Anonymous wrote:Huh, there ain’t no such thing as a free lunch.

Where does the electricity powering your car come from?

How much mining was involved to make the batteries?

The chemicals involved?

The inability to recycle those batteries?

Why do so many think it’s a clean green car when it takes so much to make/power one, they poison more and are way less efficient than a regular gas burner.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In fact I have put large furniture in a Leaf. The cargo space is as good as any other hatchback, better than some. Better than the Bolt or the Kia Soul. But generally, when I move large furniture like pianos (which strangely I do not do often?) I hire someone with a truck. I think it's great that you're moving furniture yourself all the time? Like whatshername on Kimmy Schmidt?

You have not, in fact, nailed where I live. Or, I suspect anything or one recently.

See? Here's the problem. YOU don't get to determine what OTHERS do or how they live. Your posts are full of III and MEMEME. As I said, liberalism is a mental disorder - it's not understanding that people have different needs.

Didn't Obama want us all to drive small cars and want to do away with SUVs? Yes, I think he did. Again, MEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEEEE! Do it like ME! That's liberalism in a nutshell.

Any large piece of furniture you put in a hatchback is going to stick out and you have to bungee the hatch lid down to secure it. If you can get it in width-wise. Good luck if it rains. So everyone should hire someone with a truck? Does that truck have to be all electric too? Why not? You certainly don't want to pollute with all those fossil fuels, now do you?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Didn't Obama want us to all drive small cars? Doesn't he realize that you weigh four hundred pounds and can't fit in one? Yes, it's all about Obama. Obama, and not your enormous fat family and their bad backs, who can't bend down to get into a car. This is America. Why should they have to?

Lol. I’m a tiny Jewish woman. Keep talking...

Anonymous wrote:Didn't Obama want us to all drive small cars? Doesn't he realize that you weigh four hundred pounds and can't fit in one? Yes, it's all about Obama. Obama, and not your enormous fat family and their bad backs, who can't bend down to get into a car. This is America. Why should they have to?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In fact I have put large furniture in a Leaf. The cargo space is as good as any other hatchback, better than some. Better than the Bolt or the Kia Soul. But generally, when I move large furniture like pianos (which strangely I do not do often?) I hire someone with a truck. I think it's great that you're moving furniture yourself all the time? Like whatshername on Kimmy Schmidt?

You have not, in fact, nailed where I live. Or, I suspect anything or one recently.

See? Here's the problem. YOU don't get to determine what OTHERS do or how they live. Your posts are full of III and MEMEME. As I said, liberalism is a mental disorder - it's not understanding that people have different needs.

Didn't Obama want us all to drive small cars and want to do away with SUVs? Yes, I think he did. Again, MEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEEEE! Do it like ME! That's liberalism in a nutshell.

Any large piece of furniture you put in a hatchback is going to stick out and you have to bungee the hatch lid down to secure it. If you can get it in width-wise. Good luck if it rains. So everyone should hire someone with a truck? Does that truck have to be all electric too? Why not? You certainly don't want to pollute with all those fossil fuels, now do you?

It's funny you keep saying YOU keep saying liberalism is a mental disorder, because if that is true you must be all 8,000 trolls on Twitter who pipe up with that very comment whenever anyone says anything to disagree with them.

So strange like, their cult leader? Or are you just another easily led sheep? I know where my vote goes!

Yes, that's right. My vote. The one givien by memememe. How dare I have an opinion about the car I drive? How dare I not move furniture in it? How dare I not live in Arizona? Maybe I DO live in Arizona, sheep-man. And maybe I do not. See? It's still about me.

One reason it is all about me and not all about you is I am a lot more interesting.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In fact I have put large furniture in a Leaf. The cargo space is as good as any other hatchback, better than some. Better than the Bolt or the Kia Soul. But generally, when I move large furniture like pianos (which strangely I do not do often?) I hire someone with a truck. I think it's great that you're moving furniture yourself all the time? Like whatshername on Kimmy Schmidt?

You have not, in fact, nailed where I live. Or, I suspect anything or one recently.

See? Here's the problem. YOU don't get to determine what OTHERS do or how they live. Your posts are full of III and MEMEME. As I said, liberalism is a mental disorder - it's not understanding that people have different needs.

Didn't Obama want us all to drive small cars and want to do away with SUVs? Yes, I think he did. Again, MEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEEEE! Do it like ME! That's liberalism in a nutshell.

Any large piece of furniture you put in a hatchback is going to stick out and you have to bungee the hatch lid down to secure it. If you can get it in width-wise. Good luck if it rains. So everyone should hire someone with a truck? Does that truck have to be all electric too? Why not? You certainly don't want to pollute with all those fossil fuels, now do you?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ah, so you were just pretending to be salt of the earth so you could feel put upon and persecuted! Got it. You don't "need" a truck for your "job." You "need" a truck so you can drive to the mountains and feel like a man.

I don't think it works very well, though, or you'd find a hobby. Like a real one. Taxidermy. Archery. Stalking co-eds.

It doesn't matter where I live, sweetie. Stop trying to pretend you're victimized when you've been squealing about libs all over this board for years. We are tired of your shit.

Hard to feel like a man when I’m actually a chick. Ever try to put large furniture in a Leaf?

Glad to know I nailed where you live.

I am not the pp you are responding to but you desperately need to get a life.

Long weekend. Spent all Saturday helping two little old ladies troubleshoot a knitting machine so they could get back to it for charity. I think that's called a good deed, which makes life worth living.

You really are not helping yourself. Why do you feel you need to defend yourself to strangers? For all I know you are Mother Teresa #2, you still have a dumb opinion about electric cars.

Anonymous wrote:I am a Republican and I am not in favor of anything being shoved in my face, I think I deserve the right to choose. I see all electric, self driving cars as another means of control by the left. Not interested, over time I suspect electric cars will become the norm, and that is how it should be, over time. Not government mandated, it should be a result of freedom of choice. Also, I won't purchase anything made in CA until they come back from
"crazy ville" and that may never happen.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ah, so you were just pretending to be salt of the earth so you could feel put upon and persecuted! Got it. You don't "need" a truck for your "job." You "need" a truck so you can drive to the mountains and feel like a man.

I don't think it works very well, though, or you'd find a hobby. Like a real one. Taxidermy. Archery. Stalking co-eds.

It doesn't matter where I live, sweetie. Stop trying to pretend you're victimized when you've been squealing about libs all over this board for years. We are tired of your shit.

Hard to feel like a man when I’m actually a chick. Ever try to put large furniture in a Leaf?

Glad to know I nailed where you live.

I am not the pp you are responding to but you desperately need to get a life.

Long weekend. Spent all Saturday helping two little old ladies troubleshoot a knitting machine so they could get back to it for charity. I think that's called a good deed, which makes life worth living.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It won't matter what stupid, short sighted Trump voters think in regard to fracking, coal and domestic oil production in general soon. Solid state batteries promise 3 times the energy capacity that currently powers most electric cars (ie range of over 400 miles), weather protection from -50 to 150 degrees, non-combustibility, non-corrosive leaching like with liquid batteries, and minutes or seconds of required charging rather than hours. https://news.utexas.edu/2017/02/28/goodenough-introduces-new-battery-technology

Toyota has just noted they'll release a solid state battery car with two years, Volvo said their going all electric by 2019. We'll also start to see short trip autonomous electric driverless airplanes and cars soon. Basically, the writing is on the wall for oil. Of course you'll still see gas car for the next 20 years, but electric tech is ramping up so quickly every manufacturer wants a piece. You idiots who are all about drill baby drill just don't read enough. That's your problem. That and your support for an absolutely inept, toddler with a small hands complex.

That's when you get my buy-in. If I'm driving up to Cape Cod, for instance, I have no desire to spend hours at rest stops charging my car. Even at 15 minute charge per 200 miles now, there would have to be a hell of a large amount of charging stations. Even with no wait to charge, you are adding almost 3/4 hour to my trip, just to charge. I have a truck and can get up to the Cape by only filling the tank once along the way.

Eventually you will go to a charging station to swap your battery out for a charged one, not sit there and charge your car. That’s the model Tesla is working towards at least.

I've heard that but the question is, who's doing it? In NJ, you can't pump your own gas. As a result, the lines are always long at the rest areas and it takes over 1/2 hour in line to get gas, due to slow worker performance. In addition? I'm relying on an attendant to change my battery properly and get back onto the road? Not sure how comfortable I am with that.

Uh, ok? You obviously have reservations about a technology that hasn’t even appeared yet. Are you at a high level at one of these companies or something? Because the world is going to move on without your approval. You can buy gas cars for as long as they’re available.

My guess is you are mostly a city/burbs driver. Ever driven from LA to Phoenix where you are 90 miles between exits? How about through parts of Utah, New Mexico or Texas? Alaskan Highway drive? No so convenient to charge now.

Obviously electric cars are not great for long trips. Most people do not have to drive more than 30 miles per day. I grew up in a rural area and we could reach all the places we needed within 40 miles. Which a car with a 240 mile range can handle. My husband actually works in several sites throughout Maryland and is able to take the electric car to all of them. It has saved us a lot in gas $$$.

And see that's the problem here (and what I suspected). Most people ON THE EAST COAST don't have to drive more than 30 miles a day IF they live your sort of lifestyle. The WEST coast, Middle America, very different. Think outside your own experiences/lifestyles and you might begin to understand why the electric car is not yet a practical alternative for America. Even my very liberal husband says the technology and lifestyle has a long way to go before the technology can become relied-upon for the average individual.

Yes, we understand. That is why electric cars are terribly unpopular in Oregon, Washington and California. If only those Western States had incentives and a charging infrastructure! If only there were hybrid alternatives, which combined the advantage of an electric engine with the ultility of gasoline! If only there existed some kind of service, where people could hire long-range cars for the three times a year they drove to Grandma's, instead of being forced to get 20mpg the entire year just so they could make it from SLC to Needles, CA. If only.

Thank you, light in the wilderness, for exposing tbis dilemma in such sharp relief. Obviously, we can only have electric OR gas-powered vehicles. Obviously, like you, who suffers driving your Ford Flex alone 98% of the time just to be able to ferry the soccer team once a month, we must all drive gas cars all the time, everywhere, so the ranchers in Butte don't feel left out.

So your solution is for everyone to be forced to drive an electric car and hire long-range cars (perhaps they are on a budget and can't afford that expense?)

If I buy a Ford, it's going to be an F-150 or similar, though I'd consider a hybrid truck of any kind. Because, Skippy, I have a business where I need to be able to actually large objects in my vehicle. And your dismissal of the 'ranchers in Butte' shows your disdain for anyone who isn't like you. I'm going to say you are a liberal lawyer, or other type of professional, and most likely a federal worker or government contractor. Furthermore, you probably live in DC or MD, perhaps Arlington.

Your attempt at biting sarcasm also shows me you are unable to consider any other lifestyle than your own as even remotely worth pursuing.

You have massive insecurity issues about your blue collar labor, huh? My point was that there are options. Options for you and options for me. Now, most of your options are pathetic, because you are a mean-spirited, whinging lowlife, but you can't blame cars for that. You should maybe take a hard look to your own garden and get that in order before you keep yammering on and on about liberals like a stuck pig in Deliverance.

You're out of your league and it's killing you inside, isn't it? And not out of your league because of your profession --my family is full of ranchers in places like Butte--ranchers, electricians, policemen, and professors. And my own job is not at all effete. Even you could probably manage to do it.

You're out of your league because you see the world in such stark dichotomy that anyone who doesn't nod and smile and agree with your mewling Constitution-babble is a heretic.

You must be a blast at Thanksgiving.

Master's degree in computing, now entrepreneur. Thank you for playing. LOL.

Serious transference going on here. Throw out a bunch of insults and play victim as if you are being insulted.

So tell me? California? DC? Bethesda? Arlington?

I am the initial pp you were responding to and I own an electric car and I think it is fabulous. It has nothing to do with my politics or my character or my education as it is just a freaking car. It saves us a lot of money. I guess you missed the part where I said that my husband drives all over the state of Maryland. I don’t know why you think that it would not work in the west coast. Not every car is going to meet every need. You can’t buy a compact car if you need a truck. That doesn’t really mean that compact cars don’t work for their intended purpose, or that they will not continue to improve. An electric car does not work if you need to drive longer than its range. That’s it. Or (and this is how I know you don’t know much about electric cars) in areas where it is extremely, extremely cold for much of the year. An electric car has reduced range in extreme cold.

It’s dumb for conservatives to make this political because electric cars are awesome. They will proiferate with or without a subsidy.. How many losing positions do you need to take?

Because gas stations are farther apart in say, the state of Utah or the state of AZ because (wait for it) they are larger than MD. As a matter of fact, 41 states in the union have more total area than the state of MD.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ah, so you were just pretending to be salt of the earth so you could feel put upon and persecuted! Got it. You don't "need" a truck for your "job." You "need" a truck so you can drive to the mountains and feel like a man.

I don't think it works very well, though, or you'd find a hobby. Like a real one. Taxidermy. Archery. Stalking co-eds.

It doesn't matter where I live, sweetie. Stop trying to pretend you're victimized when you've been squealing about libs all over this board for years. We are tired of your shit.

Hard to feel like a man when I’m actually a chick. Ever try to put large furniture in a Leaf?

Glad to know I nailed where you live.

I am not the pp you are responding to but you desperately need to get a life.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It won't matter what stupid, short sighted Trump voters think in regard to fracking, coal and domestic oil production in general soon. Solid state batteries promise 3 times the energy capacity that currently powers most electric cars (ie range of over 400 miles), weather protection from -50 to 150 degrees, non-combustibility, non-corrosive leaching like with liquid batteries, and minutes or seconds of required charging rather than hours. https://news.utexas.edu/2017/02/28/goodenough-introduces-new-battery-technology

Toyota has just noted they'll release a solid state battery car with two years, Volvo said their going all electric by 2019. We'll also start to see short trip autonomous electric driverless airplanes and cars soon. Basically, the writing is on the wall for oil. Of course you'll still see gas car for the next 20 years, but electric tech is ramping up so quickly every manufacturer wants a piece. You idiots who are all about drill baby drill just don't read enough. That's your problem. That and your support for an absolutely inept, toddler with a small hands complex.

That's when you get my buy-in. If I'm driving up to Cape Cod, for instance, I have no desire to spend hours at rest stops charging my car. Even at 15 minute charge per 200 miles now, there would have to be a hell of a large amount of charging stations. Even with no wait to charge, you are adding almost 3/4 hour to my trip, just to charge. I have a truck and can get up to the Cape by only filling the tank once along the way.

Eventually you will go to a charging station to swap your battery out for a charged one, not sit there and charge your car. That’s the model Tesla is working towards at least.

I've heard that but the question is, who's doing it? In NJ, you can't pump your own gas. As a result, the lines are always long at the rest areas and it takes over 1/2 hour in line to get gas, due to slow worker performance. In addition? I'm relying on an attendant to change my battery properly and get back onto the road? Not sure how comfortable I am with that.

Uh, ok? You obviously have reservations about a technology that hasn’t even appeared yet. Are you at a high level at one of these companies or something? Because the world is going to move on without your approval. You can buy gas cars for as long as they’re available.

My guess is you are mostly a city/burbs driver. Ever driven from LA to Phoenix where you are 90 miles between exits? How about through parts of Utah, New Mexico or Texas? Alaskan Highway drive? No so convenient to charge now.

Obviously electric cars are not great for long trips. Most people do not have to drive more than 30 miles per day. I grew up in a rural area and we could reach all the places we needed within 40 miles. Which a car with a 240 mile range can handle. My husband actually works in several sites throughout Maryland and is able to take the electric car to all of them. It has saved us a lot in gas $$$.

And see that's the problem here (and what I suspected). Most people ON THE EAST COAST don't have to drive more than 30 miles a day IF they live your sort of lifestyle. The WEST coast, Middle America, very different. Think outside your own experiences/lifestyles and you might begin to understand why the electric car is not yet a practical alternative for America. Even my very liberal husband says the technology and lifestyle has a long way to go before the technology can become relied-upon for the average individual.

Yes, we understand. That is why electric cars are terribly unpopular in Oregon, Washington and California. If only those Western States had incentives and a charging infrastructure! If only there were hybrid alternatives, which combined the advantage of an electric engine with the ultility of gasoline! If only there existed some kind of service, where people could hire long-range cars for the three times a year they drove to Grandma's, instead of being forced to get 20mpg the entire year just so they could make it from SLC to Needles, CA. If only.

Thank you, light in the wilderness, for exposing tbis dilemma in such sharp relief. Obviously, we can only have electric OR gas-powered vehicles. Obviously, like you, who suffers driving your Ford Flex alone 98% of the time just to be able to ferry the soccer team once a month, we must all drive gas cars all the time, everywhere, so the ranchers in Butte don't feel left out.

So your solution is for everyone to be forced to drive an electric car and hire long-range cars (perhaps they are on a budget and can't afford that expense?)

If I buy a Ford, it's going to be an F-150 or similar, though I'd consider a hybrid truck of any kind. Because, Skippy, I have a business where I need to be able to actually large objects in my vehicle. And your dismissal of the 'ranchers in Butte' shows your disdain for anyone who isn't like you. I'm going to say you are a liberal lawyer, or other type of professional, and most likely a federal worker or government contractor. Furthermore, you probably live in DC or MD, perhaps Arlington.

Your attempt at biting sarcasm also shows me you are unable to consider any other lifestyle than your own as even remotely worth pursuing.

You have massive insecurity issues about your blue collar labor, huh? My point was that there are options. Options for you and options for me. Now, most of your options are pathetic, because you are a mean-spirited, whinging lowlife, but you can't blame cars for that. You should maybe take a hard look to your own garden and get that in order before you keep yammering on and on about liberals like a stuck pig in Deliverance.

You're out of your league and it's killing you inside, isn't it? And not out of your league because of your profession --my family is full of ranchers in places like Butte--ranchers, electricians, policemen, and professors. And my own job is not at all effete. Even you could probably manage to do it.

You're out of your league because you see the world in such stark dichotomy that anyone who doesn't nod and smile and agree with your mewling Constitution-babble is a heretic.

You must be a blast at Thanksgiving.

Master's degree in computing, now entrepreneur. Thank you for playing. LOL.

Serious transference going on here. Throw out a bunch of insults and play victim as if you are being insulted.

So tell me? California? DC? Bethesda? Arlington?

I am the initial pp you were responding to and I own an electric car and I think it is fabulous. It has nothing to do with my politics or my character or my education as it is just a freaking car. It saves us a lot of money. I guess you missed the part where I said that my husband drives all over the state of Maryland. I don’t know why you think that it would not work in the west coast. Not every car is going to meet every need. You can’t buy a compact car if you need a truck. That doesn’t really mean that compact cars don’t work for their intended purpose, or that they will not continue to improve. An electric car does not work if you need to drive longer than its range. That’s it. Or (and this is how I know you don’t know much about electric cars) in areas where it is extremely, extremely cold for much of the year. An electric car has reduced range in extreme cold.

It’s dumb for conservatives to make this political because electric cars are awesome. They will proiferate with or without a subsidy.. How many losing positions do you need to take?

Anonymous wrote:OP, right now we don't need a complete buy in. These cars are still experimental. In 20 years, they will be universal, except in big trucks, so be patient.