Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21%

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

That is misleading because some of these schools include other Wards in their boundaries. In other words, "not in Ward 3 =/= OOB. I know you were specifically responding to the Ward 3 statement, but others reading may not realize that the boundaries of Wilson, Deal, Lafayette (missing for the list), and Murch (until the boundary change, but has Ward 4 students grandfathered), and Oyster Adams include other Wards.

Some of those numbers also seem off -- Key & Mann are about 85% IB (basically all kids not in Ward 3)... But Wilson's feeders includes the Ward 2 kids at Stoddert & Hyde (and much of Eaton is also not in Ward 3), Ward 4 kids Lafayette, (and the current classes at Wilson do not have many IB kids from Mann & Key for instance (that dynamic is changing the future IB/OOB patterns in the coming classes via Hardy) so that lower # shouldn't be that surprising

If you look at the Fact Sheet Appendix that someone posted upthread, you can see the percentage of IB public school students who are using their IB school, and also the percentage of IB vs OOB students at each school.
https://view.officeapps.live.com/op/view.aspx?src=https://dme.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/dme/publication/attachments/SY15-16_Citywide%20School%20Fact%20Sheets%20Appendices_10.14.16.xlsx

For example, for Deal, 78% of the public school students who live IB for Deal are attending Deal. As a whole, Deal is 63% IB, and 37% OOB. 68% of the public school students living IB for Wilson are attending Wilson. As a whole, Wilson is 50% IB, and 50% OOB. For Murch, 88% of the IB public school students attend Murch, yet 39% of Murch is OOB students.

Interestingly, Appendix 2 seems to say that 57% of students in Ward 3 attend private school. That seems off to me, but if you trust it, you can do some math that combines this result with the other tables (at least for schools that do not straddle two or more wards).

Murch is 86% in boundary according to the Principal. http://murchschool.org/prospective-parents/faqs/
Murch is not 39% OOB, unless they are counting the kids who are grandfathered in the boundary change as OOB.

Anonymous wrote:9:28 again. You can use the Appendix data to get a pretty good read on how making OOB access a preference rather than a right might affect the total school population.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21%

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

That is misleading because some of these schools include other Wards in their boundaries. In other words, "not in Ward 3 =/= OOB. I know you were specifically responding to the Ward 3 statement, but others reading may not realize that the boundaries of Wilson, Deal, Lafayette (missing for the list), and Murch (until the boundary change, but has Ward 4 students grandfathered), and Oyster Adams include other Wards.

Some of those numbers also seem off -- Key & Mann are about 85% IB (basically all kids not in Ward 3)... But Wilson's feeders includes the Ward 2 kids at Stoddert & Hyde (and much of Eaton is also not in Ward 3), Ward 4 kids Lafayette, (and the current classes at Wilson do not have many IB kids from Mann & Key for instance (that dynamic is changing the future IB/OOB patterns in the coming classes via Hardy) so that lower # shouldn't be that surprising

If you look at the Fact Sheet Appendix that someone posted upthread, you can see the percentage of IB public school students who are using their IB school, and also the percentage of IB vs OOB students at each school.
https://view.officeapps.live.com/op/view.aspx?src=https://dme.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/dme/publication/attachments/SY15-16_Citywide%20School%20Fact%20Sheets%20Appendices_10.14.16.xlsx

For example, for Deal, 78% of the public school students who live IB for Deal are attending Deal. As a whole, Deal is 63% IB, and 37% OOB. 68% of the public school students living IB for Wilson are attending Wilson. As a whole, Wilson is 50% IB, and 50% OOB. For Murch, 88% of the IB public school students attend Murch, yet 39% of Murch is OOB students.

Interestingly, Appendix 2 seems to say that 57% of students in Ward 3 attend private school. That seems off to me, but if you trust it, you can do some math that combines this result with the other tables (at least for schools that do not straddle two or more wards).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unsustainable to...whom? What's to stop Deal from serving, say, 2,000 students? And to stop Wilson from absorbing more than 2,000? Fire code violations? Health and safety violations? Lack of space for classroom trailers and an addition? Furious in-boundary parents voting their CM out? What? I'd like to know.

If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity.

Which basically shows that in DCPS, capacity decisions are complete politics, and have nothing to do with either facility limitations or educational best practices. DC has a conflicted relationship with the Ward 3 schools. People in the rest of the city hate that good schools are concentrated in Ward 3 --but most of the kids who attend public school in Ward 3 live in the rest of the city. DCPS hates that the OOB process sucks kids out of their neighborhood schools -- but they can't say no to people who want to go OOB.

The situation at Deal is whatever is least politically painful, right now. In 2010 Michelle Rhee could have made OOB-feeder a preference instead of a right, and it would have been politically palatable at that time because it would have been functionally equivalent. And it would still be politically palatable today because nothing would have changed. But changing today is a non-starter because of all the people who have gotten used to having that right.

In short, the capacity of Deal is however many people feel that they have a right to go there.

Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21%

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

That is misleading because some of these schools include other Wards in their boundaries. In other words, "not in Ward 3 =/= OOB. I know you were specifically responding to the Ward 3 statement, but others reading may not realize that the boundaries of Wilson, Deal, Lafayette (missing for the list), and Murch (until the boundary change, but has Ward 4 students grandfathered), and Oyster Adams include other Wards.

PP who posted the stats here:
1. Did you not read where I wrote "They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries."

2. Lafayette isn't missing, it's in Ward 4. Did you not read where I wrote " A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unsustainable to...whom? What's to stop Deal from serving, say, 2,000 students? And to stop Wilson from absorbing more than 2,000? Fire code violations? Health and safety violations? Lack of space for classroom trailers and an addition? Furious in-boundary parents voting their CM out? What? I'd like to know.

If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity.

Which basically shows that in DCPS, capacity decisions are complete politics, and have nothing to do with either facility limitations or educational best practices. DC has a conflicted relationship with the Ward 3 schools. People in the rest of the city hate that good schools are concentrated in Ward 3 --but most of the kids who attend public school in Ward 3 live in the rest of the city. DCPS hates that the OOB process sucks kids out of their neighborhood schools -- but they can't say no to people who want to go OOB.

The situation at Deal is whatever is least politically painful, right now. In 2010 Michelle Rhee could have made OOB-feeder a preference instead of a right, and it would have been politically palatable at that time because it would have been functionally equivalent. And it would still be politically palatable today because nothing would have changed. But changing today is a non-starter because of all the people who have gotten used to having that right.

In short, the capacity of Deal is however many people feel that they have a right to go there.

Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21% Key a

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

That is misleading because some of these schools include other Wards in their boundaries. In other words, "not in Ward 3 =/= OOB. I know you were specifically responding to the Ward 3 statement, but others reading may not realize that the boundaries of Wilson, Deal, Lafayette (missing for the list), and Murch (until the boundary change, but has Ward 4 students grandfathered), and Oyster Adams include other Wards.

Some of those numbers also seem off -- Key & Mann are about 85% IB (basically all kids not in Ward 3)... But Wilson's feeders includes the Ward 2 kids at Stoddert & Hyde (and much of Eaton is also not in Ward 3), Ward 4 kids Lafayette, (and the current classes at Wilson do not have many IB kids from Mann & Key for instance (that dynamic is changing the future IB/OOB patterns in the coming classes via Hardy) so that lower # shouldn't be that surprising

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21%

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

That is misleading because some of these schools include other Wards in their boundaries. In other words, "not in Ward 3 =/= OOB. I know you were specifically responding to the Ward 3 statement, but others reading may not realize that the boundaries of Wilson, Deal, Lafayette (missing for the list), and Murch (until the boundary change, but has Ward 4 students grandfathered), and Oyster Adams include other Wards.

Some of those numbers also seem off -- Key & Mann are about 85% IB (basically all kids not in Ward 3)... But Wilson's feeders includes the Ward 2 kids at Stoddert & Hyde (and much of Eaton is also not in Ward 3), Ward 4 kids Lafayette, (and the current classes at Wilson do not have many IB kids from Mann & Key for instance (that dynamic is changing the future IB/OOB patterns in the coming classes via Hardy) so that lower # shouldn't be that surprising

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unsustainable to...whom? What's to stop Deal from serving, say, 2,000 students? And to stop Wilson from absorbing more than 2,000? Fire code violations? Health and safety violations? Lack of space for classroom trailers and an addition? Furious in-boundary parents voting their CM out? What? I'd like to know.

If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity.

Which basically shows that in DCPS, capacity decisions are complete politics, and have nothing to do with either facility limitations or educational best practices. DC has a conflicted relationship with the Ward 3 schools. People in the rest of the city hate that good schools are concentrated in Ward 3 --but most of the kids who attend public school in Ward 3 live in the rest of the city. DCPS hates that the OOB process sucks kids out of their neighborhood schools -- but they can't say no to people who want to go OOB.

The situation at Deal is whatever is least politically painful, right now. In 2010 Michelle Rhee could have made OOB-feeder a preference instead of a right, and it would have been politically palatable at that time because it would have been functionally equivalent. And it would still be politically palatable today because nothing would have changed. But changing today is a non-starter because of all the people who have gotten used to having that right.

In short, the capacity of Deal is however many people feel that they have a right to go there.

Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21%

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

That is misleading because some of these schools include other Wards in their boundaries. In other words, "not in Ward 3 =/= OOB. I know you were specifically responding to the Ward 3 statement, but others reading may not realize that the boundaries of Wilson, Deal, Lafayette (missing for the list), and Murch (until the boundary change, but has Ward 4 students grandfathered), and Oyster Adams include other Wards.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unsustainable to...whom? What's to stop Deal from serving, say, 2,000 students? And to stop Wilson from absorbing more than 2,000? Fire code violations? Health and safety violations? Lack of space for classroom trailers and an addition? Furious in-boundary parents voting their CM out? What? I'd like to know.

If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity.

Which basically shows that in DCPS, capacity decisions are complete politics, and have nothing to do with either facility limitations or educational best practices. DC has a conflicted relationship with the Ward 3 schools. People in the rest of the city hate that good schools are concentrated in Ward 3 --but most of the kids who attend public school in Ward 3 live in the rest of the city. DCPS hates that the OOB process sucks kids out of their neighborhood schools -- but they can't say no to people who want to go OOB.

The situation at Deal is whatever is least politically painful, right now. In 2010 Michelle Rhee could have made OOB-feeder a preference instead of a right, and it would have been politically palatable at that time because it would have been functionally equivalent. And it would still be politically palatable today because nothing would have changed. But changing today is a non-starter because of all the people who have gotten used to having that right.

In short, the capacity of Deal is however many people feel that they have a right to go there.

Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21%

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

That is misleading because some of these schools include other Wards in their boundaries. In other words, "not in Ward 3 =/= OOB. I know you were specifically responding to the Ward 3 statement, but others reading may not realize that the boundaries of Wilson, Deal, Lafayette (missing for the list), and Murch (until the boundary change, but has Ward 4 students grandfathered), and Oyster Adams include other Wards.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity. ...

Read the footnotes. That's "programmatic capacity," defined as how many students the school can hold based largely on the number of teachers assigned there and the class sizes. It's far different from the building capacity, which is much lower. I suppose if we stuff classrooms in playground trailers, gyms, cafeterias, and every coat closet, we could truly maximize "programmatic capacity."

PP here, and that's kind of the point I was trying to make. "Official" capacity numbers essentially have no basis in reality.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unsustainable to...whom? What's to stop Deal from serving, say, 2,000 students? And to stop Wilson from absorbing more than 2,000? Fire code violations? Health and safety violations? Lack of space for classroom trailers and an addition? Furious in-boundary parents voting their CM out? What? I'd like to know.

If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity.

Which basically shows that in DCPS, capacity decisions are complete politics, and have nothing to do with either facility limitations or educational best practices. DC has a conflicted relationship with the Ward 3 schools. People in the rest of the city hate that good schools are concentrated in Ward 3 --but most of the kids who attend public school in Ward 3 live in the rest of the city. DCPS hates that the OOB process sucks kids out of their neighborhood schools -- but they can't say no to people who want to go OOB.

The situation at Deal is whatever is least politically painful, right now. In 2010 Michelle Rhee could have made OOB-feeder a preference instead of a right, and it would have been politically palatable at that time because it would have been functionally equivalent. And it would still be politically palatable today because nothing would have changed. But changing today is a non-starter because of all the people who have gotten used to having that right.

In short, the capacity of Deal is however many people feel that they have a right to go there.

Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21%

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

That is misleading because some of these schools include other Wards in their boundaries. In other words, "not in Ward 3 =/= OOB. I know you were specifically responding to the Ward 3 statement, but others reading may not realize that the boundaries of Wilson, Deal, Lafayette (missing for the list), and Murch (until the boundary change, but has Ward 4 students grandfathered), and Oyster Adams include other Wards.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unsustainable to...whom? What's to stop Deal from serving, say, 2,000 students? And to stop Wilson from absorbing more than 2,000? Fire code violations? Health and safety violations? Lack of space for classroom trailers and an addition? Furious in-boundary parents voting their CM out? What? I'd like to know.

If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity.

Which basically shows that in DCPS, capacity decisions are complete politics, and have nothing to do with either facility limitations or educational best practices. DC has a conflicted relationship with the Ward 3 schools. People in the rest of the city hate that good schools are concentrated in Ward 3 --but most of the kids who attend public school in Ward 3 live in the rest of the city. DCPS hates that the OOB process sucks kids out of their neighborhood schools -- but they can't say no to people who want to go OOB.

The situation at Deal is whatever is least politically painful, right now. In 2010 Michelle Rhee could have made OOB-feeder a preference instead of a right, and it would have been politically palatable at that time because it would have been functionally equivalent. And it would still be politically palatable today because nothing would have changed. But changing today is a non-starter because of all the people who have gotten used to having that right.

In short, the capacity of Deal is however many people feel that they have a right to go there.

Most of the people that attend school in W3 do not live outside of ward 3.

These are the numbers I got from Mary Cheh's office:

Percent in Ward 3
Deal MS 37%
Eaton ES 32%
Hearst ES 21%
Janney ES 89%
Key ES 93%
Mann ES 94%
Murch ES 77%
Oyster-Adams BS 26%
Stoddert ES 66%
Wilson HS 21%

Overall 48% live in Ward 3. They're not necessarily OOB, many school boundaries cross ward boundaries. A lot of Ward 3 kids go to SWW in Ward 2 or Lafayette in Ward 4.

There are not that many people that live in ward 3 that go to SWS. The important part of the "most" part should be how many public school kids in ward 3 attend school in ward 3. I think that number would be close to 80%

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unsustainable to...whom? What's to stop Deal from serving, say, 2,000 students? And to stop Wilson from absorbing more than 2,000? Fire code violations? Health and safety violations? Lack of space for classroom trailers and an addition? Furious in-boundary parents voting their CM out? What? I'd like to know.

If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity.

Which basically shows that in DCPS, capacity decisions are complete politics, and have nothing to do with either facility limitations or educational best practices. DC has a conflicted relationship with the Ward 3 schools. People in the rest of the city hate that good schools are concentrated in Ward 3 --but most of the kids who attend public school in Ward 3 live in the rest of the city. DCPS hates that the OOB process sucks kids out of their neighborhood schools -- but they can't say no to people who want to go OOB.

The situation at Deal is whatever is least politically painful, right now. In 2010 Michelle Rhee could have made OOB-feeder a preference instead of a right, and it would have been politically palatable at that time because it would have been functionally equivalent. And it would still be politically palatable today because nothing would have changed. But changing today is a non-starter because of all the people who have gotten used to having that right.

In short, the capacity of Deal is however many people feel that they have a right to go there.

Didn't Deal start using trailers this year? That's what I heard from a 6th grade parent.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity. ...

Read the footnotes. That's "programmatic capacity," defined as how many students the school can hold based largely on the number of teachers assigned there and the class sizes. It's far different from the building capacity, which is much lower. I suppose if we stuff classrooms in playground trailers, gyms, cafeterias, and every coat closet, we could truly maximize "programmatic capacity."

Anonymous wrote:If you look at the "Fact Sheet" here: https://dme.dc.gov/node/1198445 (appendix 4) Deal is currently listed as being at 85% of capacity. ...