can’t afford to buy into YOUR neighborhood. You bought your way into a school you’re happy with; you don’t get to judge people who don’t have that option, or who have kids with more at stake with respect to their educational opportunities. You don’t get to come on here and call them “stupid.”

DP. WOW. I guess your resentment was triggered! Enjoy your option school.

DP, I felt that same way about that post, and it's not resentment, its annoyance at the people who are like "neighborhood schools have tremendous value." I live in Green Valley and sent my kids to Drew, because we walk the walk. If you live north of Lee Highway, you paid three times as much as me for the same size house and lot in the same school system and basically the same commute to DC but a much different "neighborhood school." Other things I'm tired of hearing: "I don't care about test scores"--generally only said by highly educated upper middle class people who have lots of privileges, including the privilege of not having to worry about things like the quality of their neighborhood school because exclusionary zoning and small neighborhood boundary zones mean only the children of other highly educated upper middle class people will be there, and test scores don't signify anything.