Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abortion used as a form of birth control is just plain wrong.

Exactly. That's why the pro-life movement has been so supportive of easy access to birth control, to limit the risk of unplanned pregnancies and thus abortion.

Oh, wait...

Easy access to contraception is hardly a factor ...... most pregnancies occur because of sheer irresponsibility.

Bingo. Abortion rights are primarily about allowing women to live promiscuously, have no-strings-attached sex, and not suffer any consequences whatsoever. Eat, pray, love, etc

See, anti-abortion freaks are all about controlling women's sex lives. That is what it comes down to. Perverts.

Actually, I am pro-choice but I can tell you categorically that many abortions are the result of outright irresponsibility and the attitude that if pregnancy results then abortion is a ready remedy. It is downright immoral to abort just because a couple were not willing to take steps to prevent pregnancy. It has nothing to do with controlling a woman's sex life - it has to do with being responsible before having sex.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pregnancy is such an inconvenience! So just commit murder instead?

I had a friend die because of pregnancy complications, leaving behind a bereft husband an a couple of kids. Knew another woman who committed suicide 3 days after giving birth because her hormones were so out of whack and she was delusional. Another friend experienced severe post-partum depression that destroyed her marriage. I myself had to do bed rest for months because of a horrid pregnancy -- how many jobs out there will allow that and pay the pregnant woman her salary and then allow her to take family leave and come back to her job? I've known women who have cracked tailbones giving birth, who got gestational diabetes that then later on turned into full blown diabetes, who had terrible sciatica that incapacitated them even after birth, who vomited every day for weeks and nearly had to be hospitalized, who lost jobs because of pregnancy. And almost no woman who has given birth ever gets her unaltered pre-pregnancy body back.

So FU to a poster who has either never experienced pregnancy or had a difficult one, and has never had the fear of wondering who is going to pay for doctor's visits and child care, for maternity clothes and post-partum clothes for an altered body. You've clearly never had to worry about not having any maternity leave, or how to pay for an extra mouth to feed. And you've probably never done a thing to help women in such situations.

So just do murder?

Do you believe the death penalty is also murder?

I think people need to be really clear about the words they're using.

There are many kinds of killings. The law distinguishes between them. There is murder, of varying degrees. There is manslaughter. There are killings that are justified by self-defense, excused due to mental defect. People are removed from life support for various reasons. The state executes people for certain crimes and decides which crimes meet the standard for that punishment. Soldiers kill in battle and are only tried for war crimes under certain circumstances. Human beings kill animals with impunity for nutrition and sport.

If you are a person with an absolutist view of when killing becomes murder, I hope that you are a vegan anti-war anti-capital punishment person who advocates for the same punishment for any situation in which something dies. Even the distinction between killing a human animal and a non-human animal involves a prioritization of which life has more valuable.

The viability threshold is a terrible standard, though. Bioethics is complicated and doesn't fit nicely onto a signboard next to a picture of a dead baby. I used to be strongly against late abortions, but as I learned more, I learned what the PPs are saying - which is that the few dozen women who seek the procedure at all are doing so because there is something catastrophically wrong with the pregnancy. I reject the idea that women are getting abortions cavalierly in general, but in the case of women who get abortions after 20 weeks, I have never - not ONE TIME - seen or heard about a woman who simply changes her mind about being pregnant at that point. 100% of the cases I've read have been people who receive catastrophically bad genetic news at 20 weeks or who have been diagnosed with rapidly-progressing terminal illnesses. Those families' tragedies should not be politicized in any way. Compassionate conservatives should be nothing but supportive of those families making decisions about what to do in peace and helping to provide them the support they need to do so.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abortion used as a form of birth control is just plain wrong.

Exactly. That's why the pro-life movement has been so supportive of easy access to birth control, to limit the risk of unplanned pregnancies and thus abortion.

Oh, wait...

Easy access to contraception is hardly a factor ...... most pregnancies occur because of sheer irresponsibility.

Bingo. Abortion rights are primarily about allowing women to live promiscuously, have no-strings-attached sex, and not suffer any consequences whatsoever. Eat, pray, love, etc

See, anti-abortion freaks are all about controlling women's sex lives. That is what it comes down to. Perverts.

No, defending the inmocent is what pro-lifers are about. The above is what pro-choicers really care about.

And what about the innocent lives of women who are facing horrible, unwanted, or doomed pregnancies? Pro-lifers DGAF about children. Otherwise there would be no child living in poverty in this country.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is wrong with letting each state decide whether abortion should be legal in their state?

because it's a fundamental, federal, constitutional right.

are you aware of the definition of "fundamental"?

Are you going to whip out your dictionary again?

that wasn't me, but apparently you think an abortion is a "fundamental" right. And you would be at odds with the meaning of the term "fundamental".

Control over your own body is a right. Abortion falls under that the same as prescription drugs, surgery, weight loss, etc. The government should no more be able to dictate whether you can end a pregnancy than it should be able to tell you if you can take Synthroid.

To what degree should you be allowed to "control" your little children?

CELLS ARE NOT CHILDREN. Do you even realize that the vast majority of abortions take place when the fetal tissue is weeks old? Not even identifiable as humanoid? Nobody aborts third trimester fetuses unless they are genetically incompatible with life or the mother faces death. It's literally not done. Anywhere in this country.

It's wrong to kill children. Fetal cell tissue is not a child. That's how I feel about that and no amount of religious hoodoo will ever change that opinion. Nor will I ever think that YOUR religious beliefs dictate what I or any other woman does with her body. Ever.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abortion used as a form of birth control is just plain wrong.

Exactly. That's why the pro-life movement has been so supportive of easy access to birth control, to limit the risk of unplanned pregnancies and thus abortion.

Oh, wait...

Easy access to contraception is hardly a factor ...... most pregnancies occur because of sheer irresponsibility.

Bingo. Abortion rights are primarily about allowing women to live promiscuously, have no-strings-attached sex, and not suffer any consequences whatsoever. Eat, pray, love, etc

See, anti-abortion freaks are all about controlling women's sex lives. That is what it comes down to. Perverts.

No, defending the inmocent is what pro-lifers are about. The above is what pro-choicers really care about.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pregnancy is such an inconvenience! So just commit murder instead?

I had a friend die because of pregnancy complications, leaving behind a bereft husband an a couple of kids. Knew another woman who committed suicide 3 days after giving birth because her hormones were so out of whack and she was delusional. Another friend experienced severe post-partum depression that destroyed her marriage. I myself had to do bed rest for months because of a horrid pregnancy -- how many jobs out there will allow that and pay the pregnant woman her salary and then allow her to take family leave and come back to her job? I've known women who have cracked tailbones giving birth, who got gestational diabetes that then later on turned into full blown diabetes, who had terrible sciatica that incapacitated them even after birth, who vomited every day for weeks and nearly had to be hospitalized, who lost jobs because of pregnancy. And almost no woman who has given birth ever gets her unaltered pre-pregnancy body back.

So FU to a poster who has either never experienced pregnancy or had a difficult one, and has never had the fear of wondering who is going to pay for doctor's visits and child care, for maternity clothes and post-partum clothes for an altered body. You've clearly never had to worry about not having any maternity leave, or how to pay for an extra mouth to feed. And you've probably never done a thing to help women in such situations.

So just do murder?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abortion used as a form of birth control is just plain wrong.

Exactly. That's why the pro-life movement has been so supportive of easy access to birth control, to limit the risk of unplanned pregnancies and thus abortion.

Oh, wait...

Easy access to contraception is hardly a factor ...... most pregnancies occur because of sheer irresponsibility.

Bingo. Abortion rights are primarily about allowing women to live promiscuously, have no-strings-attached sex, and not suffer any consequences whatsoever. Eat, pray, love, etc

See, anti-abortion freaks are all about controlling women's sex lives. That is what it comes down to. Perverts.

Anonymous wrote:Pregnancy is such an inconvenience! So just commit murder instead?

I had a friend die because of pregnancy complications, leaving behind a bereft husband an a couple of kids. Knew another woman who committed suicide 3 days after giving birth because her hormones were so out of whack and she was delusional. Another friend experienced severe post-partum depression that destroyed her marriage. I myself had to do bed rest for months because of a horrid pregnancy -- how many jobs out there will allow that and pay the pregnant woman her salary and then allow her to take family leave and come back to her job? I've known women who have cracked tailbones giving birth, who got gestational diabetes that then later on turned into full blown diabetes, who had terrible sciatica that incapacitated them even after birth, who vomited every day for weeks and nearly had to be hospitalized, who lost jobs because of pregnancy. And almost no woman who has given birth ever gets her unaltered pre-pregnancy body back.

So FU to a poster who has either never experienced pregnancy or had a difficult one, and has never had the fear of wondering who is going to pay for doctor's visits and child care, for maternity clothes and post-partum clothes for an altered body. You've clearly never had to worry about not having any maternity leave, or how to pay for an extra mouth to feed. And you've probably never done a thing to help women in such situations.

Anonymous wrote:I find it interesting that Camille Paglia (of all people: a flamboyantly liberal lesbian) has long claimed liberals are dishonest in stating abortion is anything other than murder. To pretend it isn't murder belittles the murder of a fetus in the course of a crime.

Obviously abortion is murder, we're just deciding what someone gets to prioritize.

So here is why I disagree. I miscarried a baby at 7 weeks. It was sad, but I moved on with my life. My good friend from high school lost her 2 year old. Can't really compare the loss of life of those two events.

I have an IUD - is it murder because it may prevent a fertilized egg from implanting? You know, if you think so, I'm fine with that. Really.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abortion used as a form of birth control is just plain wrong.

Exactly. That's why the pro-life movement has been so supportive of easy access to birth control, to limit the risk of unplanned pregnancies and thus abortion.

Oh, wait...

Easy access to contraception is hardly a factor ...... most pregnancies occur because of sheer irresponsibility.

Bingo. Abortion rights are primarily about allowing women to live promiscuously, have no-strings-attached sex, and not suffer any consequences whatsoever. Eat, pray, love, etc

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is wrong with letting each state decide whether abortion should be legal in their state?

because it's a fundamental, federal, constitutional right.

are you aware of the definition of "fundamental"?

Are you going to whip out your dictionary again?

that wasn't me, but apparently you think an abortion is a "fundamental" right. And you would be at odds with the meaning of the term "fundamental".

Control over your own body is a right. Abortion falls under that the same as prescription drugs, surgery, weight loss, etc. The government should no more be able to dictate whether you can end a pregnancy than it should be able to tell you if you can take Synthroid.

To what degree should you be allowed to "control" your little children?

Women are and should be allowed to drink while pregnant, smoke, drive a car, etc. Women are allowed to eat deli meat, hot dogs, raw eggs, too.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is wrong with letting each state decide whether abortion should be legal in their state?

because it's a fundamental, federal, constitutional right.

are you aware of the definition of "fundamental"?

Are you going to whip out your dictionary again?

that wasn't me, but apparently you think an abortion is a "fundamental" right. And you would be at odds with the meaning of the term "fundamental".

Control over your own body is a right. Abortion falls under that the same as prescription drugs, surgery, weight loss, etc. The government should no more be able to dictate whether you can end a pregnancy than it should be able to tell you if you can take Synthroid.

To what degree should you be allowed to "control" your little children?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abortion used as a form of birth control is just plain wrong.

Exactly. That's why the pro-life movement has been so supportive of easy access to birth control, to limit the risk of unplanned pregnancies and thus abortion.

Oh, wait...

Easy access to contraception is hardly a factor ...... most pregnancies occur because of sheer irresponsibility.

Anonymous wrote:Pregnancy is such an inconvenience! So just commit murder instead?

You need to look up the legal definition of murder before you use it. It's not at all applicable in any sense. You also need to pray like hell you never have a failure of birth control and end up pregnant. Or that your daughters get raped and end up pregnant. This is not an "other people" issue. This DOES impact you in some way.