Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.

Yawn. That's because there wasn't a privileged loud-mouth person like McLean mom, who thinks she pays more in taxes than anyone else. (She probably thinks she's somehow entitled to more of the roads because she pays more in gas tax to drive her SUV.) Every time she pops up, I am more convinced that McLean HS needs to be bulldozed, and we'd be throwing more of McLean mom's precious tax dollars away on a dumpster fire.

FWIW I have VOTED against some of the CIPs.

Are you a school board member? They’re the ones who vote in the CIP.

We are asked if we want to fund Capitol improvements, so we do have some say.

The Capitol is in Washington, D.C.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.

Yawn. That's because there wasn't a privileged loud-mouth person like McLean mom, who thinks she pays more in taxes than anyone else. (She probably thinks she's somehow entitled to more of the roads because she pays more in gas tax to drive her SUV.) Every time she pops up, I am more convinced that McLean HS needs to be bulldozed, and we'd be throwing more of McLean mom's precious tax dollars away on a dumpster fire.

FWIW I have VOTED against some of the CIPs.

Are you a school board member? They’re the ones who vote in the CIP.

We are asked if we want to fund Capitol improvements, so we do have some say.

The Capitol is in Washington, D.C.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.

Yawn. That's because there wasn't a privileged loud-mouth person like McLean mom, who thinks she pays more in taxes than anyone else. (She probably thinks she's somehow entitled to more of the roads because she pays more in gas tax to drive her SUV.) Every time she pops up, I am more convinced that McLean HS needs to be bulldozed, and we'd be throwing more of McLean mom's precious tax dollars away on a dumpster fire.

FWIW I have VOTED against some of the CIPs.

Are you a school board member? They’re the ones who vote in the CIP.

We are asked if we want to fund Capitol improvements, so we do have some say.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

I'm suggesting that a new high school in Tysons should be built to accommodate influx of new students and McLean HS. Or -- temporarily accommodate the students in a facility there while McLean HS is knocked down and rebuilt. Wherever it goes, it should be built further from Langley HS than McLean HS is now. And if there is no space to build a new school there, I still say McLean HS should be torn down rather than taped back together. Put the kids in other nearby schools and adjust the overflows at those schools as needed.

NO EXPANSION OR RENOVATION at McLean HS will satisfy McLean mom or others. At best they'll be OK with it for a couple years, and then start whining about their kids (who are doing fine BTW despite the building collapsing around them).

Those are not acceptable alternatives. There isn’t space in Tysons for a traditional high school or for adequate temporary space.

They can expand and renovate McLean like other high schools that have been or are being expanded and renovated (Langley, Falls Church, etc.)

Or, as PP suggested, they can try something different and start building new on the existing fields and gradually moving kids into the new space as it’s completed, with fields reconstructed later.

Or, if that’s not feasible and they still think it’s more efficient to tear down and rebuild, they could do split shifts with Langley for a few years, where Langley and McLean kids alternate attending Langley in the morning vs afternoon each quarter until McLean has been rebuilt.

Sticking kids in an office building because you think Langley is “too close,” however, is a non-starter. The current location is fine - and more convenient to more kids than either Langley or something in the middle of Tysons.

Tear down McLean and permanently relocate the kids. Build a new high school out west as planned, shuffle kids as needed. Done.

People in the western part of the county are still complaining about the decision to transfer land to the Saudis. Tearing down a thriving high school like McLean in a central, accessible location further east makes no sense.

McLean mom says the building and TEACHERS(!) are crappy. How can students thrive there? Impossible!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.

Yawn. That's because there wasn't a privileged loud-mouth person like McLean mom, who thinks she pays more in taxes than anyone else. (She probably thinks she's somehow entitled to more of the roads because she pays more in gas tax to drive her SUV.) Every time she pops up, I am more convinced that McLean HS needs to be bulldozed, and we'd be throwing more of McLean mom's precious tax dollars away on a dumpster fire.

FWIW I have VOTED against some of the CIPs.

Are you a school board member? They’re the ones who vote in the CIP.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

I'm suggesting that a new high school in Tysons should be built to accommodate influx of new students and McLean HS. Or -- temporarily accommodate the students in a facility there while McLean HS is knocked down and rebuilt. Wherever it goes, it should be built further from Langley HS than McLean HS is now. And if there is no space to build a new school there, I still say McLean HS should be torn down rather than taped back together. Put the kids in other nearby schools and adjust the overflows at those schools as needed.

NO EXPANSION OR RENOVATION at McLean HS will satisfy McLean mom or others. At best they'll be OK with it for a couple years, and then start whining about their kids (who are doing fine BTW despite the building collapsing around them).

Those are not acceptable alternatives. There isn’t space in Tysons for a traditional high school or for adequate temporary space.

They can expand and renovate McLean like other high schools that have been or are being expanded and renovated (Langley, Falls Church, etc.)

Or, as PP suggested, they can try something different and start building new on the existing fields and gradually moving kids into the new space as it’s completed, with fields reconstructed later.

Or, if that’s not feasible and they still think it’s more efficient to tear down and rebuild, they could do split shifts with Langley for a few years, where Langley and McLean kids alternate attending Langley in the morning vs afternoon each quarter until McLean has been rebuilt.

Sticking kids in an office building because you think Langley is “too close,” however, is a non-starter. The current location is fine - and more convenient to more kids than either Langley or something in the middle of Tysons.

Tear down McLean and permanently relocate the kids. Build a new high school out west as planned, shuffle kids as needed. Done.

People in the western part of the county are still complaining about the decision to transfer land to the Saudis. Tearing down a thriving high school like McLean in a central, accessible location further east makes no sense.

Anonymous wrote:Zero sympathy here. How about you move to a <3/10 pyramid and still have to pay significantly high taxes. FCPS is failing me, not you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.

Yawn. That's because there wasn't a privileged loud-mouth person like McLean mom, who thinks she pays more in taxes than anyone else. (She probably thinks she's somehow entitled to more of the roads because she pays more in gas tax to drive her SUV.) Every time she pops up, I am more convinced that McLean HS needs to be bulldozed, and we'd be throwing more of McLean mom's precious tax dollars away on a dumpster fire.

FWIW I have VOTED against some of the CIPs.

Yes, the tax burden whining gets old for the rest of us - we all pay the same rate in Fairfax County (other than some incorporated towns) - it is your choice to purchase a more expensive home. This MHS debate has been going on forever - yes, they need a renovation and yes, they are overcrowded - so why not move? Sell your overpriced home, buy something bigger and invest in all the upgrades you want in a district like FCHS which is undergoing a complete renovation that will be gorgeous and your high SES child will be valued for academic achievement and walk on to many sports or activities. The politicians have no incentive to fix your MHS problem - because you keep buying in that district - and probably never will.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.

Yawn. That's because there wasn't a privileged loud-mouth person like McLean mom, who thinks she pays more in taxes than anyone else. (She probably thinks she's somehow entitled to more of the roads because she pays more in gas tax to drive her SUV.) Every time she pops up, I am more convinced that McLean HS needs to be bulldozed, and we'd be throwing more of McLean mom's precious tax dollars away on a dumpster fire.

FWIW I have VOTED against some of the CIPs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.

Yawn. That's because there wasn't a privileged loud-mouth person like McLean mom, who thinks she pays more in taxes than anyone else. (She probably thinks she's somehow entitled to more of the roads because she pays more in gas tax to drive her SUV.) Every time she pops up, I am more convinced that McLean HS needs to be bulldozed, and we'd be throwing more of McLean mom's precious tax dollars away on a dumpster fire.

FWIW I have VOTED against some of the CIPs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.

Yawn. That's because there wasn't a privileged loud-mouth person like McLean mom, who thinks she pays more in taxes than anyone else. (She probably thinks she's somehow entitled to more of the roads because she pays more in gas tax to drive her SUV.) Every time she pops up, I am more convinced that McLean HS needs to be bulldozed, and we'd be throwing more of McLean mom's precious tax dollars away on a dumpster fire.

FWIW I have VOTED against some of the CIPs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To prove that the learning that goes in inside the building is not dependent upon the outside aesthetics? Maybe it is a good lesson for kids who are used to manicured lawns?

Everyone knows that already. McLean is the top-ranked neighborhood high school in Virginia in 2023 per US News.

Even so, there comes a time when you need to treat schools equitably in terms of capital investment, unless your goal is simply to degrade the system.

No, see the public schools were created to be the great equalizer of our society. Those kids get a top notch education, just the building sucks. Makes sense because they should see how all the other kids actually live to give them any hope of being empathetic and understanding adults. This way, they understand that not everything in life is handed to them and is beautiful, sometimes you shouldn’t judge a book by a cover.

Of course, you as an adult who “fought your way” from the streets of the inner city and “pulled yourself by your bootstraps” to the blissful streets of McLean believe YOUR kid needs the best, but maybe they are getting more than you think. You just disagree that the lesson is important because you are blinded by the capitalistic idea that “top of the line and state of the art facility” is the most important thing.

I hope you got Chat GPT to generate this nonsense.

McLean parents haven’t asked for their school to be “top of the line.” We know we’d never get that from FCPS. We’ve asked for an addition that would bring our permanent seats in line with the county average. Not a lot to ask since the enrollment is above-average and the school is among the top two (out of 25 high schools) projected to see the most future growth in residential development (and almost entirely from multi-family housing). And, then, eventually for a renovation - since the renovation the school got in the early 00s was cut-rate compared to more recent school renovations.

Tysons development and projected new students is even more reason not to band aid the current McLean HS. If anything, the projected growth should spawn a completely new HS.

Where?

Tysons has space for an elementary school. No consensus will ever form that a vertical HS without typical HS amenities should be built in Tysons - APS considered something like that and got nowhere.

And even if one were built, Tysons alone wouldn’t have enough kids to support a stand-alone high school, so you’d have to include Langley neighborhoods like McLean Hamlet and McLean neighborhoods like Seneca Ridge that would put up a fuss.

If you’re suggesting a new HS in western Fairfax should be built, that’s been an item for decades, yet is apparently becoming less, not more, likely with the expansions of Oakton, Herndon, and now Centreville.

I guess you could tear down existing McLean HS and build a new school there, since the land exists and the location is good. But then you’re talking about serious overcrowding and/or split shifts at Langley, Marshall and/or Falls Church to handle the 2400 displaced McLean kids for 3-4 years.

This is why an addition to McLean followed by a renovation in due course will continue to be the most practical option - if only we had a School Board that paid attention to such matters.

FCPS could phase a construction project at McLean for a brand new HS building (cheaper than renovation). Students would use the portions of the building not yet demolished, and the phase 1 portion of the newly constructed school. This is how most other schools districts do rebuilds.

The loss of field space for construction would be temporary. Once construction is complete, then relocated fields can be reconstructed.

That is a different model than FCPS has generally followed. It may be similar to what was done when the new Glasgow MS was built. I guess you’d end up building on top of existing fields, and then building new fields on top of razed classrooms.

If it’s feasible and expands capacity, sure, why not.

APS, MCPS, and school districts all over the country do this phased approach with brand new buildings on the former parking lots and fields. New builds are always cheaper than costly renovations. FCPS’s focus on more expensive renovations of mediocre 50s and 60s era school buildings is unusual. (The only truly historic high school buildings were the original Mount Vernon and Fairfax high schools and FCPS gave those properties up decades ago when renovations were deemed to be too expensive.)

This. And if we can’t build on site, relocate the kids permanently. Renovating McLean mom’s dump is a tiny bandaid on a much larger problem.

Rebuild / relocate / maintain, but do not renovate.

Didn’t hear you objecting to the ongoing renovation and expansion of Falls Church HS. Or others before it.