Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not very knowledgeable about the spirituality of African tribes, but I'm now inspired to learn more about the topic to see if there are any similarities between them and Wiccan beliefs!

You say that as though "Wiccan beliefs" are standardized and codified somehow. This is especially odd as your last statement made it clear that there is no real reference material for "Wicca", unless you're a part of a particular lineage/tradition.

With exceptions made for initiatory traditions (which are few, and dying), most "Wicca" seems an amalgamation of appropriated beliefs, mixing shamanism, druidry, "actual witchcraft" (but only the "nice" parts), etc.

There are widely available texts, though, that many in the community read and follow. Books by Scott Cunningham, Scott Farrar, Margot Adler, Raymond Buckland, Silver Ravenwolf, Pat Telesco, Dana Eilers, etc. are all books that in broad circulation and are influential. Most Wiccans have read some or all of these. Most Wiccans also are well read in traditional mythology and traditional pagan religion and traditional folk magic.

It is an amalgamation. It is neo-paganism, not traditional paganism. Neo-pagan religion is no less valid a form of paganism than Protestant Christianity is a form of Christianity.

I'm really interested in this. I've been thinking a lot about the connection between the winter solstice that just happened, the full moon last night and how it all syncs up with the new year. Grateful I found this post.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where you lose me, OP, is when you start getting into being a witch. With all due respect, that's nutty.

Why is it nuttier to call oneself a "witch" than it is to call oneself a "priest"? (Some) Priests believe in demons, in exorcism, in bread and wine literally becoming flesh and blood, in a virgin birth and the resurrection of a dead body. And the power of prayer.

Why is it any weirder to light a candle, draw an imaginary circle around yourself, and make your own "Prayer" (spell casting) for whatever it is you are seeking?

If you are going to judge wiccans as nutty, I hope you take the same stance with all religions.

I'm not Catholic, so don't agree with some of the things you mention either.

So then, are you saying that it *is* equally nutty for Catholics to say, believe in a virgin birth or transubstantiation?

If you label people nutty with equaly judginess, I am cool with that. Just don't single Wiccans out as crazier than the rest.

Hey, did you hear about the Hasidim who caused a ruckus on a plane last week because their Sincerely held religious belief indicates they can't sit next to ladies on a plane???

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where you lose me, OP, is when you start getting into being a witch. With all due respect, that's nutty.

Why is it nuttier to call oneself a "witch" than it is to call oneself a "priest"? (Some) Priests believe in demons, in exorcism, in bread and wine literally becoming flesh and blood, in a virgin birth and the resurrection of a dead body. And the power of prayer.

Why is it any weirder to light a candle, draw an imaginary circle around yourself, and make your own "Prayer" (spell casting) for whatever it is you are seeking?

If you are going to judge wiccans as nutty, I hope you take the same stance with all religions.

I'm not Catholic, so don't agree with some of the things you mention either.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not very knowledgeable about the spirituality of African tribes, but I'm now inspired to learn more about the topic to see if there are any similarities between them and Wiccan beliefs!

You say that as though "Wiccan beliefs" are standardized and codified somehow. This is especially odd as your last statement made it clear that there is no real reference material for "Wicca", unless you're a part of a particular lineage/tradition.

With exceptions made for initiatory traditions (which are few, and dying), most "Wicca" seems an amalgamation of appropriated beliefs, mixing shamanism, druidry, "actual witchcraft" (but only the "nice" parts), etc.

You're absolutely correct and I apologize for not being clearer. I should have said that I'm interested to learn if there are any similarities between my Wiccan beliefs and those of African tribes.

I did a lot of reading today and am now enthralled with the West African Vodun, a religion practiced by the Ewe people. It is the precursor to the Voodoo that we see in New Orleans and other creole communities. (I apologize if any of that was insensitively worded and please call me out on it and correct me!)

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not very knowledgeable about the spirituality of African tribes, but I'm now inspired to learn more about the topic to see if there are any similarities between them and Wiccan beliefs!

You say that as though "Wiccan beliefs" are standardized and codified somehow. This is especially odd as your last statement made it clear that there is no real reference material for "Wicca", unless you're a part of a particular lineage/tradition.

With exceptions made for initiatory traditions (which are few, and dying), most "Wicca" seems an amalgamation of appropriated beliefs, mixing shamanism, druidry, "actual witchcraft" (but only the "nice" parts), etc.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How does Wiccan theology get transmitted, and are there holy books? According to Wikipedia, a British man named Gerald Gardner pulled it together in 1954. It seems like there would be more, though. Are there scriptures or prophets that relate the natures of the two gods? Where do the priest/esses get their knowledge?

The basic foundation of the faith has been passed down since ancient times. Threads of our faith can be seen woven into into the lives of Ancient Greeks or Romans, Vikings, and Celts. We've learned from them and the stories and knowledge have survived through each generation. The Poetic Edda of Iceland dictates their beliefs of the gods, and the Irish Book of Invasions is a primary resource from the Celts.

Gerald Gardner was (and I'm parring the history down to its very core here) responsible for the revival of this religious tradition and essentially created modern day neo-paganism.

There's no real sacred text in earth based religions, but there are numerous authors out there recording our beliefs. Scott Cunningham is a modern day author who has written what many consider to be The Best books on Wicca. Practicers get their knowledge from study of these books or get knowledge directly from others.

I forgot to mention that some tenants of earth based religions exist outside of these places, as well. The spirituality of many American Indians is similar, and we share some of the same beliefs as Shinto religion of Japan.

I'm not very knowledgeable about the spirituality of African tribes, but I'm now inspired to learn more about the topic to see if there are any similarities between them and Wiccan beliefs!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How does Wiccan theology get transmitted, and are there holy books? According to Wikipedia, a British man named Gerald Gardner pulled it together in 1954. It seems like there would be more, though. Are there scriptures or prophets that relate the natures of the two gods? Where do the priest/esses get their knowledge?

Gardnerian Wicca was passed from practitioner to practitioner, in a lineage tradition. Modern American "Wicca" requires no initiation, no study, no nothing beyond declaring oneself a witch and casting spells (according to OP). This is a large part of the reason it is often viewed as the playground for noobs or non-serious "fluffy bunny" types, from both inside and outside the greater Pagan community.

This is definitely an unfortunate true statement. There are many practicers (and the general trend for these folks is that they're teenage girls) who get into the religion to be different, unique, or to rebel. They may not take the practice completely seriously or take the steps to gain the knowledge necessary to understand what the religion is truly about.

The aspect of magick is luring to some as they feel it gives them a sense of power and control.

But please don't let these people taint your view of the entire religion. We have these fluffy bunnies, yes, but we also have amazing people who are doing great things for the world.

Anonymous wrote:How does Wiccan theology get transmitted, and are there holy books? According to Wikipedia, a British man named Gerald Gardner pulled it together in 1954. It seems like there would be more, though. Are there scriptures or prophets that relate the natures of the two gods? Where do the priest/esses get their knowledge?

The basic foundation of the faith has been passed down since ancient times. Threads of our faith can be seen woven into into the lives of Ancient Greeks or Romans, Vikings, and Celts. We've learned from them and the stories and knowledge have survived through each generation. The Poetic Edda of Iceland dictates their beliefs of the gods, and the Irish Book of Invasions is a primary resource from the Celts.

Gerald Gardner was (and I'm parring the history down to its very core here) responsible for the revival of this religious tradition and essentially created modern day neo-paganism.

There's no real sacred text in earth based religions, but there are numerous authors out there recording our beliefs. Scott Cunningham is a modern day author who has written what many consider to be The Best books on Wicca. Practicers get their knowledge from study of these books or get knowledge directly from others.

Anonymous wrote:How does Wiccan theology get transmitted, and are there holy books? According to Wikipedia, a British man named Gerald Gardner pulled it together in 1954. It seems like there would be more, though. Are there scriptures or prophets that relate the natures of the two gods? Where do the priest/esses get their knowledge?

Gardnerian Wicca was passed from practitioner to practitioner, in a lineage tradition. Modern American "Wicca" requires no initiation, no study, no nothing beyond declaring oneself a witch and casting spells (according to OP). This is a large part of the reason it is often viewed as the playground for noobs or non-serious "fluffy bunny" types, from both inside and outside the greater Pagan community.

How does Wiccan theology get transmitted, and are there holy books? According to Wikipedia, a British man named Gerald Gardner pulled it together in 1954. It seems like there would be more, though. Are there scriptures or prophets that relate the natures of the two gods? Where do the priest/esses get their knowledge?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where you lose me, OP, is when you start getting into being a witch. With all due respect, that's nutty.

Why is it nuttier to call oneself a "witch" than it is to call oneself a "priest"? (Some) Priests believe in demons, in exorcism, in bread and wine literally becoming flesh and blood, in a virgin birth and the resurrection of a dead body. And the power of prayer.

Why is it any weirder to light a candle, draw an imaginary circle around yourself, and make your own "Prayer" (spell casting) for whatever it is you are seeking?

If you are going to judge wiccans as nutty, I hope you take the same stance with all religions.

PP who has been responding about comparative religion stuff who has a pagan family member here.

I think that the reason people find Wicca to be creepy or nutty or far fetched or whatever is that the popular portrayals are very sensationalized. Many Wiccans were really, really upset about the portrayal of magick and witches in American Horror Story: Coven. The Craft (from the 90s) furthered the mentally unstable teenager aspect of it. I'm sure that the OP or other Wiccans commenting on this thread could point to positive portrayals of their faith in some form of media, somewhere.

I would be interested to hear from the posters suggesting that Wicca is crazy, or that magical workings are weird, who are dismissive of her spiritual practice as not making any sense or who generally have a hard time understanding this particular spiritual practice - what is your faith tradition? How do you express those beliefs? How would you explain them to someone who had never heard of them before?

I think that what we have going on is a situation where people who are part of the majority (mainstream American culture, which largely adheres to some form of Christianity or Judaism) have not had to spend a lot of time examining their beliefs for things like confusing inconsistencies or considered the ways in which their rituals seem weird or gross to non-practitioners.

My own background: I was not raised with any religion. My mom is Episcopalian. Her husband is pagan. My dad is a literature professor who has a deep attachment to Thoreau and the other transcendentalists, so the connection with nature is there. I've also read a lot of history and mythology, so I don't find the OP's practice or beliefs to be outlandish. I don't find her rituals to be any stranger than the prayer circles that my Baptist friend organized when another friend delivered a premature baby who was not expected to survive. I think it's great that the OP has taken the time to spell out her beliefs, and I strongly suspect that those beliefs sound as basic to her (a practitioner) as would the explanations of a Catholic for the actions and symbolism behind taking communion, being baptized, etc. It's just that for most people, those rituals are more familiar than a lady sitting at a table, lighting candles and incense and saying unfamiliar words.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where you lose me, OP, is when you start getting into being a witch. With all due respect, that's nutty.

Why is it nuttier to call oneself a "witch" than it is to call oneself a "priest"? (Some) Priests believe in demons, in exorcism, in bread and wine literally becoming flesh and blood, in a virgin birth and the resurrection of a dead body. And the power of prayer.

Why is it any weirder to light a candle, draw an imaginary circle around yourself, and make your own "Prayer" (spell casting) for whatever it is you are seeking?

If you are going to judge wiccans as nutty, I hope you take the same stance with all religions.

+1000

Anonymous wrote:Where you lose me, OP, is when you start getting into being a witch. With all due respect, that's nutty.

Why is it nuttier to call oneself a "witch" than it is to call oneself a "priest"? (Some) Priests believe in demons, in exorcism, in bread and wine literally becoming flesh and blood, in a virgin birth and the resurrection of a dead body. And the power of prayer.

Why is it any weirder to light a candle, draw an imaginary circle around yourself, and make your own "Prayer" (spell casting) for whatever it is you are seeking?

If you are going to judge wiccans as nutty, I hope you take the same stance with all religions.

Anonymous wrote:The only wiccan I know got committed to a mental institute and was stripped of her parental rights

Correlation does not equal causation. I'm sorry for your friend and her children but do not think that her religion is what caused her mental illness.