Anonymous wrote:FWIW, our AAP coordinator told us that they do trust the GMU scores more because they do all of the subtests, so they have a better picture. I also got the impression (but she did not say) that GMU cannot be bought.

Thanks for confirming--this shouldn't surprise anyone who goes and pays a private expert.

I'm sure the committee is alert to someone hiring a pyschologist to come up with a report that, surprise, who has a really high score. I'll bet this happens a lot. Hiring an expert, paid by the parents, lessens the value of these scores. Why would kid magically do better on one test than on two administered under the same coniditions for all kids--gee, why don't colleges allow private SATs?? The COGAT has 3 parts and is administered on 3 different days--so the kid all these days?

The County should limit extra testing to only GMU.

This assumes there is only one single profile of gifted learners and that they will all do well on a given test. Which is just not true.

But GMU simply does not have the capacity to test all the kids whose parents may want WISC testing.

FWIW, our AAP coordinator told us that they do trust the GMU scores more because they do all of the subtests, so they have a better picture. I also got the impression (but she did not say) that GMU cannot be bought.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I disagree with the approach here. TO me, late is late--I would and will (vigorously) object if this happens. My son is in the pool and we're talking about kids who didn't score high enough on the standardized tests--nationally recognized benchmarks for GT success; afterall, the vast majority of kids with cut-off score make it, the opposite is true for those that don't. I would think these parents, if they felt so strongly about applying and that the tests don't fully measure their child's potential, would have filled out the 1 page form weeks ago. It seems like we're making excuse for the exception and not for those the program is intended.

Wow. So if a student is not feeling well, or doesn't do well in a group test environment, but does beautifully on a comparable standardized test (also a nationally recognized benchmark for GT success) one-on-one with a licensed psychologist -- then that student should be excluded from consideration?

Wow. All I can say is wow. I'm so glad that FCPS doesn't use your rubric for GT Center-eligibility.

I'm sure the committee is alert to someone hiring a pyschologist to come up with a report that, surprise, who has a really high score. I'll bet this happens a lot. Hiring an expert, paid by the parents, lessens the value of these scores. Why would kid magically do better on one test than on two administered under the same coniditions for all kids--gee, why don't colleges allow private SATs?? The COGAT has 3 parts and is administered on 3 different days--so the kid all these days?

The County should limit extra testing to only GMU.

Like another PP, my child is already in the Center, just so you know where I'm coming from.

Just to clarify, since I said I turned in my forms but also said my child's in the Center - I have one in the Center & another in the 2nd grade pool for whom I submitted some materials. (I was typing really fast b/c Lost was about to start! )

13:58, you are exactly the kind of person I was thinking about when I posted this on the previous page:

Parents who would complain about that seem to me not to really understand what this process is about. Your kid will get in on his own merit or he will not; why waste your time going after other parents, trying to keep their kids out?? Don't we want ALL the qualified kids to get into the Center? Presumably that creates the best & most challenging peer group within the Center. Or do we just want our kids to seem "better" than someone else's kids, even if it means fighting to exclude their files from the process? I don't get it. I think the deadline should be enforced because it's very clear on the website and letters home from school, but these are extenuating circumstances, and FCPS has stated on the website that the deadline is extended. We're going to punish children by excluding them from the AAP Center because their parents reasonably believed they didn't have to go out in a blizzard to turn forms in at a closed school building? My forms are in, but I wouldn't object to anyone bringing their file to school on the day it reopens.

Like another PP, my child is already in the Center, just so you know where I'm coming from.

Anonymous wrote:Well, I disagree with the approach here. TO me, late is late--I would and will (vigorously) object if this happens. My son is in the pool and we're talking about kids who didn't score high enough on the standardized tests--nationally recognized benchmarks for GT success; afterall, the vast majority of kids with cut-off score make it, the opposite is true for those that don't. I would think these parents, if they felt so strongly about applying and that the tests don't fully measure their child's potential, would have filled out the 1 page form weeks ago. It seems like we're making excuse for the exception and not for those the program is intended.

Wow. So if a student is not feeling well, or doesn't do well in a group test environment, but does beautifully on a comparable standardized test (also a nationally recognized benchmark for GT success) one-on-one with a licensed psychologist -- then that student should be excluded from consideration?

Wow. All I can say is wow. I'm so glad that FCPS doesn't use your rubric for GT Center-eligibility.

Well, I disagree with the approach here. TO me, late is late--I would and will (vigorously) object if this happens. My son is in the pool and we're talking about kids who didn't score high enough on the standardized tests--nationally recognized benchmarks for GT success; afterall, the vast majority of kids with cut-off score make it, the opposite is true for those that don't. I would think these parents, if they felt so strongly about applying and that the tests don't fully measure their child's potential, would have filled out the 1 page form weeks ago. It seems like we're making excuse for the exception and not for those the program is intended.

I believe you are making two points here. The first is that you don't understand what a deadline is. You believe that parents should have submitted their referrals early and now should be punished for not doing so. Anyway, regardless of whether it is too late "TO you," it is not too late for FCPS, as they have posted an announcement on the website that referrals will still be accepted. Good luck in your campaign to reverse this policy after it's already been posted online and relied upon by dozens if not hundreds of parents over the past several days.

Your second point is that you don't seem to think there should be any referral process at all. You're entitled to your opinion, but again, you don't understand the process. Of course the tests are benchmarks and are useful in identifying children. However, there ARE children who are not in the pool but nonetheless belong in the Center. The cutoff score is roughly 98th percentile - do you seriously think a child with 98th percentile scores is vastly more qualified for the Center than a child with 95th percentile scores? That's a rhetorical question - it doesn't matter what you think because fortunately FCPS doesn't agree with you that test scores are the only determinative factor. They have a referral process and they allow for the submission of other materials, both for children in and not in the pool, that might demonstrate why those children belong in the Center. Finally, your broad statements that "the vast majority in the pool make it and the opposite is true for those who aren't" is wrong. Go back to an earlier page in the thread where someone posted some of the numbers; a good number of kids who are parent-referred end up in the Center.

I just called a friend who said her counselor said she can't waive the deadline, snow or no snow.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, I disagree with the approach here. TO me, late is late--I would and will (vigorously) object if this happens. My son is in the pool and we're talking about kids who didn't score high enough on the standardized tests--nationally recognized benchmarks for GT success; afterall, the vast majority of kids with cut-off score make it, the opposite is true for those that don't. I would think these parents, if they felt so strongly about applying and that the tests don't fully measure their child's potential, would have filled out the 1 page form weeks ago. It seems like we're making excuse for the exception and not for those the program is intended.

I didn't think we were talking only about the parent referral forms. I thought we were talking about the supplemental materials for kids were are in the pool.

Thank you for the clarification. I agree that there may be a good reason to extend the deadline for those parent submitting additional materials, but not one for those who missed the deadline for referral. For what its worth, I don't care if they allow an extra week because these "additional materials" don't add anything to the child's file and if anything are stuffed with silly letters of recomendation and "personal statements" that decrease the chances of acceptable by parents who will do anything to push their kids into programs not appropriate for them.

Anonymous wrote:Just tuning and maybe this helps from the web: "Fairfax County Public Schools VA- Open - Administrative offices on liberal leave (Wednesday) - no classes." I turned everything into the school's office; I was told this was the procedure by the AAP Coordinator for the school. I don't if "liberal leave" means you get until offices and classes open.

This contradicts the AAP website, whcih clearly extends the deadline until "school is open."

Just tuning and maybe this helps from the web: "Fairfax County Public Schools VA- Open - Administrative offices on liberal leave (Wednesday) - no classes." I turned everything into the school's office; I was told this was the procedure by the AAP Coordinator for the school. I don't if "liberal leave" means you get until offices and classes open.

I'm the one who posted the link and I couldn't care less, my DD is a 3rd grader at the GT Center LOL! It seems very clear to me:

The deadline for private school files for Level IV screening is extend until the next day that FCPS schools are open.

The deadline for Level IV referrals is extend until the next day that FCPS schools are open.

They have not yet updated the deadline for the packages due for those already in the pool (the 2/12 deadline) although I am sure they will as soon as it becomes clear that school will not reopen this week.

Going back to what I've seen with my older son, some parents will complain that rules are being bent for a few and argue these "late" packets/information should be excluded--I think a similar situation happened in 2004 with weather.

I don't understand why they care? FCPS is not like MoCo where there is a limited number of slots or a lottery. Each child is considered on their own merit and whether one child gets in has no bearing on whether another gets in.

Anonymous wrote:Well, I disagree with the approach here. TO me, late is late--I would and will (vigorously) object if this happens. My son is in the pool and we're talking about kids who didn't score high enough on the standardized tests--nationally recognized benchmarks for GT success; afterall, the vast majority of kids with cut-off score make it, the opposite is true for those that don't. I would think these parents, if they felt so strongly about applying and that the tests don't fully measure their child's potential, would have filled out the 1 page form weeks ago. It seems like we're making excuse for the exception and not for those the program is intended.

I didn't think we were talking only about the parent referral forms. I thought we were talking about the supplemental materials for kids were are in the pool.

Well, I disagree with the approach here. TO me, late is late--I would and will (vigorously) object if this happens. My son is in the pool and we're talking about kids who didn't score high enough on the standardized tests--nationally recognized benchmarks for GT success; afterall, the vast majority of kids with cut-off score make it, the opposite is true for those that don't. I would think these parents, if they felt so strongly about applying and that the tests don't fully measure their child's potential, would have filled out the 1 page form weeks ago. It seems like we're making excuse for the exception and not for those the program is intended.